High Flow Racing Headers worth it?

[m3london]

Originally Posted by OM VT3

Engine dyno doesn't lie

So who had pulled their motor out to be engine dynoed with ARH headers on?

[m3london]

Originally Posted by squartus

And as stated in many posts and by dyno results most of the gains are from the primary cat deletes as the headers remove them. I have the headers and im supercharged, difference is I was catless to begin with. Headers add 10-15 Max even on a supercharged car. Like stated above aftermarket headers on this car unless stroked and running 12PSI plus is a waste of money/time.
Only mod on this car that I regret doing and see as a total waste, except for the deeper sound which I do find nice. On another platform with crappy OEM headers etc these would be great.

I am sorry to hear that on your car that headers did not produce gains that are beneficial. On my car just doing a cat delete with stock headers only provided 7hp. When I had the ARH headers installed WITH cats, my car gained much more than 10-15 wheel hp and I took the car to three different shops to go on three different mustang dynos to verify the gains. While no I do not have a cross reference on my own car to see what the difference is between headers vs no headers with a blower, P1 Motorcars did an e90 m3 supercharged before and after headers dyno runs and their car gained 30+whp & torque.

Now I have seen a few cars that did not make any significant gains with the ARH headers, such as one or two that went to Powerhouse Performance in Jersey. However later on into investigation that shop found that on these cars the o2 sensors and fuel injectors were shot and the performance numbers was greatly improved after the required maintenance was performed.

Here's the bottom line, bmw did make an excellent oem header but there's still room for improvement. Some people will like the gains from the headers while others will complain that they didn't gain 100hp from the header swap. Some guys will complain about the price of the header system but are content with spending $6k for a Meisterschaft muffler and $20+k on wheels. It's all based on an individual's perspective to what is or isn't worth their money.

[MFL]

Originally Posted by squartus

And as stated in many posts and by dyno results most of the gains are from the primary cat deletes as the headers remove them. I have the headers and im supercharged, difference is I was catless to begin with. Headers add 10-15 Max even on a supercharged car. Like stated above aftermarket headers on this car unless stroked and running 12PSI plus is a waste of money/time.
Only mod on this car that I regret doing and see as a total waste, except for the deeper sound which I do find nice. On another platform with crappy OEM headers etc these would be great.

Clearly some random internet person knows more about your car than you do. XD

[Hujan]

Originally Posted by m3london

They headers make a lot more than 5-7hp... You get 5-7hp on a straight up car delete. Here's a mustang dyno reading of wheel hp on an e92 m3 with ARH headers and tune only

You are crazy if you think a cat delete only provides 5-7 hp. Honestly, that is just a ridiculous thing to say. There are literally 100s of dynos on this site showing >30 whp with a primary cat delete and a tune.

ARH destroyed its credibility by continuously comparing a stock car to one that had its full system. That's not a fair comparison. 95% of the gains come from running an aftermarket x-pipe with a cat delete or HFC. Nick at ARH continuously failed to understand that all anyone wanted to know is how much his system offered over the existing x-pipes on the market and yet he telling failed to ever provide that data. It's no coincidence he's a ghost on this forum. This type of system probably works very well on American cars which come from the factory with complete jokes of headers. But the E9x M3 has awesome headers from the factory.

I will put the Velaforza system on OEM headers up against the ARH system any day. I'm willing to bet the systems put up basically identical numbers, but in no case would the ARH system be more than 10 hp on this system. I will gladly leave 10 hp on the table for a weight savings of 50 lbs. and not having to pay thousands in labor to install a set of headers.

[Dave07997S]

Originally Posted by Hujan

You are crazy if you think a cat delete only provides 5-7 hp. Honestly, that is just a ridiculous thing to say. There are literally 100s of dynos on this site showing >30 whp with a primary cat delete and a tune.

ARH destroyed its credibility by continuously comparing a stock car to one that had its full system. That's not a fair comparison. 95% of the gains come from running an aftermarket x-pipe with a cat delete or HFC. Nick at ARH continuously failed to understand that all anyone wanted to know is how much his system offered over the existing x-pipes on the market and yet he telling failed to ever provide that data. It's no coincidence he's a ghost on this forum. This type of system probably works very well on American cars which come from the factory with complete jokes of headers. But the E9x M3 has awesome headers from the factory.

