C&D 997 v. M3 sparks some serious debate

[Krueger///M3]

There are some angry guys over here. I especially appreciated this comment by an especially interesting 997 owner:

Originally Posted by Le Chef

I leave M3's behind every time I'm on the track, and mine's a cab. They don't represent a real challenge. Far more difficult are Exiges and Elises. I guess M3's are driven by the typical family guy who can't swing a 997 and so tries to make up for it by bragging. Never mind.

The only person really putting up a defense for the M3 is Sticky (aka CURI0).

http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/9...w-m3-09-a.html

[msile]

Originally Posted by Krueger///M3

There are some angry guys over here. I especially appreciated this comment by an especially interesting 997 owner:



The only person really putting up a defense for the M3 is Sticky (aka CURI0).

http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/9...w-m3-09-a.html

Added my two cents....I am crocrr on the forum:

http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/9...ml#post2233708

[Krueger///M3]

Originally Posted by msile

Added my two cents....I am crocrr on the forum:

http://www.6speedonline.com/forums/9...ml#post2233708

I thought that was you! Good input!

[FStop7]

Protip: 6speed was sold to Internet Brands a while back and most of the legit people left there and moved on to teamspeed. What's left on 6speed are mostly strokes and frauds.

On topic, I really don't get the point of the non-S 997. It's not that much less expensive than the S yet it's missing a lot of big features not to mention it makes a lot less power. I'd take an M3 over a non-S 997 every day. But on the other hand I would take a 997S (the new version) over an M3 without hesitation.

[msile]

Originally Posted by FStop7

Protip: 6speed was sold to Internet Brands a while back and most of the legit people left there and moved on to teamspeed. What's left on 6speed are mostly strokes and frauds.

On topic, I really don't get the point of the non-S 997. It's not that much less expensive than the S yet it's missing a lot of big features not to mention it makes a lot less power. I'd take an M3 over a non-S 997 every day. But on the other hand I would take a 997S (the new version) over an M3 without hesitation.

On a similarly equipped car, there is a 12k difference. That is a fair bit.

[Stunnerable]

911s are nice.. but I never really got the craze. I like them.. but that rear engine weight in the back philosophy just never really hit home with me.

[Irb Digital]

I like 911's but other than the looks/bling factor, I think the non S Carrera is pointless. No doubt its a panty dropper, but thats not why I buy a car. I'd save some cash and buy a Caymen S, or spend a little extra and spring for the Carrera S. Now I don't think the M holds a candle to a GT2 or GT3 or even a Turbo. But the Carrera just isn't worth the price IMO. For those kinda dollars, the M3 isn't the only car I'm taking over it.

[FStop7]

Originally Posted by msile

On a similarly equipped car, there is a 12k difference. That is a fair bit.

I just don't see the jump being that big when you're talking upper 70k prices to upper 80k prices. Especially considering what that extra money gets you (pasm, better brakes, bigger engine, etc etc).

[FStop7]

Originally Posted by Irb Digital

I like 911's but other than the looks/bling factor, I think the non S Carrera is pointless. No doubt its a panty dropper, but thats not why I buy a car. I'd save some cash and buy a Caymen S, or spend a little extra and spring for the Carrera S. Now I don't think the M holds a candle to a GT2 or GT3 or even a Turbo. But the Carrera just isn't worth the price IMO. For those kinda dollars, the M3 isn't the only car I'm taking over it.

now i definitely disagree with this. the 997S is a great choice if you want something sportier than an M3 but you still want it to be a good daily.

[FStop7]

I see Sticky is working his magic on the Porsche fanboys.

[Irb Digital]

Originally Posted by FStop7

now i definitely disagree with this. the 997S is a great choice if you want something sportier than an M3 but you still want it to be a good daily.

I thought I made it pretty clear that the non S wasn't worth it. which would lead me to a Cayman S or Carrera S. At least the Carrera S gets you above the performance of an M3, but then again, in that price range, I'm still unimpressed. It's not until you get to the 911 Turbo, that I start liking the 911. I'd take a GT3 over just about any Porsche model, excluding the CGT. Actually, there's very few cars I'm taking over a GT3. Mainly a couple of Italians.

Originally Posted by FStop7

I see Sticky is working his magic on the Porsche fanboys.

I kinda miss the guy myself. Its a shame that be got banned over some 335i vaginal bleeding.

[SR71M3]

Originally Posted by Irb Digital

I thought I made it pretty clear that the non S wasn't worth it. which would lead me to a Cayman S or Carrera S. At least the Carrera S gets you above the performance of an M3, but then again, in that price range, I'm still unimpressed. It's not until you get to the 911 Turbo, that I start liking the 911. I'd take a GT3 over just about any Porsche model, excluding the CGT. Actually, there's very few cars I'm taking over a GT3. Mainly a couple of Italians.

[Year's_End]

Originally Posted by Irb Digital

I kinda miss the guy myself. Its a shame that be got banned over some 335i vaginal bleeding.

lol that dude got banned?

[Robin_NL]

Originally Posted by Irb Digital

I thought I made it pretty clear that the non S wasn't worth it. which would lead me to a Cayman S or Carrera S. At least the Carrera S gets you above the performance of an M3, but then again, in that price range, I'm still unimpressed. It's not until you get to the 911 Turbo, that I start liking the 911. I'd take a GT3 over just about any Porsche model, excluding the CGT. Actually, there's very few cars I'm taking over a GT3. Mainly a couple of Italians.

