▀▄ eas | S65 Rod Bearing Replacement: An ongoing "Journal"

[REDBULL]

Originally Posted by M3Guy

I'm wanting to drop a ess 625 kit on my 2011 e92 but this whole rod bearing issue is holding me back. How common is this problem?

That was my concern too. just upgrade your bearings. supercharger or no supercharger you are going to want to eventually if you keep the car. since you are on the east coast, order some WPC bearings from Tom@EAS, then hit up ACM in NJ!

[SenorFunkyPants]

Originally Posted by M3Guy

I'm wanting to drop a ess 625 kit on my 2011 e92 but this whole rod bearing issue is holding me back. How common is this problem?

When I was working on S65 engine failure rates IIRC the fail rate for S/C cars was ~4 times that of standard cars.

[M3Guy]

Originally Posted by SenorFunkyPants

When I was working on S65 engine failure rates IIRC the fail rate for S/C cars was ~4 times that of standard cars.

What exactly was happening to those cars that failed? From what I'm reading the replacement bearings fail also though right?

[SenorFunkyPants]

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthr...hlight=failure
there is an excel file you can download and then click on the links to see the M3post thread detailing the failures.
Its a couple of months out of date and there will most likely be more S/C car failures than listed as some failed S/C cars will have been returned to standard before being dropped off at BMW for a new engine to be fitted under warranty (and therefore not reported on M3post).

[ndau]

At this stage, I don't believe there has been a case of replaced bearings failing.

There's also a 99% chance you wont get a warranty replacement the moment you take your car in and they realise its been running with removed cold start, lifted rev limited and other various and obvious tunes.

[M3Guy]

Yea I'm sure they will find any and all reasons not to replace it and I guess you can't blame them. What's a ballpark on how much getting them replaced cost? I'm out in NC and am unsure where I trust enough to take it

[W///]

Originally Posted by M3Guy

Yea I'm sure they will find any and all reasons not to replace it and I guess you can't blame them. What's a ballpark on how much getting them replaced cost? I'm out in NC and am unsure where I trust enough to take it

I've heard somewhere around the $2k ballpark. But I'm on the same boat. I'll probably have to drive pretty far or get my car shipped to get this done (once it needs it, not doing it quite yet)

[regular guy]

Originally Posted by M3Guy

Yea I'm sure they will find any and all reasons not to replace it and I guess you can't blame them. What's a ballpark on how much getting them replaced cost? I'm out in NC and am unsure where I trust enough to take it

PM kawasaki00 for a shop in NC. I think he can point you in the right direction.

[Mpowered]

Anyone do oil analysis following bearing replacement and seeing much improved numbers or possibly no improvement?

[tom @ eas]

Originally Posted by Mpowered

Anyone do oil analysis following bearing replacement and seeing much improved numbers or possibly no improvement?

Should be changing oil on our shop car soon to follow up with our own results. I can't foresee being any negatives.

[chris719]

It will be hard to pinpoint with lead free bearings. I don't think anyone has posted the exact composition of the lead free bearings. If it's primarily Al for example, the wear could be coming from elsewhere.

[exmowner]

thx

[exmowner]

thx

[ndau]

Info
Vehicle: 2008 BMW M3, DCT (Australian - Maybe hotter weather)
Production Date: 11/08
Oil Used: TWS Motorsport 10W-60, no data provided on previous oil change
Mileage: ~16,XXX mi (27,000 Km)
Fuel: 93 Oct
Driving Habits: Mostly highway/street driving, no track use

Oil report to follow ETA 2 weeks, photo quality is terrible but I believe I am seeing copper on the edges of bearing 4. Replaced with WPC + ARP when installing SC.

Full Album:

View post on imgur.com

Bearing 4;

[SenorFunkyPants]

Looks like something trapped underneath that bearing shell during fitting.
The rest look really good.

[Helmsman]

Originally Posted by chris719

If I were supercharging I'd definitely pull them, but that's me. Total failure doesn't seem to be that common but no one has pulled a really nice looking set even out of stock motors.

That one really concerns me.

Even if actual failure percentage is way down at 0.x% I assume most engines would run for quite some time before it would generate issues due to bearing wear. So without hearing about a single engine with fine bearings (i.e. normal/no wear!) after whatever mileage, preferably extensive, I can't help myself agreeing with the folks who claim design mistake. Nothing BMW would ever agree to I'm sure.

Not spending this kind of money on a quality car to add bearing change to the regular maintenance, so even if it is a lovely ride I will probably set a limit to how long I keep it - and enjoy mean while!

[kawasaki00]

Originally Posted by SenorFunkyPants

Looks like something trapped underneath that bearing shell during fitting.
The rest look really good.

I agree. Kind of looks like that plastic film again like that one set of bearings they found. Only 16k miles but at least you don'tsee any concentrated delamination

[Helmsman]

Originally Posted by ndau

Info
Vehicle: 2008 BMW M3, DCT (Australian - Maybe hotter weather)
Production Date: 11/08
Oil Used: TWS Motorsport 10W-60, no data provided on previous oil change
Mileage: ~16,XXX mi (27,000 Km)
Fuel: 93 Oct
Driving Habits: Mostly highway/street driving, no track use

Oil report to follow ETA 2 weeks, photo quality is terrible but I believe I am seeing copper on the edges of bearing 4. Replaced with WPC + ARP when installing SC.

Full Album:

View post on imgur.com

Bearing 4;

NDAU,

what was the reason you took a 16K engine a part, guess it show issues, what where they?

Thanks

[swamp2]

Originally Posted by Helmsman

without hearing about a single engine with fine bearings (i.e. normal/no wear!) after whatever mileage, preferably extensive, I can't help myself agreeing with the folks who claim design mistake.

What about the post just above with pics? Yes, mileage is relatively low and one bearing has some issue but as pointed out it looks like it could very well be a contamination issue which does not indicate a design flaw.

[tom @ eas]

Originally Posted by Helmsman

NDAU,

what was the reason you took a 16K engine a part, guess it show issues, what where they?

Thanks

+1. Did you happen to get a Blackstone report beforehand?

[regular guy]

Originally Posted by SenorFunkyPants

Looks like something trapped underneath that bearing shell during fitting.
The rest look really good.

Agreed about the contamination. From the front of the #4 shell it looks like some of the others with excessive bearing wear. But the back tells a different story that looks like contamination under the shell. This is why I appreciate kawasaki00's expertise for teaching us how to look at both sides of the shells.

[BobS]

I would think a blackstone report wouldn't pick up anything on that 16k bearing issue...not until the bearing got worse and more material underneath (copper) started to get into the oil and show up on the report. It does look like some contamination of some sort.