I will put the Velaforza system on OEM headers up against the ARH system any day. I'm willing to bet the systems put up basically identical numbers, but in no case would the ARH system be more than 10 hp on this system. I will gladly leave 10 hp on the table for a weight savings of 50 lbs. and not having to pay thousands in labor to install a set of headers.

^^^^THIS^^^^

Im not saying they won't make more hp than a testpipe setup but to gain 10rwhp for the added expense and hassle if you had to remove them to have the car smogged makes this a no starter to me. I know several people now who have installed them, who shall remain nameless, who are sponsors on this board and told me if they had to do it again they wouldn't.

Dave

[m3london]

Originally Posted by Hujan

You are crazy if you think a cat delete only provides 5-7 hp. Honestly, that is just a ridiculous thing to say. There are literally 100s of dynos on this site showing >30 whp with a primary cat delete and a tune.

ARH destroyed its credibility by continuously comparing a stock car to one that had its full system. That's not a fair comparison. 95% of the gains come from running an aftermarket x-pipe with a cat delete or HFC. Nick at ARH continuously failed to understand that all anyone wanted to know is how much his system offered over the existing x-pipes on the market and yet he telling failed to ever provide that data. It's no coincidence he's a ghost on this forum. This type of system probably works very well on American cars which come from the factory with complete jokes of headers. But the E9x M3 has awesome headers from the factory.

I will put the Velaforza system on OEM headers up against the ARH system any day. I'm willing to bet the systems put up basically identical numbers, but in no case would the ARH system be more than 10 hp on this system. I will gladly leave 10 hp on the table for a weight savings of 50 lbs. and not having to pay thousands in labor to install a set of headers.

Maybe on a dynojet you might see 30 hp gain on a cat delete but not a mustang dyno (I know because MY m3 did not magically find 30+ hp when I did several runs with a cat delete over stock setup). In regards to Nick he can longer reply as he has been banned from this forum. You talk to any vendor and NONE of their comparisons in maximum performance gains are based on modifications from other vendors. You don't see Meisterschaft comparing their performance gains over other vendors such as arakapovic, gthaus etc in regards to maximum numbers because the variables are nearly infinite! Would you spend what would be in this case probably well over a million dollars to set up every possible aftermarket combination for comparison just to see what every possible hp/tq numbers gain the header system would make (sorry but this ain't Bernie Sanders land so no vendor is going to give their product away for free).

While yes a headers installation isn't recommended for the faint of heart DIY...but in a situation such as the motor mounts need replacement, steering rack needs servicing etc. ultimately these are just some examples of when a person may consider doing a more involved bolt-on performance gain could be considered. This header system is also still less expensive than the price of some axle back mufflers available for the e9x m3 so again cost is all relative to the end consumer.
And NO this header system DOES NOT add 50 lbs to the car! As for the velaforza, my apologies but I never heard of the company.

What a lot of guys seem to fail to realize on this form is ARH had sold this header system through another company and was labeled as their own product such as by Dinan, Turner Motorsport, Active Autowerke, Supersprint, Borla etc... No one would have batted an eye to questioning the benefits of these headers.

[m3london]

Originally Posted by Dave07997S

^^^^THIS^^^^

Im not saying they won't make more hp than a testpipe setup but to gain 10rwhp for the added expense and hassle if you had to remove them to have the car smogged makes this a no starter to me. I know several people now who have installed them, who shall remain nameless, who are sponsors on this board and told me if they had to do it again they wouldn't.

Dave

Smog test? There are still states that use that gas analyzer in the tail pipe for obd2 inspection?!

[squartus]

Originally Posted by m3london

Maybe on a dynojet you might see 30 hp gain on a cat delete but not a mustang dyno (I know because MY m3 did not magically find 30+ hp when I did several runs with a cat delete over stock setup). In regards to Nick he can longer reply as he has been banned from this forum. You talk to any vendor and NONE of their comparisons in maximum performance gains are based on modifications from other vendors. You don't see Meisterschaft comparing their performance gains over other vendors such as arakapovic, gthaus etc in regards to maximum numbers because the variables are nearly infinite! Would you spend what would be in this case probably well over a million dollars to set up every possible aftermarket combination for comparison just to see what every possible hp/tq numbers gain the header system would make (sorry but this ain't Bernie Sanders land so no vendor is going to give their product away for free).

