Supercharged e90 M3 Failure

stega · 01-20-2012, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THE TECH

Well you quoted the OP.

Either way, Active has denied ever having a failure.

The way the OP's question was answered seems odd to me.

Have any motors AA has had a kit on failed, NOT because of their supercharger or tuning but for other reasons???

His answer was just:
"There have been no engine failures Caused by our supercharger kit."

THE TECH · 01-20-2012, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stega

The way the OP's question was answered seems odd to me.

Have any motors AA has had a kit on failed, NOT because of their supercharger or tuning but for other reasons???

His answer was just:
"There have been no engine failures Caused by our supercharger kit."

I agree. I have gotten several PMs as well from Active on this subject that contained the same/similar responses. I am completely confused to what they're doing over there. From the way it sounded, they need replacement engines badly and have no way to get them.

pbonsalb · 01-20-2012, 03:28 PM

I am learning a lot by reading this thread and I especially appreciate the contributions of the tuners. It seems like a mixed case, one that is not provable either way.

Assume a mechanical over-rev caused the failure, then it is the driver's fault. Assume a mechanical over-rev did not cause the failure, then whose fault is it? If an engine fails that is modded, it is not necessarily the fault of the tuners selling the mods. You still have to prove that the mods caused the failure and that has not been done here. We have tuners stating that they have seen stock motors fail. We have tuners stating that supercharged motors are reliable.

While I see a coincidence that a supercharged motor failed, I don't see proof of fault. As a lawyer, if I could choose which side of the case to take, I would rather defend AA than try to prove the car owner's claim. As a car enthusiast who has had supercharged, turbocharged, and modified naturally aspirated BMWs, I am learning a lot.

SflBimmer8484 · 01-20-2012, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THE TECH

I agree. I have gotten several PMs as well from Active on this subject that contained the same/similar responses. I am completely confused to what they're doing over there. From the way it sounded, they need replacement engines badly and have no way to get them.

This is not what I wrote

This is what I wrote to you.

When it comes down to it the engine failed just like hundreds of others are which is why they are on a national back order with no clear date of getting more in stock. The only difference is we just happened to be the company that was on the engine at the time.

akh23456 · 01-20-2012, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THE TECH

I agree. I have gotten several PMs as well from Active on this subject that contained the same/similar responses. I am completely confused to what they're doing over there. From the way it sounded, they need replacement engines badly and have no way to get them.

stupid comment

THE TECH · 01-20-2012, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by akh23456

stupid comment

Don't criticize what you don't know. We already know you're biased since you own their kit. I can post the PMs if needed.

Also, you will note that I said, "from the way it sounded" which means my assumption based on the conversation. I didn't say, "he said".

THE TECH · 01-20-2012, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SehrSchnell

What does that mean? I have no f@cking clue anymore what is going on with this thread.

Why are you getting PM's? And what do you mean by "they need replacement engines badly....

I can post the PMs if needed.

M3SQRD · 01-20-2012, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Benvo

This statement couldn't be more on target.

You could have a dangerous tune at 5000 RPM. So it's not a question of RPM, but more a question of the fueling / ignition strategy.

RPM adds stress, but properly tuned with an engine that can support it, there should be minimal if any issues.

Mpowered: you can reply to my email if you wish and we can continue with reading the data from your car

Thanks

Hey Mike! A couple of questions:
1. How will you know if you're reading data from the OP's DME and not another e90 M3's DME? Based on info provided in this thread the DME was flashed back to stock so it will no longer have any AA specific settings and, therefore, should "look" like any other stock DME.
2. Is it possible to determine if the DME you are reading data from is the one that came with the car from the factory and/or was installed in the car at the time of the failure?

stega · 01-20-2012, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew@ActiveAutowerke

This is not what I wrote

This is what I wrote to you.

When it comes down to it the engine failed just like hundreds of others are which is why they are on a national back order with no clear date of getting more in stock. The only difference is we just happened to be the company that was on the engine at the time.

Ok. Can you please answer this question...?

