Broken engine mount

gadget · 04-16-2010, 07:42 PM

So I already had the engine malfunction / reduced power problem... (faulty actuator valve replaced)

and the clicking rotors (replaced)

So this is my third big issue...

Under WOT on first gear, I heard a strange sound between 5k RPM and readline. Thought it might have been the clutch slipping, or the LSD grinding or a damaged intake. It was hard to isolate. and sounded pretty bad.

Worried I came to M3 post looked up "strange engine sound". The search resulted in a thread by Mixja (M3 post member from NZ) who had the same issue and after six weeks of troubleshooting at the discovered his engine mount broken. The sound was the engine rubbing under load against another part.

I was then able to go to the dealer with a good hypothesis which the dealer quickly confirmed. They have ordered the engine mounts (They will replace both which should arrive there Monday.) They will also do a full check to make sure nothing was damaged. ( I have a great dealership, and always have the car serviced by their expert ///M mechanic.)

So what have these three issues taught me:

1) The M is not the most reliable car but it is by the most amazing piece of machinery I have ever owned.

I believe in the performance / reliability equation of greater performance = greater reliability risk. Think F1 vs Corrola.

2) The

on M3 post is awesome and should be used more often. Our collective know-how is awesome. Special thanks to Mixja on this one

3) Having a good dealer is so important. Building a strong relationship with them with a good attitude is even more important. I could have saved some money by buying at another local dealer but know they are sub par in service. The savings are not worth it... being rude to SA's is not going to get you anything.

4) In the end, these things always have a resolution. There is no need to get all angry and stressed

So bottom line,

I love my M3 and look forward to getting it back next week so I can continue to drive it like i stole it.

BCA · 04-16-2010, 07:55 PM

Good post. I hope you get your M back and running well soon!

Just curious...has anything at all happened to your car that you think may have caused the problem? Hard driving, launches, hit something hard on the road while driving, anything?

Also, how many miles on your car?

gadget · 04-16-2010, 08:05 PM

Thanks.

About 25k miles since Oct.09. Never hit anything. I push the car to the limit. Floor it every change I get. I have a lot of very smooth curvy roads (through the hills) near my house i run the car on. Use LC on occasion. A few peel outs.

In any case, seem like a manufacturing defect. The car should be able to hold up at the limit. I take great car of my car. No one else drives it.

VanM3Lover · 04-16-2010, 11:07 PM

Good to hear you are getting your problems resolved quickly. Just a question, when you say "the clicking rotors", do you mean the metallic clicking from the front rotors when the car is parked after driving? I am just wondering if this is a defect because my car does it every day. Thanks!

mixja · 04-17-2010, 01:16 AM

Glad my post was of help.

Service Agent, who I know is in the track racing scene (he has a heavily modified R33 GT-R), said the engine mounts were pretty tame looking and he wasn't surprised they had broken.

I get the clicking rotors very occasionally...

gadget · 04-17-2010, 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VanM3Lover

Good to hear you are getting your problems resolved quickly. Just a question, when you say "the clicking rotors", do you mean the metallic clicking from the front rotors when the car is parked after driving? I am just wondering if this is a defect because my car does it every day. Thanks!

No- That sound is normal. The clicking sound is heard during hard cornering from the front of the car. It is casued by the rivets that hold the two peices together (floating rotors are two pieces). The dealer replaced the two front rotors under warranty. Don't recall where but I've read that this is not uncommon and is an inherent side effect of the design of Floating (two-piece) rotors.

J08M3 · 04-17-2010, 07:30 PM

damn, broken motor mount on a fairly new car.... post a pic if you can when they change it. I want to see what happened.

VanM3Lover · 04-17-2010, 09:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gadget

No- That sound is normal. The clicking sound is heard during hard cornering from the front of the car. It is casued by the rivets that hold the two peices together (floating rotors are two pieces). The dealer replaced the two front rotors under warranty. Don't recall where but I've read that this is not uncommon and is an inherent side effect of the design of Floating (two-piece) rotors.

Thanks so much Gadget! I have nothing to worry about now!

gadget · 04-18-2010, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by J08M3

damn, broken motor mount on a fairly new car.... post a pic if you can when they change it. I want to see what happened.

