Back to the Supercharge or M4 Poll We Go!

[Ezio]

Originally Posted by Alex07M3

I understand that the S55 is based on the N55 but would'nt it makes sens that this one would be able to take/hold more boost then it's weaker version, the N55!?

A bit in the same way that a 1.8T from a TT225 can take more boost then a 1.8T from a GTI even if it's basicaly the same engine minus a couple of parts!

Again, pardon my ignorance but I just find it weird that S55 would'nt be able to run a couple more pounds of boost then what it runs stock! That would be the first turbo engine that I ear of that would be this limited in tuning potentiel!

I've had many turbo cars till this day(GTI, A4, TT, Allroad, STI, Evo) and they all had one thing in common, you just needed to turn up the boost to gain big power and that what makes them good tuning platform, I'm just surprised that BMW would've ignored that when designing the S55!!

i really think everything is up for speculation on this new engine. you got guys over in the M4 threads saying this car is going to make 500HP+ with down pipes and a tune all day long. then you got guys that say the engine is pretty maxed out (or turbos).

it make senses to me you would be able to tune the engine to up the boost, as i find it hard to believe the turbos are running at max capacity from factory for longevity reasons.

i think the main problem will be the actual tuning part of this car. and guys they are on the M4 tune/downpipe bandwagon are going to have to sit back and wait for quite sometime.

i am excited for the m4, but i am in no rush. going to lay back and see where things go for the next two years.

[pkimM3r]

Im keeping the e90. Will get an f82 as well lol. Unless i make the jump to 991.

[bing240sx]

fuck or... AND BRO!!!

[Koldun]

Originally Posted by Alex07M3

I understand that the S55 is based on the N55 but would'nt it makes sens that this one would be able to take/hold more boost then it's weaker version, the N55!?

A bit in the same way that a 1.8T from a TT225 can take more boost then a 1.8T from a GTI even if it's basicaly the same engine minus a couple of parts!

Again, pardon my ignorance but I just find it weird that S55 would'nt be able to run a couple more pounds of boost then what it runs stock! That would be the first turbo engine that I ear of that would be this limited in tuning potentiel!

I've had many turbo cars till this day(GTI, A4, TT, Allroad, STI, Evo) and they all had one thing in common, you just needed to turn up the boost to gain big power and that what makes them good tuning platform, I'm just surprised that BMW would've ignored that when designing the S55!!

Don't get me wrong, everything is speculation so far, and I'm not saying the S55 cannot be pushed further. It would be silly for them to max out the engine entirely from the factory, unless the car isn't meant to last longer than a lease period. I just don't think it can be pushed that much further, especially given how difficult the recent BMW turbos have been to mess with (I'm not sure why you think BMW would design their $80K car to be tuner friendly). As Ezio pointed out, there is a large crowd who think they'll have 500+ HP M3s this summer with some test pipes and a tune. I think they will be disappointed.

[Longboarder]

Originally Posted by Alex07M3

Hi Adam, quick question for you, I understand your point about the new ECU and I'm not refuting it, but I was wondering what makes you think that this new engine wont be able to run +20psi like a lot of turbo cars does, is it the size of the turbos or the configuration of the engine, pardon my ignorance?!

The Mitsubishi turbos should be able to peak well north of 20psi mid-range but I haven't seen flow specs to see their operating efficiency range. I'm just speculating here Alex but I am highly confident with BMW's direction in which every gen of turbo car they are making it harder and harder to tune.

Just think about the n54 to the n55. With the n54, people were getting 340/370 wheel with a simple $5 resistor. With the N55, a proper $750 tune after years of development gets only 300 wheel. And I've seen tuned n55's dyno less than 300 wheel.

Then take the M5/6 with the dual Bosch ECU's. There is no good flash yet for these cars. The piggys cause limp modes as do the catless downpipes. These cars used to show up to the airstrip events here in SoCal and now they have vanished. Many of the modded ones limp with sustained WOT. You want to keep it under 130mph? Well if that's ok then fine. But I wouldn't want a product like this.