Have any motors AA has had a kit on failed, NOT because of their supercharger or tuning but for other/any reasons???

THE TECH · 01-20-2012, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SehrSchnell

For crying out loud can you just clarify it then?

"Yes there seems to be a ton of failures on stock cars because bmw cannot keep up with the orders for new blocks. only way to get one now is to purchase a new car and take it out or wait in line."

So either he is just making broad generalizations from other threads or he is using his own knowledge of trying to source engines.

LostM · 01-20-2012, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raptor251

LOL...im pretty sure everyone knows by now ESS is the best in the business, look at their track record.

Haha, yes look at the track record. Slowest and most expensive even with the higher rev limts..

Oh and im not applauding or attacking any kit, im just spreading factual information for the community..

akh23456 · 01-20-2012, 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THE TECH

Don't criticize what you don't know. We already know you're biased since you own their kit. I can post the PMs if needed.

Also, you will note that I said, "from the way it sounded" which means my assumption based on the conversation. I didn't say, "he said".

I am not biased i just like my kit and its not biased for ess fanboys to come in and comment

akh23456 · 01-20-2012, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LostM

Haha, yes look at the track record. Slowest and most expensive even with the higher rev limts..

Oh and im not applauding or attacking any kit, im just spreading factual information for the community..

+1 need Nos to get into 10's lol when boost only cars can do it.

Jaypod · 01-20-2012, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THE TECH

"Yes there seems to be a ton of failures on stock cars because bmw cannot keep up with the orders for new blocks. only way to get one now is to purchase a new car and take it out or wait in line."

So either he is just making broad generalizations from other threads or he is using his own knowledge of trying to source engines.

Lol - I was told pretty much the same thing talking to a race team at Mid Ohio during a Grand Am weekend. I think I had read it somewhere else as well.

THE TECH · 01-20-2012, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by akh23456

I am not biased i just like my kit and its not biased for ess fanboys to come in and comment

Just don't need things like "stupid comment" when you clearly had no idea what was going on.

I could care less about the ESS vs Active thing. I wouldn't buy either.

akh23456 · 01-20-2012, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THE TECH

Just don't need things like "stupid comment" when you clearly had no idea what was going on.

I could care less about the ESS vs Active thing. I wouldn't buy either.

dude i knew about this way before you even had a M so i have more of an idea then you ever will.

THE TECH · 01-20-2012, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by akh23456

dude i knew about this way before you even had a M so i have more of an idea then you ever will.

So you knew in 2009 or whenever you got your car what a PM to me would say in 2012 before I posted it. Good stuff.

BPMSport · 01-20-2012, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dbarnes

Hey Mike! A couple of questions:
1. How will you know if you're reading data from the OP's DME and not another e90 M3's DME? Based on info provided in this thread the DME was flashed back to stock so it will no longer have any AA specific settings and, therefore, should "look" like any other stock DME.
2. Is it possible to determine if the DME you are reading data from is the one that came with the car from the factory and/or was installed in the car at the time of the failure?

Donnie,

Leave it to an expert

1. I will know if it's another car, that's the least of my concerns. I will verify with 100% certainty that it's the OP's car once I look around.

Second point: They can flash it back to stock all day long, and still wont be able to clear the freezeframe data. I know how to change it, however, no one can really do it at this point due to BMW locking that processor from being read out (not using OBDII). On the E46 M3 and E39 M5 changing those values are not a problem, but this DME is too new to be able to do it without Germany's help.

2. I will be able to check if it's the original DME, and will be able to see anything fishy going on. No tricks are getting past me. I know them all.

And akh23456: I had my M3 way before you, so to say that to THE TECH is just plain stupid, because I can just turn around and say it right back to you. Stop acting like a kid and lets keep vested interests out of this. This thread is NOT about which kit is better, and I understand your inclination to support AA and especially the product that you use on your car daily. Take a step back please and lets focus only on the evidence at hand - not AA vs ESS vs XX vs YY as we would be here all day and would leave with migranes one the thread is locked.

