How many of you seriously considered the Mercedes C63?

[Hans Delbruck]

Originally Posted by swamp2

heck, I'd go for an overnight or weekend trade! I need some new rears pretty badly as well. Cheers.

Sounds like a plan. I'll probably use my rears til they cord too busy to deal with tires at the moment!

[swamp2]

Originally Posted by Hans Delbruck

Sounds like a plan. I'll probably use my rears til they cord too busy to deal with tires at the moment!

I'm serious. I would go for a weekend trade! I'll also be running my rears til I see cords. Cheers.

[M3 Montreal]

Originally Posted by MikeG_C63_AMG

+1

CLK63 Black Series over an C63/M3 anytime. I only seen one on the road in real life. I was actually walking on the street. The sight of such a DTM style wide body car is truly amazing.

I love the C63 but sorry... there are SOOOooo many other cars I would rather have before the clk63 black series for that price. The Audi R8 with the new V10 for instance and I would still have money left to pick up a C63.

[JattM3]

I looked at both and spent a long time researching both. We have 2 mercs and long term I know how they turn out. but the engine in the c63 is simply brilliant.

my decision for the m3 can be summarized in the following points.

at he end of the day the c63 is a tuned car.
80% of the components in the M3 were designed specifically for it. meaning you will get the full experience with the M3.

other than the McLaren SLR, AMG's first PRODUCTION car that was completely designed from the ground up is the new SL63 AMG Black Series. I think it only shares the doors from the original SL car. but it will set you back 200-250k

I dont mean to smash on MB and AMG but Merc does what it does best.... that is making the S and E class.

Let BMW handle the Ultimate Driving Experience.

If you have not checked out the BMW M3 experience from BMWusa.com check it out below. Its only about 30 minutes.

http://www.bmwusa.com/Standard/Conte...lore.aspx#Home

[darkearth]

^^Actually, the c63 is reportedly the first amg to be designed ground up by AMG themselves whereas previous AMG's essentially featured bolt-on performance mod's....

[Nawaaz]

Originally Posted by darkearth

^^Actually, the c63 is reportedly the first amg to be designed ground up by AMG themselves whereas previous AMG's essentially featured bolt-on performance mod's....

That's what I thought also. All I know is that the engine is handmade by AMG.

But I think he means that the M3 uses more upgraded/different performance components compared to a regualr 3 series, whereas the C63 doesn't change as much compared to a regular C-Class. Don't get me wrong, the C63 is a totally different car compared to a regular C-Class of course.

[MikeG_C63_AMG]

Originally Posted by JattM3

I looked at both and spent a long time researching both. We have 2 mercs and long term I know how they turn out. but the engine in the c63 is simply brilliant.

my decision for the m3 can be summarized in the following points.

at he end of the day the c63 is a tuned car.
80% of the components in the M3 were designed specifically for it. meaning you will get the full experience with the M3.

other than the McLaren SLR, AMG's first PRODUCTION car that was completely designed from the ground up is the new SL63 AMG Black Series. I think it only shares the doors from the original SL car. but it will set you back 200-250k

I dont mean to smash on MB and AMG but Merc does what it does best.... that is making the S and E class.

Let BMW handle the Ultimate Driving Experience.

If you have not checked out the BMW M3 experience from BMWusa.com check it out below. Its only about 30 minutes.

http://www.bmwusa.com/Standard/Conte...lore.aspx#Home

These statements are incorrect.

[MikeG_C63_AMG]

Originally Posted by darkearth

^^Actually, the c63 is reportedly the first amg to be designed ground up by AMG themselves whereas previous AMG's essentially featured bolt-on performance mod's....

Correct.

[MikeG_C63_AMG]

Originally Posted by Nawaaz

That's what I thought also. All I know is that the engine is handmade by AMG.

But I think he means that the M3 uses more upgraded/different performance components compared to a regualr 3 series, whereas the C63 doesn't change as much compared to a regular C-Class. Don't get me wrong, the C63 is a totally different car compared to a regular C-Class of course.

Your right. The M3 has a lot more different parts as compared to the regular 3 series vs the C63 and a regular C-Class. Its should be noted everything pass the front doors of the C63 is completely different and unique to the car.

