Women Who Are Turned Off By Nice Guys

[Nate4641]

Originally Posted by shah269

well...i saw the article thought it was well written so i shared.....sorry didn't mean to enlighten you. Feel free to go back to your angry birds.

HEY! Angry birds has nothing to do with this. You leave them alone. Those swine flu having pigs are stealing their children, they've gone through enough!

[KingOfJericho]

Originally Posted by shah269

well...i saw the article thought it was well written so i shared.....sorry didn't mean to enlighten you. Feel free to go back to your angry birds.

Most of the respondents are married, though I suppose you could be trying to enlighten us as to why you remain single, however most of us are already acutely aware lol

[grimlock]

So is this going to turn to a singles vs married thing? If it makes you guys feel any better I for one am not getting any, so its an equal waste of a beemer

[shah269]

This little article has me thinking and not paying attention in my meeting.
It reminds me of the phrase that use to perplex me “Become the change you wish to see.”
I never truly understood what that meant? I just assumed it meant that if I behaved in a civil gracious manner the universe in some strange way would be civil and gracious to me.
However I was wrong, it’s not that the universe is conscious rather it’s my subliminal messages that I broadcast about who I am.

The trigger to this thought was the notion of cognitive dissonance which is discussed in this article.
Cognitive dissonance is where our internalized views of who and what we are and who and what the world is do not match with what is going on around us. This dissonance makes us uncomfortable for it questions our internalized models of ourselves and this comfort can be either good or bad. But it’s mostly bad.

We are amazed and pleased and put in a state of wonder when we see a magician cut a woman in half.
Our internalized model of the would dictates that said woman should be dead and not smiling and there should be blood….
However the woman is smiling and there is no blood and by god she is split and all is well….and life is good because we are entertained by this momentary disruption of continuity between the internalized model vs the external reality we experience.

However say this dissonance was life, death, mating or career rather than entertainment. In this case let’s assume the ugly duckling model of dissonance. The subject was belittled as a child and told he or she lacked the moral fiber and fortitude to be an effective leader by those he or she admired or looked up to. However later in his or her life due to circumstances beyond his or her control this person in now given the opportunity of a life time to become a leader with the full support of his or her cohort.
This causes great dissonance where the persons internalized self image does not match with how other view them. And the subject pulls back and or fails at the task.

A more subtle analogy would be where a subject was belittled nonstop or in key times of their lives and their internalized model of who they are is one of low worth….and that becomes their comfort zone. As such when said person is complimented on a job well done rather than feeling good about their work the subject will feel anxious and very uncomfortable. The person who bestowed the compliment will subconsciously pick up on this agitation and may in time stop providing continued compliments so as to not cause any unusual “vibes” from the one who is complimented. Which then alleviates the subjects anxiety associated with reality not matching up with their internalized view.

The phrase “Become the change you wish to see.” As such indicates that if you wish for something to happen you must not only be open to such an event but you must also be available and comfortable when said event occurs.

[catherineanh]

Originally Posted by Skhmund

I'mma play the sexist card and say this is why we are the superior species

Originally Posted by JAM3S

Also nice guys are boring to chicks after a few weeks.

very true.

[carve]

What a woman typically wants is a lack of neediness. They want someone who doesn't need them, but wants them. "Nice guys" are often very placating and needy, while the bad boys definitely embrace their masculinity and aren't needy. To walk the fine line, be "nice", but not at the expense of saying what you want (even at risk of rejection) and doing what you want. A masculine guy will put himself out there and not compromise his opinions, values and desires just to avoid being rejected by a girl...and women go crazy for it.

Here's a pertinent excerpt from the book "Models" by Mark Mason

The way to combat neediness is by opening up to vulnerability. If
you look at romance novels (which, by the way, I actually
recommend you don’t, unless you’re a masochist like I am), you’ll
find more or less the same story-arc in all of them. Strong male hero,
sometimes a bit of a “bad boy,” but usually a strong male who lives
life on his own terms -- i.e., a “doesn’t take shit from anybody” type
of guy. A female hero who pines for hero. They meet and at first
they don’t get along. Man is insensitive or there are just too many
barriers to them being together. But as the novel goes on, the male
hero’s flaws are slowly exposed, and he’s forced to accept them, and
(usually) with the help of the female hero, forced to come to terms
with his vulnerability. He eventually opens up his inner-most
feelings to her, becoming a strong bad boy, but with a heart, she
supports him and guides him, they fall in love and live happily ever
after (or sometimes someone dies tragically). The end.
Romance novels are basically pornography for women. There’s a
reason they follow the same general themes and story-lines the same
way real pornography follows the same general themes and (lack of)
story lines.

Women want a strong, independent, high status male -- a “doesn’t
take shit from anybody” bad boy -- but they want this bad boy to
have a depth and a sensitivity that they only open up and show when
they’re around her.

[SwnSng]

Originally Posted by carve

What a woman typically wants is a lack of neediness. They want someone who doesn't need them, but wants them. "Nice guys" are often very placating and needy, while the bad boys definitely embrace their masculinity and aren't needy. To walk the fine line, be "nice", but not at the expense of saying what you want (even at risk of rejection) and doing what you want. A masculine guy will put himself out there and not compromise his opinions, values and desires just to avoid rejection...and women go crazy for it.

Here's a pertinent excerpt from the book "Models" by Mark Mason

It boggles my mind how RIGHT this is...those lame vampire movies/books are testament to this phenomena as well as 50 shades of gray.

It's so true...self proclaimed "nice guys" are a needy bunch, stop sulking and get some. Sulking only works if you have already made yourself :P

[shah269]

http://www.ted.com/talks/esther_pere...ationship.html

[ScreaM]

There is some truth to it..no woman wants a man who's a pussy..they want someone who is assertive without being an asshole about it..