They were able to change them out very quickly. Didn't get a chance to see. The SA said it was easy to spot due to the hydraulic fluid splatter...

positiveions · 04-18-2010, 09:21 PM

that's the good spirit lad. You are right, no //M cars are bullet proof. They all have issues. I had an E36 OBD I M3 with a misfiring issue. Couldn't solve it; but we got it down to one of the coils that was improperly misfiring. You have to be patient with these cars. They need TLC.

JCtx · 04-18-2010, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gadget

The clicking sound is heard during hard cornering from the front of the car. It is casued by the rivets that hold the two peices together (floating rotors are two pieces).

Keep in mind there's a TSB for the front rotor covers in '08 and some '09 cars with EXACTLY those symptoms. The offending covers are silver, and the updated ones black. I have the silver ones, but don't push the car hard, and have no issues. I've never read the rotors themselves making the noise you describe, but you could be right. I'd get the covers replaced and see if that solves the problem. Search for the TSB (or SIB) #.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gadget

The SA said it was easy to spot due to the hydraulic fluid splatter...

Does the M3 have hydraulic motor mounts? I thought they were solid. No need for that with a smooth-running 90º V8. Somebody please confirm. Curious to know.

Definitive · 11-01-2010, 09:48 PM

Wow, I am going to have to take my car in ASAP. I have this same exact symptoms, and was about to post it to see if anyone knew anything.

I will be amazed if its a broken motor mount. But sounds exactly like what you had, and happened all of a sudden, just like you.

Im going to SEMA so I wont be able to take it in till next week. But I hope they can fix it quick. Anything to actually look for under the hood to see if I can see the prob?

D

Ricfutures · 11-01-2010, 09:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gadget

3) Having a good dealer is so important. Building a strong relationship with them with a good attitude is even more important. I could have saved some money by buying at another local dealer but know they are sub par in service. The savings are not worth it... being rude to SA's is not going to get you anything.

Very true.

JCtx · 11-01-2010, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gadget

They were able to change them out very quickly. Didn't get a chance to see. The SA said it was easy to spot due to the hydraulic fluid splatter...

You never came back to answer our questions

. Do you at least know which mount was bad? Thx.

Definitive · 11-08-2010, 04:42 PM

Went to the dealer this morning. They put my car on a lift and found some hydraulic fluid. He said hes not sure but didnt want to rip everything apart without having the replacement parts there.

So they gave me the car back and ordered a new motor mount. Sounds like it will be fixed soon. I think it wasent as obvious because its been about 2 weeks for me to be able to get to the dealer, and its rained a good amount in that time. Probably washed off a good amount of the fluid that was there.

D

Definitive · 11-28-2010, 06:07 PM

Well The car went to the dealer again after the parts came in. To my surprise they said the mounts were fine once they got to them. They found that the large black protection piece under the engine was loose. He said all the bolts were falling out.

He asked me who had worked on my engine, and since its stock, I told him no one. He was amazed at the loose bolts. Said he tightened them to spec and the noise/vibration/grinding should be gone.

He wanted me to test it as he didnt feel right going WOT on local streets to test it out. We went for a ride after and of course, who knows why, it didnt seem like it was there. I thought I felt it, but it wasent like before.

Well after a week of driving the car it is back full force. Very obvious and really is scaring me. I have no clue now what it could be...

Im waiting for my SA to get back to me on what the plan is.

D

Mace · 11-28-2010, 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by elp_jc

Does the M3 have hydraulic motor mounts? I thought they were solid. No need for that with a smooth-running 90º V8. Somebody please confirm. Curious to know.

Even a V8 will have some vibration but I suspect the most likely reason they'd be used in this case is noise suppression. Harley Davidson did a lot of work on this when they replaced the V Twin Evolution engine with the Twin-Cam engine. There are many sources of noise besides the obvious ones of exhaust and intake such as timing chains and gearing. HD wanted to keep as much of the "good" noise (exhaust and intake) by reducing the nasty, buzzy, box of rocks stuff. Lots of the excessive noise is caused by vibration of internal parts being transmited directly into the engine case and and covers and then the atmosphere. Their strategy was to minimize direct metal-to-metal contact between internal noise sources and the outer engine case and covers. The same would be true where the engine transmits its internal noise via hard mounts directly into the chassis/body. Hydraulic mounts would help to isolate that noise. I've seen several auto magazine reviews of the Nissan Z where they specifically point out the raucous and unpleasant sound of the engine. This may be due, at least in part, to poor isolation between the engine and chassis.