[Nawaaz]

Originally Posted by MikeG_C63_AMG

Your right. The M3 has a lot more different parts as compared to the regular 3 series vs the C63 and a regular C-Class. Its should be noted everything pass the front doors of the C63 is completely different and unique to the car.

Awesome, thanks Mike!

[stickypaws]

Despite public opinion, AMGs are more than just a motor. Suspension, brakes, interiors, seats, and exterior body parts are different from the non-AMGs. And then there's transmission and steering tuning.

Beyond engine power, my E63 is a much different car than the standard E Class I used to own.

[330CIZHP]

There.

Originally Posted by MikeG_C63_AMG

1. I take then a M-DCT equipped M3 you will never buy correct even though its the most desirable option let alone makes the car quicker?

Correct. Like I mentioned before. I need to be driving the car, which both of my legs and both of my arms need to be feverishly working when I truly feel enthusiastic and excited about driving. Sitting in a comfy chair flicking paddles with two fingers is not my thing for super smooth shifts. I get bored with it after a month or so.

2. To each there own. Yes when I had my E46 M3 revving it to 8000rpm was enjoying so I can only imagine 8400rpm. An active Auto Werke exhaust for the E92 M3 is $2700 as quoted on there website. For that price I can get a Kleemann ECU plus remove my resonator or secondary cats and be at 520+ HP (depending on final dyno results after deletion of resonator/ secondary cats). This simple mod will already make an already astonishing OEM Exhaust even more throaty and louder. These mods not to mention can be achieved for under $2700.

You could be right about the tuning part. Then again, I might also prefer a GT3 997.2 over a 997 Turbo any day of the week. I am sure the M3 gains a fairly decent amount as well with exhaust, ECU somewhere to the tune of 470 - 480 HP while about 380 - 390 wheel HP assuming a consistently 16 - 18% drivetrain loss. Then again, nothing beats the sound and feel of revving up to 8500 rpm. I personally take high revs over low end torque any day.



3. I'm not denying weight offers a negative effect on a sports car, however honestly how much do you plan on tracking (not the drag strip) your car? Being optimistic I would say if 5% of your total time driving the car was on a track you would far exceed the MAJORITY of M3 owners. Also can you tell me how much time you have behind the wheel of a C63, new CTS-V, and IS-F? I find it very hypocritical to make comments in regards to handling of a car especially if you never driven one. Do you realize the before mention cars make excellent Daily Drivers/Weekend Joy Riding as I'm willing to bet over 95% of there customers who purchase them intend to use them for.

It is not about tracking or driving on the streets. I have driven both cars for about 1 hour or so. In general, I just hate driving a car that has so much inertia, mass and heft to overcome especially when driving in tight small turns and where quick maneuverability is concerned in tight areas. That is what made the E30 M3 great. Now, the new M3 is pushing the limits by stepping into the 3400 - 3500 lbs region. No matter what is done to the car, the weight will show especially when it is a massive difference of over 500 pounds. It WILL affect nimbleness, light-on-its feel regardless of how well the car is tuned. There are no two ways about it. I would pick up a high powered car with lightweight over a higher powered car, but with a lot more heft to overcome much of the weight hangs over and after the front axle, unfortunately. CTS-V and C63 carry their weight very well, I must say, but a car of only this size and dimensions weighing over 4000 lbs is just downright disgusting. I am sure there are people out there that enjoy the commanding feeling of mass and size especially at places like autobahns etc. I am just not one of them.

[bimmerj]

Originally Posted by stickypaws

Despite public opinion, AMGs are more than just a motor. Suspension, brakes, interiors, seats, and exterior body parts are different from the non-AMGs. And then there's transmission and steering tuning.

Beyond engine power, my E63 is a much different car than the standard E Class I used to own.

I always bought BMWs, but my AMG is heaven. I love it. I had it parked last week outside a community center and I heard some of the guys, just screaming, look at the size of the f*****g brakes man . I love it

[MikeG_C63_AMG]

Originally Posted by 330CIZHP

There.

1. I take then a M-DCT equipped M3 you will never buy correct even though its the most desirable option let alone makes the car quicker?

