Test drove the 09 911 C4S PDK and M3 sedan DCT and Convertible 6 speed back to back

[whym3]

I used to own a 6 speed cayman S and before that an E46 M3 SMG

1) Today test drove the 09 911C4S pdk
Very good car but didnt feel very grippy in cold weather even with AWD
- Car slid before PSM corrected it around corners
+ PDK is nice but switches to change gears takes time to get used to
- Engine note is not that great below 6K rpm
+ Lotsa power and good mid range torque
- lots of road nice/tire noise though
+ Great steering feel but RWD 911 steering felt better
+ Awesome MPG
+ Rear engine feel is unique
-car MSRP was 110,000 with similar m3 options, will be 6 k less with RWD 911S

2) Then test drive the 09 M3 sedan DCT
+ Engine note is awesome
+ Lots of power and great power in 2nd and third gear
+ Comfy and supportive seats
+ upgraded audio one of the best and 09 I drive is slick
+ Steering in Sport felt good , avergage in normal mode
- not sold on sedan looks
+ DCT paddles better than PDK switches and Shifts are very nice


3) Immedietly I test drove the 09 M3 Convertible 6 speed
+ Engine note is similar to sedan and will be better with top down I am sure
+ The car felt very similar in feel and steering with Sport Plus
+ looks nicer over sedan, very close to the M3 coupe looks
+ Car is 400 lbs heavier but I could not feel all that weight
+ rides good with no rattles and shudders
- 6 speed is not bad but not as good as a porsche 6 speed in feel and DCT/pDK are awesome
+ Sedan and conv felt they had more grip over the 911

So I came away very impressed especially with the M3 convertible ride, handling and looks and DCT and PDK in the M3 sedan and 911. The M3 conv felt like 2 cars in one - a coupe and a conv in warm weather

I am considering getting the 09 M3 convertible in SSii and Silver extended with blue gray trim and tech package, Premium, HD, Sirius, PDC, etc


Few questions for existing m3 conv owners
1) How is the car from Rattles and Mpg perspective?
2) Upgarded audio worth it?
3) How is the Wind draft with all wndows up and without wind blocker- tried a 3 series conv a few mnths ago without W blcocker and it felt draft free- dont like to use the wind blocker
4) Debating between SSii and Space gray


Thx for any feedback

[montreal red]

Originally Posted by whym3

I used to own a 6 speed cayman S and before that an E46 M3 SMG

1) Today test drove the 09 911C4S pdk
Very good car but didnt feel very grippy in cold weather even with AWD
- Car slid before PSM corrected it around corners
+ PDK is nice but switches to change gears takes time to get used to
- Engine note is not that great below 6K rpm
+ Lotsa power and good mid range torque
- lots of road nice/tire noise though
+ Great steering feel but RWD 911 steering felt better
+ Awesome MPG
+ Rear engine feel is unique
-car MSRP was 110,000 with similar m3 options, will be 6 k less with RWD 911S

2) Then test drive the 09 M3 sedan DCT
+ Engine note is awesome
+ Lots of power and great power in 2nd and third gear
+ Comfy and supportive seats
+ upgraded audio one of the best and 09 I drive is slick
+ Steering in Sport felt good , avergage in normal mode
- not sold on sedan looks
+ DCT paddles better than PDK switches and Shifts are very nice

3) Immedietly I test drove the 09 M3 Convertible 6 speed
+ Engine note is similar to sedan and will be better with top down I am sure
+ The car felt very similar in feel and steering with Sport Plus
+ looks nicer over sedan, very close to the M3 coupe looks
+ Car is 400 lbs heavier but I could not feel all that weight
+ rides good with no rattles and shudders

So I came away very impressed especially with the M3 convertible ride, handling and looks and DCT and PDK in the M3 sedan and 911. The M3 conv felt like 2 cars in one - a coupe and a conv in warm weather

I am considering getting the 09 M3 convertible in SSii and Silver extended with blue gray trim and tech package, Premium, HD, Sirius, PDC, etc


Few questions for existing m3 conv owners
1) How is the car from Rattles and Mpg perspective?
2) Upgarded audio worth it?
3) How is the Wind draft with all wndows up and without wind blocker- tried a 3 series conv a few mnths ago without W blcocker and it felt draft free- dont like to use the wind blocker
4) Debating between SSii and Space gray


Thx for any feedback

nice review.... i have the individual sound pack and i think its worth it. it does sound a lot better than the stock sound system.

as for rattles, i dont have much of it even though the road conditions here in montreal are really really bad.

cant comment on MPG because to be honest this car is one thirsty motherf**ker... of course that has got to do with me driving it hard whenever i get a chance to.

color wise, both are really nice. SSII is a unique M color. but spaceG has a nice understated quality to it. makes your car look very classy... cant go wrong with either.

