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11-09-2009, 04:38 AM | #749 | |
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Willingness is probably the better word to describe what you are trying to convey, i.e. the willingness of the nose to instantly reaction to your steering input. Though this is in part the reduced weight it has over the likes of the M3 it's as much to do with the suspension setup that the engineers want the car to behave like. It's like understeer/oversteer, any chassis can be setup to behave to one or other of these behaviours but it's safer to have it understeer on approaching the limit as most react by lifting throttle or braking which tightens the line, if the same thing is done while oversteering the react could be very different and with a possible disastrous outcome. |
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11-09-2009, 10:05 AM | #750 | ||
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Foot, the reason I mentioned the M3 vs Cayman at the limit was partly because folks who have tracked both of these cars have told me this, but mostly as a bone to throw the multitudes of Faithful in this venue who are hair-trigger quick to take umbrage at a note that doesn't somehow seem positive, M3-wise, and thus hijack the (my) current topic in this string. Quote:
Take the current M3, reduce its weight by, say, 400 pounds while adjusting spring and shocks rates accordingly (to keep the same roll and ride characteristics), and the car will be a relative delight in the twisties. Reduce its wheelbase by several inches and it will be even better. For reasons of weight and wheelbase (mostly), our E36 felt more wieldy than our E46, and in my limited experience with the E9X, our E46 felt more wieldy than the new car for the same reasons. So for me, each new M3 model is absolutely a better car than the preceding model, but less fun for me personally in the twisties. As far as I can tell, it's weight and size that makes this so. Bruce |
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11-09-2009, 10:14 AM | #751 |
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Bimmerfile's lead story is that BMW has decided not to bring the GTS to the NA market... Garbage if you ask me. Not that I could have afforder it right now anyway....
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11-09-2009, 10:24 AM | #752 |
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My God this car is going to own all... Anyone know if this will be at the LA Autoshow?
If not then imma make a quick stop in Germany to take a look at one of these in person before coming back to the States.
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11-09-2009, 11:37 AM | #753 | ||
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I remember a conversion that one of the UK magazines had with a chief engineer from Audi where he stated that they could have made the A5 either understeer, oversteer or remain neutral but it was deemed by marketing that the car should understeer at the limit because that was familiar to the Audi faithful, though it was their intent to slowly change this behaviour. Basically my point is that they can make any car behave any way they want. |
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11-09-2009, 03:12 PM | #754 | |
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Bruce |
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11-09-2009, 03:42 PM | #755 | |
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Here's one for you Bruce, do you remember cross-ply rubber and the fun to be had at only 50 mph. |
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11-09-2009, 11:05 PM | #756 |
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Seems that a lot of these cars, as they get larger and heavier, are getting easier to drive. Better at dealing with poor road surfaces due to the fancy suspensions their weight necessitate and a longer wheelbase keeps things less twitchy.
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11-10-2009, 07:01 AM | #757 | |
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There really is something good about slow. Back when I was running our three-liter E36 on track days, one of my instructors said: "Y'know, one of the things about these really quick cars with a lot of stick is that, when you do go off, you're going to be going really, really fast. Best warning/piece of advice I ever got from an instructor. Guys with Triumph Spitfires or early MGs know all about this. It's not the speed that counts, it's getting the most out of your car. Bruce PS - Anecdotally, I swear that with the rubber from those old days, if the wind got over 40 MPH, some cars would slide when parked. |
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11-10-2009, 09:19 AM | #758 |
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Disappointed
It looks like it's not coming to the states. I'm stuck with my regular M3 for now. http://www.m3post.com/forums/images/smilies/cry.gif
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11-10-2009, 09:21 AM | #759 |
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Porsche got sued because the CGT oversteered and it didn't have traction control in the death of Mr. Keating at AAA speedway.
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Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
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11-10-2009, 09:48 AM | #760 | |
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http://www.businessweek.com/autos/co...608_466074.htm |
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11-10-2009, 09:59 AM | #761 | ||
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An off in the M3 for what ever reason at those speeds and the damage incurred would be vast, possibly life threatening in comparison to the Scenic. Understeer in your friend, no think of it as the instructor in the car next to you that tell you the limit of your car in the corner you have just entered. Quote:
P.S. The bit at the end cracked me up. I am probably young next to yourself but I have had enough experience with classic cars equipped with cross-plys as you will know that driving them on the track is like driving in the wet and with the surface covered in oil. |
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11-10-2009, 01:01 PM | #762 | |
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Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
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11-10-2009, 02:49 PM | #763 | |
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P.S. I would also say it's easier to get a payout in the US than it would have been else where. |
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11-10-2009, 04:06 PM | #764 |
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It would seem that the GTS has put up a first impression fast lap on the North Loop:
around 7:35 mins. Anyone know more ?
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11-10-2009, 04:18 PM | #765 | |
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If true then it must be in the hands of BMW test drivers because the car is still too far off production for one of the magazines to get a proper test conducted. |
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11-11-2009, 03:09 PM | #766 |
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The M Gods have been good.
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Just thinking of something not so witty ///M3 E92 '09 Jerez Black | 6MT | Ext Fox Red | Tech | Prem | 19s |Heated Seats | iPod |Smartphone | Euro Deliv June 09 Sold: 540iT / 530i / 323i |
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11-12-2009, 02:23 AM | #768 | |
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and since all was told to me later as you know was confirmed by facts, I would beleive also to this info...
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11-12-2009, 02:50 AM | #769 | |
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Savage, you also know that I too am well informed. |
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11-12-2009, 03:01 AM | #770 | |
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