While yes a headers installation isn't recommended for the faint of heart DIY...but in a situation such as the motor mounts need replacement, steering rack needs servicing etc. ultimately these are just some examples of when a person may consider doing a more involved bolt-on performance gain could be considered. This header system is also still less expensive than the price of some axle back mufflers available for the e9x m3 so again cost is all relative to the end consumer.
And NO this header system DOES NOT add 50 lbs to the car! As for the velaforza, my apologies but I never heard of the company.

What a lot of guys seem to fail to realize on this form is ARH had sold this header system through another company and was labeled as their own product such as by Dinan, Turner Motorsport, Active Autowerke, Supersprint, Borla etc... No one would have batted an eye to questioning the benefits of these headers.

Yes no matter where the system came from the results would of been questioned, except in his case he chose to answer the questions with flat out lies then would change the lie few days later. Numbers kept changing, would never let anyone do a test dyno with the product even though they offered to drive all the way there and pay for everything etc.
Reason many gave up making headers for this car, the power simply is not there especially for the cost involved. Countless dynos on what simply a primary cat delete and tune does and yes its always around 20-30 RWHP.

Think what they did was spend the money to make the headers, did not do research and when they finally saw the headers did not actually do much tried to push the product anyway. Its not the build quality, they are very well built but on this platform its simply not needed.

Im running 625 kit, no cats. Adding the headers did not do much besides the deeper sound. Only people to get decent gains are already pushing over 700hp and running 10psi plus. Much less stock engines, which when he first started posting he told people the headers alone would add 40-50 HP to

[m3london]

Originally Posted by squartus

Yes no matter where the system came from the results would of been questioned, except in his case he chose to answer the questions with flat out lies then would change the lie few days later. Numbers kept changing, would never let anyone do a test dyno with the product even though they offered to drive all the way there and pay for everything etc.
Reason many gave up making headers for this car, the power simply is not there especially for the cost involved. Countless dynos on what simply a primary cat delete and tune does and yes its always around 20-30 RWHP.

Think what they did was spend the money to make the headers, did not do research and when they finally saw the headers did not actually do much tried to push the product anyway. Its not the build quality, they are very well built but on this platform its simply not needed.

Im running 625 kit, no cats. Adding the headers did not do much besides the deeper sound. Only people to get decent gains are already pushing over 700hp and running 10psi plus. Much less stock engines, which when he first started posting he told people the headers alone would add 40-50 HP to

I understand gaining 20-30hp with a cat delete and tune yes. But as you said yourself, with a tune (which in itself ain't free either) the headers produce more hp & tq gains without a tune and yes this argument can go on and on and on till this planet runs out of gasoline for all of us to use. Some of the reasons I feel other vendors didn't bother creating headers for this gen m3 is yes the labor involved to he end consumer, the fact that the skid plate must be notched to clear the headers (which some m3 owners aparrently freak out about) and untimately if any major vendor was considering making headers for this gen m3, after seeing how ARH became the "sacrificial lamb" in this market: they all said fuck it this ain't worth the aggravation.

I do understand what you are saying on how the headers are more beneficial on a motor with more work done to it than a stock motor. Nonetheless every motor will still gain hp, maybe not everyone will achieve 50+hp but they will still gain more than 10hp.

Now I do have a question for you though, if the ARH headers suck as you have stated in several posts...why didn't you remove the headers and send them back to Nick since he does offer a money back guarantee and put the stock headers back on etc?

[8k4]

Originally Posted by squartus

Sorry no, not even for supercharged engines its not worth it. Maybe stroked supercharged engine running 12lbs of boost yes would be worth it then especially when people are scratching for everying they can for dyno numbers. But normal supercharged M noda dont waste the cash

Now you are full of smoke brother. There have been plenty of supercharged cars that showed very nice gains with the ARH headers

[squartus]

Originally Posted by m3london

I understand gaining 20-30hp with a cat delete and tune yes. But as you said yourself, with a tune (which in itself ain't free either) the headers produce more hp & tq gains without a tune and yes this argument can go on and on and on till this planet runs out of gasoline for all of us to use. Some of the reasons I feel other vendors didn't bother creating headers for this gen m3 is yes the labor involved to he end consumer, the fact that the skid plate must be notched to clear the headers (which some m3 owners aparrently freak out about) and untimately if any major vendor was considering making headers for this gen m3, after seeing how ARH became the "sacrificial lamb" in this market: they all said fuck it this ain't worth the aggravation.

I do understand what you are saying on how the headers are more beneficial on a motor with more work done to it than a stock motor. Nonetheless every motor will still gain hp, maybe not everyone will achieve 50+hp but they will still gain more than 10hp.