[revmmm]

I agree, I have not had many rattle problems (for a convertible), but obviously not as tight as a coupe.

Personally I like the SSII over the space grey, 1st because it is an M color, 2nd because it really looks great clean, and 3rd because it does not show the snow/salt as bad (assuming you are driving it for NJ winters).

You can check out a lot of photos I have in my albums if you click on my avatar. In low light and overcast the light blue color really shows, but in the bright sun it looks great.

As far as road noise and wind, this is my 2nd cab and I think it is pretty good. I also have the upgraded audio package and think it is worth it.

Good luck with your choices and let us know what you end up with.

[doba_s]

go with the space gray ...

[SlammedR8]

Originally Posted by whym3

Few questions for existing m3 conv owners
1) How is the car from Rattles and Mpg perspective?
2) Upgarded audio worth it?
3) How is the Wind draft with all wndows up and without wind blocker- tried a 3 series conv a few mnths ago without W blcocker and it felt draft free- dont like to use the wind blocker
4) Debating between SSii and Space gray


Thx for any feedback

1) very few rattles, i also have a subwoofer in my trunk and the eisenmann race exhaust, which overtime will obviously contribute to some minor rattles from the bass and from the deep growl of the exhaust. NOTHING SERIOUS, and WORTH THE BEAUTIFUL SOUND OF THE EISENMANN RACE!!

2)Upgraded Audio is well worth it in my opinion, especially in a vert when the roof is down. it is much needed!

3)wind draft isnt too bad, its def there! its a convertible, it should be! I am buying the blocker for this spring/summer just because i wanna be able to cut out some wind at certain times. and for bluetooth reasons!

4) your car, your choice. i like both!

[devo]

Originally Posted by whym3

I used to own a 6 speed cayman S and before that an E46 M3 SMG

1) Today test drove the 09 911C4S pdk
Very good car but didnt feel very grippy in cold weather even with AWD
- Car slid before PSM corrected it around corners
+ PDK is nice but switches to change gears takes time to get used to
- Engine note is not that great below 6K rpm
+ Lotsa power and good mid range torque
- lots of road nice/tire noise though
+ Great steering feel but RWD 911 steering felt better
+ Awesome MPG
+ Rear engine feel is unique
-car MSRP was 110,000 with similar m3 options, will be 6 k less with RWD 911S

2) Then test drive the 09 M3 sedan DCT
+ Engine note is awesome
+ Lots of power and great power in 2nd and third gear
+ Comfy and supportive seats
+ upgraded audio one of the best and 09 I drive is slick
+ Steering in Sport felt good , avergage in normal mode
- not sold on sedan looks
+ DCT paddles better than PDK switches and Shifts are very nice


3) Immedietly I test drove the 09 M3 Convertible 6 speed
+ Engine note is similar to sedan and will be better with top down I am sure
+ The car felt very similar in feel and steering with Sport Plus
+ looks nicer over sedan, very close to the M3 coupe looks
+ Car is 400 lbs heavier but I could not feel all that weight
+ rides good with no rattles and shudders
- 6 speed is not bad but not as good as a porsche 6 speed in feel and DCT/pDK are awesome
+ Sedan and conv felt they had more grip over the 911

So I came away very impressed especially with the M3 convertible ride, handling and looks and DCT and PDK in the M3 sedan and 911. The M3 conv felt like 2 cars in one - a coupe and a conv in warm weather

I am considering getting the 09 M3 convertible in SSii and Silver extended with blue gray trim and tech package, Premium, HD, Sirius, PDC, etc


Few questions for existing m3 conv owners
1) How is the car from Rattles and Mpg perspective?
2) Upgarded audio worth it?
3) How is the Wind draft with all wndows up and without wind blocker- tried a 3 series conv a few mnths ago without W blcocker and it felt draft free- dont like to use the wind blocker
4) Debating between SSii and Space gray


Thx for any feedback

Modern 911s, especially C4s, stick very well. Contemporary PSM is designed to offer more driver latitude while cornering aggressivey. It interveened too early in the 996 and early 997 models. I am curious though if the PS2s were warmed up and/or if the outside temp. was warm enough to expect adequate grip.