The OP pmed me his phone number, I called him and it went to VM. So he can call me back when he has a moment to discuss.

THE TECH · 01-20-2012, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Benvo

Donnie,

Leave it to an expert

1. I will know if it's another car, that's the least of my concerns. I will verify with 100% certainty that it's the OP's car once I look around.

Second point: They can flash it back to stock all day long, and still wont be able to clear the freezeframe data. I know how to change it, however, no one can really do it at this point due to BMW locking that processor from being read out (not using OBDII). On the E46 M3 and E39 M5 changing those values are not a problem, but this DME is too new to be able to do it without Germany's help.

2. I will be able to check if it's the original DME, and will be able to see anything fishy going on. No tricks are getting past me. I know them all.

And akh23456: I had my M3 way before you, so to say that to THE TECH is just plain stupid, because I can just turn around and say it right back to you. Stop acting like a kid and lets keep vested interests out of this. This thread is NOT about which kit is better, and I understand your inclination to support AA and especially the product that you use on your car daily. Take a step back please.

TECH: Leave it be. I've gotten into arguments with him before and it's not worth losing the IQ points.

Thanks for the fresh air Mike.

M3SQRD · 01-20-2012, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Benvo

Donnie,

Leave it to an expert

1. I will know if it's another car, that's the least of my concerns. I will verify with 100% certainty that it's the OP's car once I look around.

Second point: They can flash it back to stock all day long, and still wont be able to clear the freezeframe data. I know how to change it, however, no one can really do it at this point due to BMW locking that processor from being read out (not using OBDII). On the E46 M3 and E39 M5 changing those values are not a problem, but this DME is too new to be able to do it without Germany's help.

2. I will be able to check if it's the original DME, and will be able to see anything fishy going on. No tricks are getting past me. I know them all.

And akh23456: I had my M3 way before you, so to say that to THE TECH is just plain stupid, because I can just turn around and say it right back to you. Stop acting like a kid and lets keep vested interests out of this. This thread is NOT about which kit is better, and I understand your inclination to support AA and especially the product that you use on your car daily. Take a step back please and lets focus only on the evidence at hand - not AA vs ESS vs XX vs YY as we would be here all day and would leave with migranes one the thread is locked.

The OP pmed me his phone number, I called him and it went to VM. So he can call me back when he has a moment to discuss.

Thanks Mike!

Jaypod · 01-20-2012, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Benvo

Take a step back please

LMFAO!! You butt yourself into this whole situation

IMG · 01-20-2012, 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by akh23456

Quote:

Originally Posted by LostM

Haha, yes look at the track record. Slowest and most expensive even with the higher rev limts..

Oh and im not applauding or attacking any kit, im just spreading factual information for the community..

+1 need Nos to get into 10's lol when boost only cars can do it.

Hey Akash, hope all is well.
Just would like to remind you what the VT1 kit did to you at Atco.
I know you got the record for the 1/4 but still, the VT1 kit still pilled some cars on you off the line.

And too bad we never ran head to head !

01-20-2012, 03:28 PM	#289
pbonsalb Lieutenant General 5228 Rep 10,614 Posts Drives: 18 F90 M5, 99 E36 M3 Turbo Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: New England iTrader: (4)	I am learning a lot by reading this thread and I especially appreciate the contributions of the tuners. It seems like a mixed case, one that is not provable either way. Assume a mechanical over-rev caused the failure, then it is the driver's fault. Assume a mechanical over-rev did not cause the failure, then whose fault is it? If an engine fails that is modded, it is not necessarily the fault of the tuners selling the mods. You still have to prove that the mods caused the failure and that has not been done here. We have tuners stating that they have seen stock motors fail. We have tuners stating that supercharged motors are reliable. While I see a coincidence that a supercharged motor failed, I don't see proof of fault. As a lawyer, if I could choose which side of the case to take, I would rather defend AA than try to prove the car owner's claim. As a car enthusiast who has had supercharged, turbocharged, and modified naturally aspirated BMWs, I am learning a lot.
	Appreciate 0 Quote