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      08-12-2014, 01:22 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LiM3y View Post
Try driving at 80% for a session and see if you see the same relative difference in temps. You might need to soften the nut behind the steering wheel before softening the rear suspension. Even if softening the suspension works, you might just create a band-aid that limits future growth, so you need to know if it is due to style or equipment.
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Originally Posted by marksae View Post
Laguna is really hard on brakes. Our heavy cars generate a lot of heat through the brakes, especially going into Turn 2. That'll definitely increase your tire pressures.
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Originally Posted by marksae View Post
Also, since you've just moved up to R-comps. R-comps works brakes much harder due to all the extra grip. That'll contribute to your issue as well.
the bbk has help quite a bit with laguna for sure!!!!! well ill try lowering the psi and tightening the rear and see what happens then go from there... also brake earlier going into turn 2...
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      08-12-2014, 02:25 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Sebringjetta View Post
kw cs 2.0 front and rear. rear toe .2 . i try and get an alignment one time every other month. i track 2 times a month and with all the other additional cost there is no way to do an alignment for every track day.
In the front I run camber of -2.0 on the street but go up to -2.8 on the track. I still see outside tire wear (but far less than when I kept my camber at -2.0). I would think more camber would help with front end grip thereby reducing under-steer. MRF has set up my suspension to have something like 0 toe at -2.0 and adjusting camber adds some toe... or subtracts; can't remember. I don't perform an alignment when adjusting my camber. Since your car is primarily used on the track, I would consider setting up your suspension with -2.8ish (or more) and just leave it...

FWIW I'm running staggered wheels / tires and was actually experiencing over-steer on my last track day... but I had just added adjustable sways and ran with Euro MDM for the first time. The sway bars introduced another level of suspension tuning which is more than I honestly need...
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Last edited by slicer; 08-12-2014 at 02:31 PM..
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      08-12-2014, 08:10 PM   #25
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well i know you understand tires so ill try 34 in 2 weeks when i go and see what happens... ill shoot you a txt.. still want to see those wets!!!!!
Try 35 first and see if your faster. I dropped decent time going from 38-39 to 34-35. Am I supposed to post my Hoosiers? What about the hankook's?
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      08-12-2014, 11:28 PM   #26
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Correct your lack of negative camber up front before anything else. -2.8 will be better but still push a little.
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      08-13-2014, 10:41 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by PrimeBMW View Post
Correct your lack of negative camber up front before anything else. -2.8 will be better but still push a little.
im wondering if i did my kw cs install wrong or somting... the most i can get is 2.0
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      08-13-2014, 10:51 AM   #28
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Don't know about kw but would think you could get close to -4 with some lowering. My mcs I'm at -3.5 and could get almost -4.5 if I wanted.
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      08-13-2014, 11:18 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD View Post
Don't know about kw but would think you could get close to -4 with some lowering. My mcs I'm at -3.5 and could get almost -4.5 if I wanted.
ill have to look more into it
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      08-13-2014, 11:37 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebringjetta View Post
im wondering if i did my kw cs install wrong or somting... the most i can get is 2.0
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Originally Posted by Sebringjetta View Post
ill have to look more into it
I'm at -2.8 maximum without dropping the suspension (You are limited by the shock tower opening - in other words the opening is only large enough to move the camber adjustment so far before screws are unreachable). Even more camber can be achieved if you unscrew the top mounts from the car, adjust camber, then re-install top mounts. Ride height is also a factor; as 1MOREMOD stated.
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      08-13-2014, 12:46 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slicer View Post
I'm at -2.8 maximum without dropping the suspension (You are limited by the shock tower opening - in other words the opening is only large enough to move the camber adjustment so far before screws are unreachable). Even more camber can be achieved if you unscrew the top mounts from the car, adjust camber, then re-install top mounts. Ride height is also a factor; as 1MOREMOD stated.
Can also grind out the opening so have access from the top and more adjustment is available.
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      08-13-2014, 12:57 PM   #32
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Quote:
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Can also grind out the opening so have access from the top and more adjustment is available.
you do this on yours?
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      08-13-2014, 01:23 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebringjetta View Post
you do this on yours?
not yet. if i go to more extreme camber i will have to. doubt i will need as much camber though once on those c51s and r1s.
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      08-13-2014, 01:29 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD View Post
Can also grind out the opening so have access from the top and more adjustment is available.
Yes I'm running KW CS at -2,9 fronts and can't adjust bc of the opening like he stated also....but it's for track only so I just leave it like that...did grinding work out for easy access for you bc I thought about doing the same....thanks in advance
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      08-13-2014, 01:53 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1MOREMOD View Post
Can also grind out the opening so have access from the top and more adjustment is available.
I don't like that idea. That would weaken the shock tower. The only way I would consider it would be if I were to weld in a reinforcement plate.