DI has taken some of the engine's unique raspiness away. Add Porsche's Sport Exhaust option and the sound will become music to your ears. The new engine's power is exceptional, torque is very abundant.

You should test drive a C2S. Imo, there is really no need for a C4S, just more weight and more of a drain on horsepower. You can easily order a very well equipped C2S PDK for $101,000 MSRP, with some unnecessary options, $98,000 without; which is comparably equipped to the M. It sounds like you prefer the M, however. Either way, good choices to have.

[Deda]

cool review!

[mapezzul]

Originally Posted by devo

Modern 911s, especially C4s, stick very well. Contemporary PSM is designed to offer more driver latitude while cornering aggressivey. It interveened too early in the 996 and early 997 models. I am curious though if the PS2s were warmed up and/or if the outside temp. was warm enough to expect adequate grip.

The 911 with PSM is more like the ///M with MDM active. The temps outside are way too cold for summer tires to provide any grip, I can spin my M with the slightest blip of the throttle.... still waiting on those snows!

Love the 911, totally unique feel but priced a bit high when compared to the M3, though if you compare it to the M6 there is no reason not to get the P-car.

[PunjabiM3]

Originally Posted by devo

Modern 911s, especially C4s, stick very well. Contemporary PSM is designed to offer more driver latitude while cornering aggressivey. It interveened too early in the 996 and early 997 models. I am curious though if the PS2s were warmed up and/or if the outside temp. was warm enough to expect adequate grip.

DI has taken some of the engine's unique raspiness away. Add Porsche's Sport Exhaust option and the sound will become music to your ears. The new engine's power is exceptional, torque is very abundant.

You should test drive a C2S. Imo, there is really no need for a C4S, just more weight and more of a drain on horsepower. You can easily order a very well equipped C2S PDK for $101,000 MSRP, with some unnecessary options, $98,000 without; which is comparably equipped to the M. It sounds like you prefer the M, however. Either way, good choices to have.

Or you could wait a year and pick up a slightly used 911 for low to mid 70s.

[mkoesel]

Originally Posted by whym3

Few questions for existing m3 conv owners
1) How is the car from Rattles and Mpg perspective?

Fuel efficiency is similar to coupe from what I have read around here for comparison. I get about 220-240 miles per tank in the winter. I usually let it go til the computer reads just a few miles left before I fill up.

As for rattles they are minimal, but I do have a few squeaks from the rubber seals in the top, and the occasional high pitched vibe. These vary greatly depending on speed, road surface, and temperature.

2) Upgarded audio worth it?

Don't have it. I am fine with my radio though, sounds about like the old Harmon Kardon system I had in the E46.

3) How is the Wind draft with all wndows up and without wind blocker- tried a 3 series conv a few mnths ago without W blcocker and it felt draft free- dont like to use the wind blocker

It's pretty gusty. Maybe a bit less than the E46 cab as I recall it.

4) Debating between SSii and Space gray

The choice is easy: Interlagos.

[rouxeny]

I have an abundance of rattles in my E93. There's an odd thunk from the right front when I go over bumps and the right rear window has developed a very annoying squeak. There are also some grease deposits on it, so clearly something is not entirely in alignment.

I haven't ever owned a convertible before, but all in all, I'm disappointed by the amount of creaks coming from this one.

Performance wise, etc, the car is awesome.

[darkalley]

Not sure where you are in NJ but if you haven't seen SSII in person I park mine in Parsippany NJ most days.... I live in Peapack NJ. I have the base audio and I think it is fine.

[apexi]

Originally Posted by whym3

I used to own a 6 speed cayman S and before that an E46 M3 SMG


Few questions for existing m3 conv owners
1) How is the car from Rattles and Mpg perspective?
2) Upgarded audio worth it?
3) How is the Wind draft with all wndows up and without wind blocker- tried a 3 series conv a few mnths ago without W blcocker and it felt draft free- dont like to use the wind blocker
4) Debating between SSii and Space gray


Thx for any feedback

If you have any doubts, you should take a peek at this thread and perhaps it'll help tip you:
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=184294

1] no noticeable rattles...very solid ride for a hardtop conv. MPG don't expect much in this dept, same as any other high performance car.
2] I got the upgraded audio and it sounds great, but to be totally honest, I constantly turn it down just to hear the engine. LOL
3] Wind draft is not too bad for a guy, but expectations will be different for females. The wind blocker supposedly works like magic even at highway speeds.