I'm not saying they will be impossible to crack, but the tuner development time will be significant and I'm fairly confident the gains will be small. So people will be paying big dollars for small gains.

[Antonio1988]

Wait to drive the M4 and make a decision. I personally would opt to supercharge my M3 because I am a big fan of the V8 in this car, both in its effective rev range and sound

[Alex07M3]

Originally Posted by Koldun

Don't get me wrong, everything is speculation so far, and I'm not saying the S55 cannot be pushed further. It would be silly for them to max out the engine entirely from the factory, unless the car isn't meant to last longer than a lease period. I just don't think it can be pushed that much further, especially given how difficult the recent BMW turbos have been to mess with (I'm not sure why you think BMW would design their $80K car to be tuner friendly). As Ezio pointed out, there is a large crowd who think they'll have 500+ HP M3s this summer with some test pipes and a tune. I think they will be disappointed.

My reason to think it would be good for BMW to make the M3/M4 tuner friendly is simply because they would sell more cars! How many of us wont buy the new car if you can't get pass the 450hp mark vs how many will jump on it if you can get to 500-550hp with simple bolt-ons and tune!

I don't think companys like BMW can ignore the tuning market anymore when designing cars these days, if they do, they'll lose market share to other companys that don't! Just look at the Performance parts catalog now, that was made to keep the after market parts buyers shopping at BMW!

That's just an opinion but hopefully BMW think the same cause if not, that will probably be my last BMW, stock cars are just not for me!!

[quiksi]

Originally Posted by Alex07M3

My reason to think it would be good for BMW to make the M3/M4 tuner friendly is simply because they would sell more cars!

I'd bet BMW is consciously ignoring the tuning market, because I'm sure the "tuner" community makes up for a disproportionately high percentage of possibly unjustified warranty claims/costs that simply aren't worth the incremental sales volume.

[Koldun]

Originally Posted by Alex07M3

My reason to think it would be good for BMW to make the M3/M4 tuner friendly is simply because they would sell more cars! How many of us wont buy the new car if you can't get pass the 450hp mark vs how many will jump on it if you can get to 500-550hp with simple bolt-ons and tune!

Except most of their business is leases, and they don't like people messing with their cars.

And the BMW Performance division was created because Dinan refused the buy-out.

[Alex07M3]

Originally Posted by quiksi

I'd bet BMW is consciously ignoring the tuning market, because I'm sure the "tuner" community makes up for a disproportionately high percentage of possibly unjustified warranty claims/costs that simply aren't worth the incremental sales volume.

That's an idee that crossed my mind but in the end I think it would be possible for them to conceive an ECU that would leave evident traces of modding for when they want to reject unjustified claims!

[V8FunNaturally]

NONE.
I would keep the E92 M3 OEM stock because that beats the hell out of your other options in the long term.

[CDM3DCT]

Thank you for all the input, now with more info on the M4 and what's planned for the future with cars like the Z06 etc... I'm more inclined to keep my e92.

I wonder if someone can shed some light on the following thought, how much does a supercharge depreciate our M3s? Is a supercharger worth it in the long run in terms of when, and if, our cars become sought after for being the last NA engine vehicles?

Thank you.

[JabzSA]

Originally Posted by Ezio

if you care to have to have the newest model and or care what people think. get the M4. or maybe you like the look better. also the M2 is a dam chick car. thats my take on the 1/2 series. they are small cars, my sister calls them cute cars.

I like the e92 more than the F80. which is why i have a 2013 M3 instead of waiting. i dont care how much power they are making with the new F80. its a turbo I6. it cannot touch the S65.

with that said. i am not planning on keeping my M3 forever and i do not think its the best car in earth. i would most likely upgrade to something faster, newer looking and to have a good engine note. the M4 is not on my list. so its kind of hard me to to answer the question.

one thing i can tell you. 100% a S/C M3 is going to sound better than a modded M4. thats what i do know

Amen brother. I just took delivery of a '13 MR for the same (and other) reasons as what you just described.