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08-14-2008, 11:24 PM | #111 | |
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Jesus, Swamp. You say horsepower is approximate but torque at the drive wheels is exact? What are you thinking? If you have 10.000% more power at a given speed, you have 10.000% more torque at the drive wheels. Not even 9.999 or 10.001 percent more. 10.000% more. Jesus. |
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08-15-2008, 12:35 AM | #112 |
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08-15-2008, 02:23 AM | #113 | |
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08-15-2008, 02:27 AM | #114 | |
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08-15-2008, 03:02 AM | #115 | |
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Best regards, south
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08-15-2008, 08:50 AM | #116 | |
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Once again, what I said was that at a given speed and weight, the car making more power (obviously at that speed and weight) will accelerate harder than one making less power (yet again at that speed and weight), regardless of torque or gearing. Peak horsepower to weight will give you a reasonable approximation of acceleration from rest in terms of speed at distance, and a lousy approximation of ET at distance. If memory serves, this general topic was the subject of our first dustup (Oh! Be still my heart!), wherein I said that time to speed and time to distance were essentially unrelated (complete with examples), and you said (complete with lecture) that that couldn't possibly be true - obviously talking about something else entirely. Bruce |
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08-15-2008, 08:51 AM | #117 | |
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Bruce Edit: PS - The only thing I initially came up with is that if the Euro standard includes the flywheel/flexplate, that would give the Merc perhaps a thirty pound advantage. I've abandoned that, however, because then you'd have to publish separate engine weights where there was a choice of transmission (which I have never seen), and in addition, the bimmer would come in at something close to 400 pounds sans that dual-mass monstrosity, obviously pirated from an old u-boat. I just don't believe that given the V10 parent is pretty damned heavy. Last edited by bruce.augenstein@comcast.; 08-15-2008 at 09:15 AM.. |
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08-15-2008, 08:54 AM | #118 | |
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No challenge here. Just looking for someone to add something that moves us a little further along. Bruce |
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08-15-2008, 10:00 AM | #119 | |
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Do you happen to know what usually is contained in the engine's weight? It's not only the 'block' itself but also some ancillary units, isn't it? Best regards, south
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08-15-2008, 10:20 AM | #120 | |
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Bruce |
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08-15-2008, 10:30 AM | #121 | |
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Best regards, south Edit: Of course, that SAE standard is only available through subscription.
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08-15-2008, 10:48 AM | #122 |
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Hi Bruce. Not sure what you mean above by "essentially". I wasn't a part of the discussion you referenced, but would be curious to see it. Can you point me toward that thread?
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08-15-2008, 12:30 PM | #123 | |
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08-15-2008, 12:37 PM | #124 | |
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Good LORD.....
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08-15-2008, 01:07 PM | #125 | |
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P.S. By the way reading through our our old discussion on the relation of speed at distance vs. time to speed in the post you refer to, I stand firmly by everything I said there. It is PURE MATH and indisputable. If you think I am wrong on the points I made you are calling Newton wrong. As well my statements are completely consistent with your numbers which some believe to be inconsistent on a casual glance. |
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08-15-2008, 01:49 PM | #126 | |
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08-15-2008, 02:24 PM | #127 | |
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I have witnessed the exact same thing with car vs bike races. I am with you on this one. I don't understand why so I shouldn't need the flame suit. |
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08-15-2008, 07:39 PM | #128 | ||
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08-15-2008, 08:15 PM | #129 | |
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Many of our disagreements stem from fairly drastically different world views. Mine is based on and heavily influenced by science - math, physics, engineering, combined with my love of cars. Everything is a variable, everything can change and any value is possible (maybe not to build but to consider). Your is very practical and experiential. You are the classic gearhead gifted with significant understanding beyond most. Basic disagreements like gearing does or does not matter depends strongly on if you are looking at the physics or at actual sporty production vehicles. Surely in terms of equations and engineering gearing makes a huge difference. Mis gear a car, on purpose or on accident, very far away from its optimal gearing and its performance will suffer tremendously. We don't have to worry much about that with real cars because it doesn't often happen or at least not in a really significant fashion. Other disagreements between us are based on similar differences in the way we see things. Your experience and clarity are in general excellent and I always enjoy reading you posts. As well I have learned a thing or two from you. I can only hope that is somewhat reciprocated. Cheers. |
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08-15-2008, 08:55 PM | #130 |
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335 more torque than M3.
335 looks like M3 ... C63 more torque than the planet C63 looks like C350. (so? see line immediately above). End of argument. What said it best - C63 is way faster in a line than the M. Most of us don't live anywhere near curves. Most of us race in red-light, block long races. Most of us would benefit from a C63. I got rid of my 07 M Coupe, I looked at an M3 and even an M5 - I ended up picking up the 63. Never liked slush boxes - am totally THRILLED with the 63 and will happily spank any of your E9X M3s. Thank you very much. |
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08-15-2008, 10:57 PM | #132 | |
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I can't remember the last time I took a straight line to any destination and drag raced the whole way there. |
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