[devo]

Originally Posted by PunjabiM3

Or you could wait a year and pick up a slightly used 911 for low to mid 70s.

Certainly, there will be deals in a year, but I don't believe you'll see the low $70s on a $100k car that soon. Probably, not far off though; more like 20% depreciation; high $70s to low $80s.) Hopefully, due to the fact that Porsche has dramatically cut production of the 911 will slow a small portion of that depreciation. (i.e. My dealer typically gets about 10 C2Ss annually. Their allocation was cut to 4.)

Of course, if you wait another MY2008 DCT M3 coupes will bring somewhere in the upper $40s to $50k.

That's my plan anyway, get my ordered C2S this spring, then trade the current 335 dd for an M dd in the following year. Best of both worlds, I think.

[WCH]

We have a '07 E93 335 and an '08 E92 M3 (SSII).

The E93 has slowly developed rattles but fortunately not the pressure waves that others have reported (there's a long thread on this at bimmerfest). From what I have read, this problem does not seem to occur in the E93 M3 - possibly because the suspension is different. The rattles we have we can live with and come and go - it's worse in the cold and we never had rattles with the top down.

The enhanced audio in the M3 is very good - better than the logic 7 in the 335.

It's not too drafty with the top down. You can make it better by putting up the windows though some people don't like the look. The windscreen works well and provides the most benefit when you are on the highway.

SSII is a great color.

[CATAHOULA]

1) No rattles at all

2) I don't think the indv audio is worth it - that's prob the one option I could easily do without

3) I don't love the wind blocker and only use on the highway - but when I'm at speed for long stretches I'm very happy to have it

4) I went back and forth between SG and SSII myself... I went with SSII but sometimes still wonder if I made the right choice. I think SSII looks better MOST of the time (in flat light, with dirt, etc.) - but in the right light SG looks awesome. SSII works better with the chromeline trim.

[CUD]

1. No rattles
2. Worth the money for the individual sound
3. Better than other convertibles. If you keep it at 65 mph or lower you should be fine but for longer rides the wind blocker would be helpful.It is on my wish list.
4. Color - Your choice. I have the AW

Overall, the best car I have ever driven. I love every moment of it!!!!
Enjoy this beautiful peace of machinary.

[arr0gant]

M3 > all 911's except GT3 and up!!

Coming from a guy that owned a 996 911 Turbo and really wanted to move to a newer Porsche. Once I drove the M3, there was no Porsche in my $ range that came close to my $70k M3 Sedan.

Originally Posted by CUD

Overall, the best car I have ever driven. I love every moment of it!!!!
Enjoy this beautiful peace of machinary.

Yes!! I agree with this 100%!!

[kmac1980]

Originally Posted by slammedm3

1) i also have a subwoofer in my trunk

hey man, do you have pics of your sub setup, and what sub/amp are you using?

[kbk_75]

OT, but I went on a nice long drive with a friend's 997 Turbo and my M3 last morning. Had a blast! To say that I am completely blown away by the Turbo's launch control would be the understatement to end them all. Absolutely no fuss, no wheel-spin, nothing but unbelievable acceleration! I was also amazed by the brakes on that car and just the general level of grip. Brilliant car! I love my M3 and it's a far better daily driver in my conditions, but that Porsche has just rewritten the rule book for me!

[arr0gant]

Originally Posted by kbk_75

OT, but I went on a nice long drive with a friend's 997 Turbo and my M3 last morning. Had a blast! To say that I am completely blown away by the Turbo's launch control would be the understatement to end them all. Absolutely no fuss, no wheel-spin, nothing but unbelievable acceleration! I was also amazed by the brakes on that car and just the general level of grip. Brilliant car! I love my M3 and it's a far better daily driver in my conditions, but that Porsche has just rewritten the rule book for me!

Agreed, 997 Turbo/GT3, whole 'nother league!!

[kbk_75]

P.S. I also realised just HOW thirsty the M3s are. I emptied my tank on the drive, he had around a 1/4 tank left, tank size is more or less the same!