Now I do have a question for you though, if the ARH headers suck as you have stated in several posts...why didn't you remove the headers and send them back to Nick since he does offer a money back guarantee and put the stock headers back on etc?

First just a primary cat delete with no tune does produce more than the headers without a tune if the cat is already removed, which test pipes are only about $300, and from talking to tuners ESS etc they wont even change the tune for the headers as no power is on the table. Thats exact quote from ESS from head office.

I bought them from a forum member as I told Nick I would never buy anything directly from him after his behavior on this forum. At the time I knew people were getting less than 10hp from dynos with headers if they aleady had a cat delete. Was suppose to be more on the table for supercharged cars.
After paying 1400 for the install even though they only gave me about 15whp and less ground clearance its simply not worth spending another $1400 to remove the things and put stock ones back on and resell them for 3k after spending 2800 to put them on then back off.

Reason I like to let people know the truth of things so they dont make costly mistakes. End of day does not matter who makes the dam things, your simply better off buying a set of lightweight forged wheels for 3k. Or few more for a supercharger, or buying extra sets of sticky rubber to stock the garage.

If I was trying to break 800HP on a blown, built, high PSI M3 then yea 5k would be worth it as your scrapping for every tidbit of HP no matter the cost.
ARH is not the only one who made headers for this car, he is only one that lied through his teeth over and over, changed what he said, lied some more etc. Reason he gets bashed and not the other makers

[m3london]

Originally Posted by squartus

First just a primary cat delete with no tune does produce more than the headers without a tune if the cat is already removed, which test pipes are only about $300, and from talking to tuners ESS etc they wont even change the tune for the headers as no power is on the table. Thats exact quote from ESS from head office.

I bought them from a forum member as I told Nick I would never buy anything directly from him after his behavior on this forum. At the time I knew people were getting less than 10hp from dynos with headers if they aleady had a cat delete. Was suppose to be more on the table for supercharged cars.
After paying 1400 for the install even though they only gave me about 15whp and less ground clearance its simply not worth spending another $1400 to remove the things and put stock ones back on and resell them for 3k after spending 2800 to put them on then back off.

Reason I like to let people know the truth of things so they dont make costly mistakes. End of day does not matter who makes the dam things, your simply better off buying a set of lightweight forged wheels for 3k. Or few more for a supercharger, or buying extra sets of sticky rubber to stock the garage.

If I was trying to break 800HP on a blown, built, high PSI M3 then yea 5k would be worth it as your scrapping for every tidbit of HP no matter the cost.
ARH is not the only one who made headers for this car, he is only one that lied through his teeth over and over, changed what he said, lied some more etc. Reason he gets bashed and not the other makers

You really paid someone $1,400 to put the headers on for you? Well me being me I would have removed a part out principal despite the loss if I felt the product was considered cancerous to the car, but again that's just me personally. As for the blower, you know out of all people should know it's going to cost $10k and up for a good supercharger kit so it's not like it's only $1-2k more than headers.

You and some others may not feel the headers are beneficial, but for myself and others will argue they are one of the best performance enhancements for this gen m3 so far. As you said yourself, you did achieve more whp with the headers over the mods your car had prior to the install so Nick wasn't lying about gaining power.

At the end of the day your going to argue that these headers are garbage and I am going to argue that these headers are great. I have a similar argument with guys who swear the factory brakes are superb and the Stoptech Trophy brakes I bought and installed are overrated (meanwhile two of them totaled their cars trying to stop their cars in the short distances mine can). No matter how little the gains you may claim the headers gave you, they still produced gains nonetheless. As for the cost of these headers, for one person it may be too expensive for the gains, for another it's like dropping loose change for benefits.

[squartus]

Originally Posted by m3london

You really paid someone $1,400 to put the headers on for you? Well me being me I would have removed a part out principal despite the loss if I felt the product was considered cancerous to the car, but again that's just me personally. As for the blower, you know out of all people should know it's going to cost $10k and up for a good supercharger kit so it's not like it's only $1-2k more than headers.

You and some others may not feel the headers are beneficial, but for myself and others will argue they are one of the best performance enhancements for this gen m3 so far. As you said yourself, you did achieve more whp with the headers over the mods your car had prior to the install so Nick wasn't lying about gaining power.