Edit - not only that but the strut tower brace is in the way as well. This has to be the worst idea you have ever dreamed up!

Picture borrowed from JMEllis:


Camber Plate by JMEllis, on Flickr
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Last edited by slicer; 08-13-2014 at 02:11 PM..
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      08-13-2014, 01:57 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slicer View Post
I don't like that idea. That would weaken the shock tower. The only way I would consider it would be if I were to weld in a reinforcement plate.
This is what I was scared of and wondering if anyone did it, good point
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      08-13-2014, 02:43 PM   #37
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Lots of in-depth analysis on this thread, but I wonder if the reason is simply that front tires are used more/works harder in track conditions (in fact, if left unchanged over a number of events, the fronts will wear out much quicker than rears), along with OP reporting "alot of under steer."

The latter is classic example exhibited among beginner/beg-intermediate drivers. Gotta learn to 'slow in fast out' and trail brake effectively so as not to push the front tires thru corners.
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Last edited by OC3; 08-13-2014 at 02:50 PM..
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      08-13-2014, 02:46 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slicer View Post
I don't like that idea. That would weaken the shock tower. The only way I would consider it would be if I were to weld in a reinforcement plate.

Edit - not only that but the strut tower brace is in the way as well. This has to be the worst idea you have ever dreamed up!

Picture borrowed from JMEllis:


Camber Plate by JMEllis, on Flickr
seen it done on lots of track cars. yes you should have some other support in place. strut tower brace and cage can easily make up for the slight weakening.
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      08-13-2014, 03:26 PM   #39
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Simple. MCS with GC camber plates.
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      08-13-2014, 07:22 PM   #40
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If you're at -2.0 on an E46 M3 with NT01s...that would explain a lot. You need more camber.

And stiffening up your rear shocks will only make the problem worse.
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      08-13-2014, 11:29 PM   #41
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You need some more hard data otherwise you are throwing darts. I could have loaned you my pyrometer that day and helped you with tire temps. Look me up at the next event and I'll help get you dialed in..
Do you have any video from the day?
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      08-14-2014, 01:39 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickyBobby View Post
You need some more hard data otherwise you are throwing darts. I could have loaned you my pyrometer that day and helped you with tire temps. Look me up at the next event and I'll help get you dialed in..
Do you have any video from the day?
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      08-14-2014, 04:06 AM   #43
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fuck me, running 37-38psi hot on nt01 with this car is forum BS. Try 30-32 hot, day and night difference in grip.
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      08-14-2014, 09:42 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slicer View Post
I don't like that idea. That would weaken the shock tower. The only way I would consider it would be if I were to weld in a reinforcement plate.

Edit - not only that but the strut tower brace is in the way as well. This has to be the worst idea you have ever dreamed up!

Picture borrowed from JMEllis:


Camber Plate by JMEllis, on Flickr
good point!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! i always bring my good ideas to you so you can tell me all the reasons why i shouldnt... then after hearing your reasoning i begin to realize im glad i got your opinion
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