Gintani SC kit = Game Over

[niterider]

Originally Posted by PencilGeek

I understand that's stage-3. But you said stage-2 would have lower compression ratio as well. Back in post #55, you said they were lowering the compression ratio for stage-2. My question is how are they lowering the compression ratio without rebuilding the bottom end -- which you also said is what defines stage-3? Was that a typo mistake? I'll bet it was. Usually stage-2 consists of more boost, not lower compression ratio.

I know Gintani is watching this thread. So instead of us speculating, followed by a bunch of concern with the negative consequences of thicker head gaskets and/or spacers, see if Gintani will chime in and clarify the definition of stage-2 and stage-3.

No I beleive he told me lower compression ratio by running thicker head gaskets. But if u think about it , it doesnt really mess with ur drive train because these cars are over head cams. It will just make ur chain tighter but that can be adjusted, thats what ur tensioners are for. Im sure their only increasing the size by say thousands of an inch Its not like ur gonna add an inch thinker gasket. The fact that this engine is 12:1 stock just makes it difficult to run more boost and still stay safe. If u can drop that to 11:1 or maybe even less, u get more room to play with boost.

U may not like the idea, and I can see y but others might. Just like u chose the stoker kit over FI even tho u can get more power off FI. I personally like the stroker kit as well because u keep the all motor (true origin of the M3) but I couldnt afford a kit in that price range and decided to go FI.

I think they are just giving people more options and options are always good for all of us car enthusiast. But I can def. see where ur coming from.

[niterider]

Originally Posted by 10M3MAN

WOW...That is SICK...Post more pictures ASAP

Thanks...I dont have any more right now but Ill see if I can take some later. I want to post more when the intake housing and inlet pipe are completed in carbon. I wasnt being very patient with them (and im sure u can see y ) so they put the prototype intake housing for now just so I could drive my car.

[e46e92love]

Originally Posted by GT3 Tim

a 997 GT3 RS (may be my next ride?).

Smartest thing you have said in a while

Cheers,
e46e92

[mrgold]

Would this or any other supercharger systems (Gintani, ESS, AA, G-Power, etc.) be compatible with the DCT transmission? Just wondering if the additional 120+ extra horsepower will hurt the transmission or make the clutches slip.

[niterider]

Originally Posted by PencilGeek

I was trying to avoid the discussion of the (pretty nasty) side-effects of adding thicker head gaskets, because I didn't want to scare anybody away from considering Gintani. Gintani may have a solution to this problem already. This is why I suggested for Gintani to chime in to the thread instead of us speculating because I think the speculation hurts them.

Yes, more options are always better; and to me, this isn't a discussion about FI vs. NA. This is a discussion about good engineering practices. I'm well aware that many FI tuners use this approach; but many FI tuners also stay as far away from thicker gaskets as they can. Thicker gaskets are shunned in the motor building industry for a good reason. All of the guys I know in the racing industry would tell you (and have told me) the same thing.

Are u speaking out of pure theory or personal experience? Im speaking of pure experience. You brought up a good point but it can all be fixed by adjusting ur timing, which u have to do anyways when putting everything back together. But your right, we are going way off subject here. This has nothing to do with my thread and its not like im planning to build my own stage 2 or something so no need for me to justify how this works. If u wish to discuss this I think we should Pm so it doesnt pull this thread off topic.

[niterider]

Originally Posted by PencilGeek

The DCT is rated for approximately 450 ft/lbs of torque. Stay under that limit, and you should be fine.

Yes what Robert said...N i dont think any tuner is gonna b able to acheive more then 450ft/lbs of tq. with stock internals etc. So I think any kit out right now should be safe with DCT.

[niterider]

Originally Posted by PencilGeek

Both: the real experience is explained by the theory. Sending PM to keep this thead on-topic. But asking Gintani to clarify is still very much relevant to this thread.

Good stuff...and for the record Im not speaking on behalf of Gintani Im just speaking about my own experiences.

[niterider]

Originally Posted by SupremeDTM

i need to see this beast in person.

Let me know if u ever go by Gintanis shop and I can meet u so I can give u a ride.

[niterider]

Dyno Jet results are here. Outside temp was at 92 degrees.


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[DLSJ5]

That dyno looks solid!! Congrats Bro!

[Jonmartin]

Nice numbers bro you should update the original post with the sheet.

[niterider]

Originally Posted by DLSJ5

That dyno looks solid!! Congrats Bro!

Thanks drew, please keep me updated on the Mexico run.

[niterider]

Originally Posted by Jonmartin

Nice numbers bro you should update the original post with the sheet.

Thanks brotha...Sounds good, maybe ill removed some pics and replace them with the dyno sheet.

[niterider]

Originally Posted by PencilGeek

I fixed your YouTube link, and enabled your Dynojet dyno entry in the DynoDB.

Thanks Rob appreciate it.

[niterider]

Originally Posted by PencilGeek

For anybody curious to know (and see) how head gasket thickness affects the compression ratio, I put together this chart.

The equation for compression ratio is:
cRatio = vBDC / vTDC,

Where:
vBDC = Volume at Bottom Dead Center
vTDC = Volume at Top Dead Center

But wait...there's more:
vBDC = cVol + gVol + chVol
vTDC = gvol + chVol

Where:
cVol = Cylinder Volume
gVol = Gasket Volume
chVol = Volume of the combustion chamber

Here's the table of results based on the S65 motor, as very good approximations for gVol and chVol:

Nice chart

[SlammedR8]

damn man
thats nuts!

[Sales@Gintani.com]

Hi M3P, We just wanted to check in and clear things up.

Niterider is correct, we try to give our customers as many choices as we can. We were exploring the option of lowering the CR using thicker head gaskets.

The Stage 2 system is under development right now and does have low compression pistons (not thicker HGs).

We'll keep you guys posted as the kit gets closer to completion.

[KonigsTiger]

How much weight does this kit add? With intercoolers and everything.

[niterider]

Originally Posted by BMW-M-Mexico

How much weight does this kit add? With intercoolers and everything.

Not sure but I did weight my car before the install so I will weight it again to see the difference. Will post back with my findings.

[Eugene-TAIWAN]

That is some very professional information PG.

thanks but its tuff to understand.

I the SC will add at least 15kg on the front end of the car. Do you guys think this will also cause some understeer?

[niterider]

Originally Posted by PencilGeek

Since the fuel affects the weight...how are you guaranteeing that you have the same amount of fuel in the car before/after SC installation?

Well a lot of things will affect the weight, so it wont be exact just an est. But I did do a couple of things to help me get a somewhat accurate reading. I filled my gas tank to exactly 13gallons, took everything out of my car that isnt normally in it and set the tire psi to 35psi all around for this reason. I also recorded the exact (well as exact as my odo reads) mileage so that I can just drive the same amount after I get gas to go to the weight station which is like 2.3 miles from the gas station. This way if I ever added anything to my car I could compare the difference by just setting the same settings.

[niterider]

Originally Posted by Eugene-TAIWAN

That is some very professional information PG.

thanks but its tuff to understand.

I the SC will add at least 15kg on the front end of the car. Do you guys think this will also cause some understeer?

Im not sure but I did track my car several times before I got the sc kit so Im sure Ill feel the difference if it does. I will be tracking my car this coming sunday. so Ill respond with the differences felt. Ill try to make some short vids. too.