M3maniac20 · 11-28-2010, 09:15 PM

Agreed-Good post. THANK YOU for not totally bashing everyone in your way because of your problem! What a refreshing way to handle an issue!
And totally agreed about your reliability to fun ratio-sure the BMW will have its glitches-but its like having a high maintenance wife/family member...you still love them no matter what.

Where you are located as far as dealership? I'm looking forward to dealing with BMW of Austin if I have issues...I hear nothing but praises coming out of there and it is one of the top rated in the nation. Always comforting to hear.

MRSSIIM3 · 05-30-2011, 12:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Definitive

Well The car went to the dealer again after the parts came in. To my surprise they said the mounts were fine once they got to them. They found that the large black protection piece under the engine was loose. He said all the bolts were falling out.

He asked me who had worked on my engine, and since its stock, I told him no one. He was amazed at the loose bolts. Said he tightened them to spec and the noise/vibration/grinding should be gone.

He wanted me to test it as he didnt feel right going WOT on local streets to test it out. We went for a ride after and of course, who knows why, it didnt seem like it was there. I thought I felt it, but it wasent like before.

Well after a week of driving the car it is back full force. Very obvious and really is scaring me. I have no clue now what it could be...

Im waiting for my SA to get back to me on what the plan is.

D

bumping to see if everything was resolved

something similar is happening to me. if im in 1st gear and easy on the throttle then floor it at 4k its almost as if something is hitting something else in the engine bay and the gas pedal gets a weird feeling. not sure what to do

Definitive · 05-30-2011, 12:48 AM

This has not been resolved, My dealer tells me its too dangerous to replicate, since you have to basically drag the car to feel it. So I'm stuck with it for now. Not sure WTF to do.

Where are you located, maybe we can team up at the same dealer...

D

MRSSIIM3 · 05-30-2011, 01:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Definitive

This has not been resolved, My dealer tells me its too dangerous to replicate, since you have to basically drag the car to feel it. So I'm stuck with it for now. Not sure WTF to do.

Where are you located, maybe we can team up at the same dealer...

D

im in newport beach what about you?

im really frustrated by this. im not sure if its randomly starting to occur of what the deal is. i was taking a turn slowly then mashed it through gear 1 and things just felt weird

what exactly is going on with yours? do you get a similar weird pedal feel and a thumping noise? i should note that if i floor it from a stop in gear 1 it wont make a sound but being but if i floor it from about 10-15 mph in 1st gear then it makes the issue

MRSSIIM3 · 05-30-2011, 01:51 AM

update: just drove again and did some spiritful driving hoping maybe that will fix something and the jerk is gone. i feel like maybe the tires were cold and it was some sort of wheel hop or something. now i still get a wierd sound from 5k to redline in gear 1. it sounds like something is going way too intense than normal and theres a deeper sound than there used to be and its deeper than any of the other gears. it just sounds different gear 1 5k-8k rpm than gears 2-7 5k-8k rpm

is this exactly the problem youre having?

04-16-2010, 07:42 PM	#1
gadget Major 108 Rep 1,161 Posts Drives: 09 e92///M SSII DCT Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: US iTrader: (0)	Broken engine mount So I already had the engine malfunction / reduced power problem... (faulty actuator valve replaced) and the clicking rotors (replaced) So this is my third big issue... Under WOT on first gear, I heard a strange sound between 5k RPM and readline. Thought it might have been the clutch slipping, or the LSD grinding or a damaged intake. It was hard to isolate. and sounded pretty bad. Worried I came to M3 post looked up "strange engine sound". The search resulted in a thread by Mixja (M3 post member from NZ) who had the same issue and after six weeks of troubleshooting at the discovered his engine mount broken. The sound was the engine rubbing under load against another part. I was then able to go to the dealer with a good hypothesis which the dealer quickly confirmed. They have ordered the engine mounts (They will replace both which should arrive there Monday.) They will also do a full check to make sure nothing was damaged. ( I have a great dealership, and always have the car serviced by their expert ///M mechanic.) So what have these three issues taught me: 1) The M is not the most reliable car but it is by the most amazing piece of machinery I have ever owned. I believe in the performance / reliability equation of greater performance = greater reliability risk. Think F1 vs Corrola. 2) The on M3 post is awesome and should be used more often. Our collective know-how is awesome. Special thanks to Mixja on this one 3) Having a good dealer is so important. Building a strong relationship with them with a good attitude is even more important. I could have saved some money by buying at another local dealer but know they are sub par in service. The savings are not worth it... being rude to SA's is not going to get you anything. 4) In the end, these things always have a resolution. There is no need to get all angry and stressed So bottom line, I love my M3 and look forward to getting it back next week so I can continue to drive it like i stole it. Last edited by gadget; 04-16-2010 at 08:06 PM..
	Appreciate 0 Tweet Quote