At the end of the day your going to argue that these headers are garbage and I am going to argue that these headers are great. I have a similar argument with guys who swear the factory brakes are superb and the Stoptech Trophy brakes I bought and installed are overrated (meanwhile two of them totaled their cars trying to stop their cars in the short distances mine can). No matter how little the gains you may claim the headers gave you, they still produced gains nonetheless. As for the cost of these headers, for one person it may be too expensive for the gains, for another it's like dropping loose change for benefits.

Yes I was not about to do header swap on this car in my garage on my back on my daily driver. 11-14hrs in a good shop to do it, talking several days on my back in a garage simply not worth it.
Handfull of HP gain for some people will be worth the cost, I covered that but the gains and claims Nick kept going on about... complete BS. Hell he use to claim that Primary cat delete on this car gave no gains and was all headers... Among other just flat out wrong things.

But this is not about Nick and his misinformation, this was about someone asking if headers, from any company were worth the cost. For the vast majorty of people the answer is no. Very small gains for very large cost, can pick up a used 550 kit for little over the cost of the headers install it for less cost and another grand on top for tune. Get 100HP vs maybe 8HP.
Light weight wheels would also give more performance as well as better handling/braking than headers would. Even a pully swap might give more, cant rember what the average dyno for those are.

[Dave07997S]

Originally Posted by m3london

Smog test? There are still states that use that gas analyzer in the tail pipe for obd2 inspection?!

You still have to deal with readiness codes. The cats that come with the ARH system are garbage. How are you getting around readiness codes being catless?

If the car is new for the first 5 years here, it doesn't have to be smogged. After that every 2 years.

BTW, I got pulled over for my car by a LAPD motorcycle. He told me he his part of a racing unit that is looking for modded cars in which the cats have been removed. He heard me accelerate and he felt my car didn't have any cats on. He actually squatted down to look under the car and thank goodness I had the rear cats in place as thats all he could see. He made me pop my hood and asked if I had headers on the car, I told him only factory headers. I got to admit for a second I was kind of sweating...no ticket and he didn't even right me up for not having a front license plate.

What you are failing to realize is that we (this forum) wanted the ARH headers to make good power above what a test pipe/tune car would do, we really did. It just didn't materialize. In addition, Bimmerworld came out with their headers and did do a test vs. a bolt on M3. Only difference was one car had the headers, the other car had the factory headers but the same xpipe fitted as the headers. The Bimmerworld header cars only made 11rwhp more than the non header car. Here is the test..

http://www.bimmerworld.com/Exhaust/H...-Y-Header.html

Dave

[m3london]

Originally Posted by Dave07997S

You still have to deal with readiness codes. The cats that come with the ARH system are garbage. How are you getting around readiness codes being catless?

If the car is new for the first 5 years here, it doesn't have to be smogged. After that every 2 years.

In NYS you get the first two years from new where it's a safety inspection only, after that it's obdIi. When I had headers only and no tune I was able to set all the monitors and pass the obd2 monitor test. I don't know what to tell you but my car passed the emissions test with his hi-flow cats. And I would not say his cats are garbage as they work fine on other brands ARH makes headers for.
At the same time there are other companies that sell 02 simulators to set the monitors for their catless exhaust systems and there are guys out there that can tune the car so the rear o2's are turned off to pass the obd2 inspection.

The bimmian headers are a different design than the ARH headers to begin with and for performance gains how can you expect any company to list their products exact gains over every other aftermarket product out there, and he did state the gains are over a stock system...so where's the lie there?

[m3london]

Originally Posted by squartus

Yes I was not about to do header swap on this car in my garage on my back on my daily driver. 11-14hrs in a good shop to do it, talking several days on my back in a garage simply not worth it.
Handfull of HP gain for some people will be worth the cost, I covered that but the gains and claims Nick kept going on about... complete BS. Hell he use to claim that Primary cat delete on this car gave no gains and was all headers... Among other just flat out wrong things.

But this is not about Nick and his misinformation, this was about someone asking if headers, from any company were worth the cost. For the vast majorty of people the answer is no. Very small gains for very large cost, can pick up a used 550 kit for little over the cost of the headers install it for less cost and another grand on top for tune. Get 100HP vs maybe 8HP.
Light weight wheels would also give more performance as well as better handling/braking than headers would. Even a pully swap might give more, cant rember what the average dyno for those are.

