Another Idle Control Valve goes down

[RBB]

So I just got back from a week's vacation last night. Took the wife's car and couldn't wait to get back in the M today as well as load ESS's new V2 tune on. I've noticed my car taking a little longer to crank over the past couple months as well as a slight sputter at start up and occasional hesitation upon acceleration.

I got up this morning, loaded my new tune and as soon as I started it up I immediately got the christmas tree of error lights as well as a very inconsistent idle and limp mode. Killed the ignition and fired it back up and didn't get any faults this time, but got the crazy idling again....car almost bogged down to the point of stalling. Thought I'd load my old tune back on to make sure that wasn't the issue and sure enough, I was greeted with the highly inconsistent idle (almost to the point of stalling again) once more.

Pulled the following codes:
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
// BMW Trouble Code list
//
// ECU Type : Siemens DME MSS60
// Vehicle Manufacturer Ecu Hardware Number : 7848125
// Vehicle Manufacturer Ecu Software Number : 7841654
// Hardware Reference Number : 0569QT0Z240EEKEV0
// Vehicle Identification Number : WBSWD93588PY40212
// Ecu Manufacturing Date : 30.01.2008
//
// 1) 2B0D Idling speed control valve monitor bank 1
// 2) 2B57 Motor emergency programm activated
// 3) 2714 Intake pipe pressure sensor bank 1
// 4) 2B42 Combustion misfire with emissions deterioration cyl 1
// 5) 2B43 Combustion misfire with emissions deterioration cyl 2
// 6) 2B44 Combustion misfire with emissions deterioration cyl 3
// 7) 2B45 Combustion misfire with emissions deterioration cyl 4
// 8) 2B46 Combustion misfire with emissions deterioration cyl 5
// 9) 2B47 Combustion misfire with emissions deterioration cyl 6
// 10) 2B48 Combustion misfire with emissions deterioration cyl 7
// 11) 2B49 Combustion misfire with emissions deterioration cyl 8
// 12) 2B4E Combustion misfire with emissions deterioration several cyl
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

All signs point towards the ICV, so I'll be taking it in tomorrow morning to a great indy shop here (RRT). I always find threads like this very informative and I just wanted to post this up to further add to the knowledge base. So for all you guys out of warranty I'll keep the threaded updated and let you know the fix and cost once I get some more info later this week.

[09GT]

That's interesting you point out the car taking a little longer to turn over as a sign. Mine does that when its been sitting for longer than 10 hours. BMW needs to offer some sort of deal on fixing these. Seems like a design flaw.

How many miles/year do you have on your car?

I saw people paying as much as $3800 to fix this part.

[RBB]

Originally Posted by 09GT

That's interesting you point out the car taking a little longer to turn over as a sign. Mine does that when its been sitting for longer than 10 hours. BMW needs to offer some sort of deal on fixing these. Seems like a design flaw.

How many miles/year do you have on your car?

I saw people paying as much as $3800 to fix this part.

I agree. The ICV and throttle actuator problems are all too common. I had one of those go last summer....

Its a 2008 with about 45K miles.

[09GT]

RBB-
Do you have an aftermarket warranty? I passed when I bought my car, but the more I read about Idle Control Values and Throttle Actuator's the more nervous I get. I love my M3, but obscene repair bill's for BMW faulty parts is ridiculous. I can think of better things to do with my money.

[geneatals]

OP, what year and how many miles on your car?

[RBB]

Originally Posted by 09GT

RBB-
Do you have an aftermarket warranty? I passed when I bought my car, but the more I read about Idle Control Values and Throttle Actuator's the more nervous I get. I love my M3, but obscene repair bill's for BMW faulty parts is ridiculous. I can think of better things to do with my money.

I don't, but in hindsight it wouldn't have been a bad idea. I figured I'd chance it when I bought the car as the E9x M3's are pretty reliable except for the ICV and throttle actuator issues. I got lucky on the actuator last summer and BMW goodwilled it when I was just out of warranty. I limped it into the shop this morning, hopefully it'll be a pretty quick fix.

[09GT]

That's nice. I wonder if BWM will start doing more of these as "goodwill" fixes as more of these cases come up. When I was researching the car before I bought it, it seemed like the E9X's were very reliable, but now it seems like a lot of these ICV and throttle actuator issues are spring up. I would assume someone from BMW reads these boards.

I'm also curious what it cost to replace the ICV at a private shop.

Good luck RBB.

[W///]

Originally Posted by RBB

I agree. The ICV and throttle actuator problems are all too common. I had one of those go last summer....

Its a 2008 with about 45K miles.

Sorry to hear about that. Nothing worse than starting the car up and getting the Christmas tree lights. Hope it all goes well.

Originally Posted by 09GT

That's interesting you point out the car taking a little longer to turn over as a sign. Mine does that when its been sitting for longer than 10 hours. BMW needs to offer some sort of deal on fixing these. Seems like a design flaw.

How many miles/year do you have on your car?

I saw people paying as much as $3800 to fix this part.