04-16-2010, 07:55 PM	#2
BCA Captain 21 Rep 793 Posts Drives: 2015 M3 Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Houston, TX iTrader: (1)	Good post. I hope you get your M back and running well soon! Just curious...has anything at all happened to your car that you think may have caused the problem? Hard driving, launches, hit something hard on the road while driving, anything? Also, how many miles on your car? __________________ 2017 Porsche 911 Carrera S 2019 Porsche Cayenne Past BMWs: 2015 M3, 2014 550i, 2013 M3 ZCP, 2012 535i, 2011 E90 335i, 2009 E90 M3, 2008 X5, 2006 330i, 2004 330i
	Appreciate 0 Quote

04-16-2010, 08:05 PM	#3
gadget Major 108 Rep 1,161 Posts Drives: 09 e92///M SSII DCT Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: US iTrader: (0)	Thanks. About 25k miles since Oct.09. Never hit anything. I push the car to the limit. Floor it every change I get. I have a lot of very smooth curvy roads (through the hills) near my house i run the car on. Use LC on occasion. A few peel outs. In any case, seem like a manufacturing defect. The car should be able to hold up at the limit. I take great car of my car. No one else drives it.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

04-16-2010, 11:07 PM	#4
VanM3Lover First Lieutenant 20 Rep 394 Posts Drives: 4.0 V8 Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Van iTrader: (0)	Good to hear you are getting your problems resolved quickly. Just a question, when you say "the clicking rotors", do you mean the metallic clicking from the front rotors when the car is parked after driving? I am just wondering if this is a defect because my car does it every day. Thanks!
	Appreciate 0 Quote

04-17-2010, 01:16 AM	#5
mixja Captain 50 Rep 780 Posts Drives: 2011 E90 DCT Silverstone Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Beverly Hils, CA iTrader: (1)	Glad my post was of help. Service Agent, who I know is in the track racing scene (he has a heavily modified R33 GT-R), said the engine mounts were pretty tame looking and he wasn't surprised they had broken. I get the clicking rotors very occasionally...
	Appreciate 0 Quote

04-17-2010, 07:30 PM	#7
J08M3 Major General 286 Rep 6,007 Posts Drives: 2011 M3 COUPE Join Date: May 2008 Location: NEW YORK iTrader: (8)	damn, broken motor mount on a fairly new car.... post a pic if you can when they change it. I want to see what happened. __________________
	Appreciate 0 Quote

04-18-2010, 09:21 PM	#10
positiveions Lieutenant General 961 Rep 11,722 Posts Drives: 19 Tacoma, 16 Golf wagon Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Upland, CA iTrader: (2) Garage List 2019 Toyota Tacoma [0.00] 2016 VW Golf Sports ... [0.00] 1998 BMW M3 [0.00] 1990 BMW 325is [0.00]	that's the good spirit lad. You are right, no //M cars are bullet proof. They all have issues. I had an E36 OBD I M3 with a misfiring issue. Couldn't solve it; but we got it down to one of the coils that was improperly misfiring. You have to be patient with these cars. They need TLC.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

11-01-2010, 09:48 PM	#12
Definitive definitivecars.com 354 Rep 3,833 Posts Drives: Elsa - 2015 F80 M3 - YMB/SS Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: So Cal iTrader: (3) Garage List 2011 E90 M3 [6.66] 2009 (Lease up Sept ... [0.00] 2007 (Lease up 6/19 ... [0.00] 2007 (Lease up Octo ... [0.00]	Wow, I am going to have to take my car in ASAP. I have this same exact symptoms, and was about to post it to see if anyone knew anything. I will be amazed if its a broken motor mount. But sounds exactly like what you had, and happened all of a sudden, just like you. Im going to SEMA so I wont be able to take it in till next week. But I hope they can fix it quick. Anything to actually look for under the hood to see if I can see the prob? D
	Appreciate 0 Quote