Anyone who has purchased anything for an e9x m3 should know nothing is cheap for the car. Parts for the f8x m3/m4 are cheaper than this gen m3. Are the headers cheap no, but then neither are any of the other vendors catback systems. And as you and some others pointed out, yes the gains aren't as significant on an already modified m3 exhaust system. However if one is starting out with a virgin m3 then yes it is a big performance gain since your not buying one system to remove it and install another one and the ARH system does not require a tune to gain power where the guys who do just an h-pipe, muffler and tune.
Last time I checked the average midsection was $1k and up and the typical tune is $1,400 and up. So from that stand point the header system itself is not that much more than the other options available.
And yes if you go used parts obviously one can't compare what one pays for those items vs new. I for one like to buy car parts the same way I buy condoms...new, not preowned.

[squartus]

Originally Posted by m3london

In NYS you get the first two years from new where it's a safety inspection only, after that it's obdIi. When I had headers only and no tune I was able to set all the monitors and pass the obd2 monitor test. I don't know what to tell you but my car passed the emissions test with his hi-flow cats. And I would not say his cats are garbage as they work fine on other brands ARH makes headers for.
At the same time there are other companies that sell 02 simulators to set the monitors for their catless exhaust systems and there are guys out there that can tune the car so the rear o2's are turned off to pass the obd2 inspection.

The bimmian headers are a different design than the ARH headers to begin with and for performance gains how can you expect any company to list their products exact gains over every other aftermarket product out there, and he did state the gains are over a stock system...so where's the lie there?

Because he stated the gains where from JUST the headers several times, also denying that any gains were had from deleting Cats as he said primary Cat deletes gave no gains on this car. Can design the headers all you like, the engine simply does not need much more than the OEM headers which are wayyy better made and designed than most.

But as most are aware most of all the HP gains to be had in this cars entire exhaust is in removing the primary cats.

[Dave07997S]

Originally Posted by m3london

In NYS you get the first two years from new where it's a safety inspection only, after that it's obdIi. When I had headers only and no tune I was able to set all the monitors and pass the obd2 monitor test. I don't know what to tell you but my car passed the emissions test with his hi-flow cats. And I would not say his cats are garbage as they work fine on other brands ARH makes headers for.
At the same time there are other companies that sell 02 simulators to set the monitors for their catless exhaust systems and there are guys out there that can tune the car so the rear o2's are turned off to pass the obd2 inspection.

The bimmian headers are a different design than the ARH headers to begin with and for performance gains how can you expect any company to list their products exact gains over every other aftermarket product out there, and he did state the gains are over a stock system...so where's the lie there?

The cats are garbage, ask anyone in the Mustang world. The cats ARH uses are a low end cat and wouldn't survive more than a couple of years before they melt. Why do you think they are only a couple of hundred dollars more. A good HJS cat is $700 per cat. Don't know how you passed readiness, almost getting ready to call bs on this..

[m3london]

Originally Posted by Dave07997S

The cats are garbage, ask anyone in the Mustang world. The cats ARH uses are a low end cat and wouldn't survive more than a couple of years before they melt. Why do you think they are only a couple of hundred dollars more. A good HJS cat is $700 per cat. Don't know how you passed readiness, almost getting ready to call bs on this..

Well you can call it whatever you want but my car did pass legally. Only thing I can tell you is my rear o2 sensors were starting to go at one point and I've seen this on some other m3's out there so try swapping them out with a new set of oem sensors and see if the monitors set. Now if you are catless period then you can't compare your cars inspection problem vs my car. And as I said before look into what the other guys are doing on their catless systems to pass emissions...I doubt too many guys even with stock headers are swapping out their mid sections every year to pass obd2 inspection

[m3london]

Originally Posted by Dave07997S

The cats are garbage, ask anyone in the Mustang world. The cats ARH uses are a low end cat and wouldn't survive more than a couple of years before they melt. Why do you think they are only a couple of hundred dollars more. A good HJS cat is $700 per cat. Don't know how you passed readiness, almost getting ready to call bs on this..

BTW the HJS cats for Motorsport cars are $550 each and mustang cars are a bad comparison for catalytic converter quality cause those cars in stock form melt the factory cats... And nicks cats are 200 cel cats just like hjs's.
While I no longer daily my m3 anymore cause I have several cars, I'll take what you said about his cats into consideration and IF they do indeed fail in the future I will let you know. But as for now they seem to be working fine.

[Dave07997S]

Guys just remember the old adage. "You can lead a horse to water, but you will never make him drink".😀

[617E90M3]

Is m3london a rep/sponsored by ARH? Its him against the world.