That said I agree with the masses..OP needs a relationship intervention or something.. guy is obsessed with the opposite sex and never shuts up about it..

Where there's smoke there's fire..hence my signature..

[MiddleAgedAl]

A guy walks into a bar, and sits down. Sees a really ugly looking dude at the other end. All night long, hot chicks keep approaching the ugly guy, and finally, he gets up and leaves with two of the finest hotties. The guy turns to the bartender, and asks, "what's up with that?"

Bartender says "He's in here several nights a week and it's always like that."

"Really? What's his secret ?"

"I dunno; I haven't figured it out. Nothin special about him - he just sits there most of the night, licking his eyebrows"

[carve]

Originally Posted by SwnSng

It boggles my mind how RIGHT this is...those lame vampire movies/books are testament to this phenomena as well as 50 shades of gray.

It's so true...self proclaimed "nice guys" are a needy bunch, stop sulking and get some. Sulking only works if you have already made yourself :P

Thanks I used to be a complete pussy but learned the hard way very recently, and this stuff works!

Most women even want a few subtle elements of being controlled, particularly when things get physical. Many have told me how turned on they get if I, say, firmly hold their arms or hips, or tell them to do something, or use graphically erotic words even if they previously found the words I pick offensive. It's because I'm going after what I want UNAPOLOGETICALLY, in control, and putting myself out there even at the risk of offending her (something I wouldn't have done as a stereotypical "nice guy"). Combine that with elements of gentleness (especially after) and attentiveness to her needs and being low-pressure and you have a winning combo that's effective on women ranging from tattooed tough-girls to businesswomen to doctors to computer programers. Then, just take a similar sort of attitude to non-physical interactions and you're good to go: No more nice-guy syndrome, but you're still not an asshole, either

Disclaimer: I'm only interested in smart, independent girls so maybe your typical idiot with low self-esteem really is just interested in someone treating her like crap.

[SwnSng]

One of my friends who is a pretty smart guy used to work as a bartender during college. He said he would always see the same thing happen. The guy who at the beginning of the night who is having fun flirting with the ladies, who gets turned down almost the entire night will end up going home with one of the ones that rejected him earlier. He saw this story play out almost every night during his few years of bartending. I'm not saying to be that one annoying guy in the bar who hits on anything that moves but I think I would rather be the shameless guy getting some than the self loathing, deprecating guy settling for old rosie.

[PINeely]

Originally Posted by Templar

Just because you have a sexy vacuum cleaner doesn't mean a girl will like you more. Just FYI.

Get a Rainbow brah. Chicks go nuts.

One other thing worth noting here is learning theory. If you want to drive a girl away a surefire way to do that is by being nice to her every time you see her. The very first time you're a dick she'll ask "WTF was that" and leave. It's all about setting up a pattern of intermittent reinforcement.

[Ashley Schaeffer BMW]

[grimlock]

Originally Posted by shah269

it’s not that the universe is conscious rather it’s my subliminal messages that I broadcast about who I am.

Oh Shah, you are so right.
I realised this too, but it feels more solid hearing it from someone else.
I am amazed how people judge/perceive you from silly little hints like dress/posture/nonverbal communication.. perhaps this is to be accepted in a world of limited interactions where you do have to sell yourself for lack of modesty or better words.

Originally Posted by catherinelam

very true.

so, you are bored..?

Originally Posted by carve

Most women even want a few subtle elements of being controlled

Honestly, I thought this stuff was crap, but the more I see the 'base'ness or depravity (for lack of better word) the more I believe you may be right.
Like a slave expects to be treated live a slave, there is no point telling him he is better than that, why not just agree with him and enjoy the fruits of his labor? Damn this world is dark.

[kevinbahnz]

does it really come down to nice guys versus the other guy or is it more , slow and steady vs fast and hard.

[carve]

Originally Posted by grimlock

Honestly, I thought this stuff was crap, but the more I see the 'base'ness or depravity (for lack of better word) the more I believe you may be right.
Like a slave expects to be treated live a slave, there is no point telling him he is better than that, why not just agree with him and enjoy the fruits of his labor? Damn this world is dark.

It's true, but don't read too much into it, either. It's more about subtle, masculine dominant physical ques on your part than anything overtly controlling. It's maybe not what you're led to believe in our feminized overly-PC society, but it's not exactly cave-man depravity, either. Watch this...

[carve]

Originally Posted by ScreaM

That said I agree with the masses..OP needs a relationship intervention or something.. guy is obsessed with the opposite sex and never shuts up about it..

Where there's smoke there's fire..hence my signature..

Meh- I don't see a problem. His opinions and experiences are similar to mine (both recently divorced and figuring things out about women). Shah is just more likely to start a thread about what he's thinking. We're on page 3 in a day so he's clearly not the only one interested in discussing it.

[amanda hor$t]

like attracts like. no point trying to be what they want.

[Vic311]

This sums it up rather nicely..Shah should refer to this a quick reference guide from here on out..

Originally Posted by JAM3S

[Spool]

I am a douche bag but i am also respectful...as long as you have a good balance of what you do, and you got game, chicks will dig it...


i agree 100% that chicks don't like shy/nice guys, ones that are like borderline faggots cuz they are so nice...

[f30nynj]

I would agree that I lost couple of opportunities just cuz I was responsive & showed good interest. She thought I was clingy.

But now, even though I like her I would act like I m not too much. Responding to texts with a 20-30min delay and not revealing too much at same time. Just engage her enough so she'll come back. It works for me!!

It is about keeping the right slack, not too tight & not too saggy.