11-08-2010, 04:42 PM	#15
Definitive definitivecars.com 354 Rep 3,833 Posts Drives: Elsa - 2015 F80 M3 - YMB/SS Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: So Cal iTrader: (3) Garage List 2011 E90 M3 [6.66] 2009 (Lease up Sept ... [0.00] 2007 (Lease up 6/19 ... [0.00] 2007 (Lease up Octo ... [0.00]	Went to the dealer this morning. They put my car on a lift and found some hydraulic fluid. He said hes not sure but didnt want to rip everything apart without having the replacement parts there. So they gave me the car back and ordered a new motor mount. Sounds like it will be fixed soon. I think it wasent as obvious because its been about 2 weeks for me to be able to get to the dealer, and its rained a good amount in that time. Probably washed off a good amount of the fluid that was there. D
	Appreciate 0 Quote

11-28-2010, 06:07 PM	#16
Definitive definitivecars.com 354 Rep 3,833 Posts Drives: Elsa - 2015 F80 M3 - YMB/SS Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: So Cal iTrader: (3) Garage List 2011 E90 M3 [6.66] 2009 (Lease up Sept ... [0.00] 2007 (Lease up 6/19 ... [0.00] 2007 (Lease up Octo ... [0.00]	Well The car went to the dealer again after the parts came in. To my surprise they said the mounts were fine once they got to them. They found that the large black protection piece under the engine was loose. He said all the bolts were falling out. He asked me who had worked on my engine, and since its stock, I told him no one. He was amazed at the loose bolts. Said he tightened them to spec and the noise/vibration/grinding should be gone. He wanted me to test it as he didnt feel right going WOT on local streets to test it out. We went for a ride after and of course, who knows why, it didnt seem like it was there. I thought I felt it, but it wasent like before. Well after a week of driving the car it is back full force. Very obvious and really is scaring me. I have no clue now what it could be... Im waiting for my SA to get back to me on what the plan is. D
	Appreciate 0 Quote

11-28-2010, 09:15 PM	#18
M3maniac20 Captain 87 Rep 725 Posts Drives: 2013 BMW 335is Coupe Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Austin, Texas iTrader: (0)	Agreed-Good post. THANK YOU for not totally bashing everyone in your way because of your problem! What a refreshing way to handle an issue! And totally agreed about your reliability to fun ratio-sure the BMW will have its glitches-but its like having a high maintenance wife/family member...you still love them no matter what. Where you are located as far as dealership? I'm looking forward to dealing with BMW of Austin if I have issues...I hear nothing but praises coming out of there and it is one of the top rated in the nation. Always comforting to hear. __________________ 2016 340i M-Sport 6-MT(on order) 2013 335is (still have) 2011.5 M3 ZCP (traded in)
	Appreciate 0 Quote

05-30-2011, 12:48 AM	#20
Definitive definitivecars.com 354 Rep 3,833 Posts Drives: Elsa - 2015 F80 M3 - YMB/SS Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: So Cal iTrader: (3) Garage List 2011 E90 M3 [6.66] 2009 (Lease up Sept ... [0.00] 2007 (Lease up 6/19 ... [0.00] 2007 (Lease up Octo ... [0.00]	This has not been resolved, My dealer tells me its too dangerous to replicate, since you have to basically drag the car to feel it. So I'm stuck with it for now. Not sure WTF to do. Where are you located, maybe we can team up at the same dealer... D
	Appreciate 0 Quote

05-30-2011, 01:51 AM	#22
MRSSIIM3 General 148 Rep 1,348 Posts Drives: M4 SO Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: NY iTrader: (5)	update: just drove again and did some spiritful driving hoping maybe that will fix something and the jerk is gone. i feel like maybe the tires were cold and it was some sort of wheel hop or something. now i still get a wierd sound from 5k to redline in gear 1. it sounds like something is going way too intense than normal and theres a deeper sound than there used to be and its deeper than any of the other gears. it just sounds different gear 1 5k-8k rpm than gears 2-7 5k-8k rpm is this exactly the problem youre having?
	Appreciate 0 Quote