Correct. Like I mentioned before. I need to be driving the car, which both of my legs and both of my arms need to be feverishly working when I truly feel enthusiastic and excited about driving. Sitting in a comfy chair flicking paddles with two fingers is not my thing for super smooth shifts. I get bored with it after a month or so.

Fair enough. Everyone has different preferences.

2. To each there own. Yes when I had my E46 M3 revving it to 8000rpm was enjoying so I can only imagine 8400rpm. An active Auto Werke exhaust for the E92 M3 is $2700 as quoted on there website. For that price I can get a Kleemann ECU plus remove my resonator or secondary cats and be at 520+ HP (depending on final dyno results after deletion of resonator/ secondary cats). This simple mod will already make an already astonishing OEM Exhaust even more throaty and louder. These mods not to mention can be achieved for under $2700.

You could be right about the tuning part. Then again, I might also prefer a GT3 997.2 over a 997 Turbo any day of the week. I am sure the M3 gains a fairly decent amount as well with exhaust, ECU somewhere to the tune of 470 - 480 HP while about 380 - 390 wheel HP assuming a consistently 16 - 18% drivetrain loss. Then again, nothing beats the sound and feel of revving up to 8500 rpm. I personally take high revs over low end torque any day.

I am right about the tuning part. I made numerous post backing up this point. What does a GT3 or 911TT have to do with anything? Your talking about cars at a COMPLETELY different price range. Your obviously not familiar with tuning of the S65B40 engine. Nobody on this forum has been able to provide dyno graphs in regards to your claims for HP based on a ECU and exhaust modification. They are not realistic. You do realize the M156 engine is really a 510+ hp engine but electronically detuned to 451 in the C63. Not to mention a MB tuner in Cali, VRP ,has provided dyno graphs that show an increase oh 18rwp in a M156 engine once the charcoal filters were removed (similar to M V10 engine). Again there is nothing wrong with enjoying a high revving engine.

3. I'm not denying weight offers a negative effect on a sports car, however honestly how much do you plan on tracking (not the drag strip) your car? Being optimistic I would say if 5% of your total time driving the car was on a track you would far exceed the MAJORITY of M3 owners. Also can you tell me how much time you have behind the wheel of a C63, new CTS-V, and IS-F? I find it very hypocritical to make comments in regards to handling of a car especially if you never driven one. Do you realize the before mention cars make excellent Daily Drivers/Weekend Joy Riding as I'm willing to bet over 95% of there customers who purchase them intend to use them for.

It is not about tracking or driving on the streets. I have driven both cars for about 1 hour or so. In general, I just hate driving a car that has so much inertia, mass and heft to overcome especially when driving in tight small turns and where quick maneuverability is concerned in tight areas. That is what made the E30 M3 great. Now, the new M3 is pushing the limits by stepping into the 3400 - 3500 lbs region. No matter what is done to the car, the weight will show especially when it is a massive difference of over 500 pounds. It WILL affect nimbleness, light-on-its feel regardless of how well the car is tuned. There are no two ways about it. I would pick up a high powered car with lightweight over a higher powered car, but with a lot more heft to overcome much of the weight hangs over and after the front axle, unfortunately. CTS-V and C63 carry their weight very well, I must say, but a car of only this size and dimensions weighing over 4000 lbs is just downright disgusting. I am sure there are people out there that enjoy the commanding feeling of mass and size especially at places like autobahns etc. I am just not one of them.

You must have nice friends for them to let you drive their new CTS-V and C63 for an hour cause frankly I don't believe at all that happened at a dealership. Do you think your 330 is comparable in handling to those cars? I understand and agree with your comments about the E30 M3. However the C63 and CTS-V both offer 54/46 weight distribution so I wouldn't go as far to say much of the weight is over the front axle. They aren't Audi's. Are you sure you actually did drive both of these cars for an hour? Something smells fishy here.

[Sincity]

I have been on the fence with this one for a little while here. Both vehicles have their merits. For me, I have always wanted an AMG back since the Hammer days in the 80s. In the end, the grunt of the 6.2l and ease of making it a 520 crank HP vehicle with a single flash appealed to me. As stated prior, these are detuned motors on the C. The deal was sealed when I got almost $14k off MSRP during last months "AMG sale" on brand new 2009s. Now that is a deal you can't beat.