Totally agree. M3-----GT3----430Scuderia-------McLaren F1

As a DD the 997S should do the trick but I don't find it much sportier as a M3, the front lift is still there, and yes it feels more agile but you won't get 4 proper seats and 'lots of' legroom.And where I live the //M already is an 'arrogant poseurs car' in the eyes of many people, a 911 is totally out of place here....and I think it's overpriced a bit...and I really wanted a 997S.I really did.

[Speedtrap]

Was in abingdon race track a month ago; passed a 997C2S and a 996C2S in the corners - felt the M3 can brake better into the corners.

[msile]

Originally Posted by FStop7

I just don't see the jump being that big when you're talking upper 70k prices to upper 80k prices. Especially considering what that extra money gets you (pasm, better brakes, bigger engine, etc etc).

True, but quite a few people just want a 911 for the prestige and 70k is their upper limit and cannot stretch into the 80s. These folks could care less about PASM, brakes etc.

[urbo73]

Originally Posted by Robin Hood

Totally agree. M3-----GT3----430Scuderia-------McLaren F1

As a DD the 997S should do the trick but I don't find it much sportier as a M3, the front lift is still there, and yes it feels more agile but you won't get 4 proper seats and 'lots of' legroom.And where I live the //M already is an 'arrogant poseurs car' in the eyes of many people, a 911 is totally out of place here....and I think it's overpriced a bit...and I really wanted a 997S.I really did.

Again, it's personal preference as I've said in numerous 911/Porsche vs. M3 threads. Right now I DO need 4 proper seats, hence the M3 sedan. But I can't wait to get back into a C2S in 2.5 years. Just a more fun car for me. M3 feels too damn heavy.

[urbo73]

Originally Posted by Irb Digital

I thought I made it pretty clear that the non S wasn't worth it. which would lead me to a Cayman S or Carrera S. At least the Carrera S gets you above the performance of an M3, but then again, in that price range, I'm still unimpressed. It's not until you get to the 911 Turbo, that I start liking the 911. I'd take a GT3 over just about any Porsche model, excluding the CGT. Actually, there's very few cars I'm taking over a GT3. Mainly a couple of Italians.

For me, in terms of which Porsche to get for the money, the order is this:

C2S, GT3, GT3 RS, GT2

I prefer the RWD, so the Turbo is not an option. But It's the C2S that I'll most likely get next - can't justify spending over 100k on any car. Even if I can afford it - it's just insane. C2S is perfect for fun on a daily basis, track days, etc. If I really want to have fun, I'll look to rebuild my old FF car and take that at FF SCCA racing events. But those days are behind me for the most part. I may go to the Formula Ford 40th anniversary this summer at Road America though. Should be a blast.

[!Xoible]

just like u guys think of nissan, porsche thinks the same of bmw. get over it. you guys are GHETTO!

[ChinoOrtega]

What's the point of having a Porsche when you're over 50, you wont get chicks, you need calcium to heel and toe, mid life crisis, wife won't give you any, you have to pay to get 20 year olds so they even look at you, just a bunch of old timers trying to impress someone, I prefer having my M3 at 27 and my GT3 at 35.

[captainaudio]

Originally Posted by ChinoOrtega

What's the point of having a Porsche when you're over 50, you wont get chicks, you need calcium to heel and toe, mid life crisis, wife won't give you any, you have to pay to get 20 year olds so they even look at you, just a bunch of old timers trying to impress someone, I prefer having my M3 at 27 and my GT3 at 35.

I can introduce you to a number of over 50 drivers (including some women) who can kick the butt of just about anyone here, regardless of their age, on any track. Unless you have some serious competition credentials you may very well be on that list.

FYI :
Paul Newman won his class in the 1996 24 Hours of Daytona at the age of 70.

Mario Andretti, at 63, was the oldest driver ever to turn competitive laps in an Indy-style car on the storied 2 ½-mile oval. His grandson Marco at 18, was one of the the youngest ever to do the same. That's an age separation of 45 years.

Al Unser holds the record of being the oldest driver to ever win the Indy 500 at 47 years old in 1987.

[urbo73]

Originally Posted by captainaudio

I can introduce you to a number of over 50 drivers (including some women) who can kick the butt of just about anyone here, regardless of their age, on any track. Unless you have some serious competition credentials you may very well be on that list.

FYI :
Paul Newman won his class in the 1996 24 Hours of Daytona at the age of 70.

Mario Andretti, at 63, was the oldest driver ever to turn competitive laps in an Indy-style car on the storied 2 ½-mile oval. His grandson Marco at 18, was one of the the youngest ever to do the same. That's an age separation of 45 years.

Al Unser holds the record of being the oldest driver to ever win the Indy 500 at 47 years old in 1987.

I'm 35 and I know people in their late 50s/60s who aren't even famous outside SCCA circles that can put most people here to absolute shame. Never mind Newman, Andretti, etc. Here's one I've known - RJ Valentine (almost 65 years old). If you don't know the name, look it up. A local from here.