Originally Posted by 09GT

RBB-
Do you have an aftermarket warranty? I passed when I bought my car, but the more I read about Idle Control Values and Throttle Actuator's the more nervous I get. I love my M3, but obscene repair bill's for BMW faulty parts is ridiculous. I can think of better things to do with my money.

Don't listen to them. I also saw a "quote" for +$2k for throttle actuators which is a complete joke. I have no idea where $3800 came from.

IMHO, it's easy enough to fix these actuators, so warranty does not make sense for me personally.

[RBB]

Originally Posted by W///

Sorry to hear about that. Nothing worse than starting the car up and getting the Christmas tree lights. Hope it all goes well.





Don't listen to them. I also saw a "quote" for +$2k for throttle actuators which is a complete joke. I have no idea where $3800 came from.

IMHO, it's easy enough to fix these actuators, so warranty does not make sense for me personally.

I think the $3,800 came from Benvo's thread last summer where he had the ICV fixed. It did seem like a hell of a lot for that particular job.

Funny enough, the manager just gave me a call and they pulled none of the codes that I did yesterday (I did not clear them). He said everything they pulled pointed to the bank 1 throttle actuator. Very weird....when my bank 2 actuator went out I had no problems holding an idle. The car would just start up in limp mode more and more frequently. It finally got to the point where I was sick of it and took it in.

If it turns out to be the bank 1 TA I'll pick the car back up, order the part and use your DIY, W///. It doesn't look like all that bad of a job. These throttle actuators are ticking time bombs in the S65 and S85. It's ridiculous for them to fail at these kind of mileages.

[W///]

Originally Posted by RBB

I think the $3,800 came from Benvo's thread last summer where he had the ICV fixed. It did seem like a hell of a lot for that particular job.

Funny enough, the manager just gave me a call and they pulled none of the codes that I did yesterday (I did not clear them). He said everything they pulled pointed to the bank 1 throttle actuator. Very weird....when my bank 2 actuator went out I had no problems holding an idle. The car would just start up in limp mode more and more frequently. It finally got to the point where I was sick of it and took it in.

If it turns out to be the bank 1 TA I'll pick the car back up, order the part and use your DIY, W///. It doesn't look like all that bad of a job. These throttle actuators are ticking time bombs in the S65 and S85. It's ridiculous for them to fail at these kind of mileages.

When I had my TA fail on me (1 week after buying the car at that), it stayed on limp mode. Even after disconnecting the battery, the CEL and limp mode stayed on.

No it's not a bad DIY at all. Half a day if you really take your time. I can probably redo mine in 2-3 hours if that. If you need it, I'll PM you my phone number and you can call me if you get stuck on anything.

[RBB]

Originally Posted by W///

When I had my TA fail on me (1 week after buying the car at that), it stayed on limp mode. Even after disconnecting the battery, the CEL and limp mode stayed on.

No it's not a bad DIY at all. Half a day if you really take your time. I can probably redo mine in 2-3 hours if that. If you need it, I'll PM you my phone number and you can call me if you get stuck on anything.

Cool, I appreciate the offer. They're still having a hard time diagnosing it and tried a few software updates today. The tech wanted to keep it overnight and see exactly whats going on during a cold start tomorrow morning as it behaves normally once its been warmed up. I'll shoot you a PM if it turns out to be the TA.

[nujabes24]

Originally Posted by RBB

I agree. The ICV and throttle actuator problems are all too common. I had one of those go last summer....

Its a 2008 with about 45K miles.

Just 45k wtf dude I'm sorry

[kautiongsr]

they go out all the time.. mine went out at 2011 with 12k.. not that bad of a job to replace..

[RBB]

**Update**

Shop couldn't find a problem with the car. On Monday morning I started the car up to take it in....started in limp mode. I stopped about half way to the shop, killed the ignition, started it back up and all appeared well....no faults thrown, idle was fine. Shop had the car in the back by Monday afternoon and did not pull ANY of the same codes I did. In fact, they pulled nothing (or some low occurrence, unrelated throttle actuator faults) which is very strange. I'm 100% certain I did not clear the fault codes.

Manager wanted to keep it overnight to see how it behaved on a true cold start, called me Tuesday and said it started just fine. They took it out for a couple of test drives and said everything was running great. Yesterday when I picked it up it started right up and was running well on the 60 mile trip back home.

However, this morning when I started it up before work the crank was extremely long....longest it's ever been. No codes thrown, idle was fine and it pulled strong, though. Not really sure what to think here....I still believe the ICV is on it's way out. I suppose it could be battery related? It's a 2008 and on the original battery. Think I'll hook it up to my trickle charger overnight to rule that out.

[Canuckles]

Just had my icv replaced as a precaution, 2011.75 with 24k kms. Not uncommon obviously for our cars.

[arter]

Had my IND shop change it on my car.
$375 for the part and about $150 for the labor ( mostly getting down to it as it is under everything.

Don't know how the dealers get to $3000+

[Richbot]

I think the $3k quotes must be for both throttle actuators, they're an $800 part at cheapest and there's two of them, plus a few hours of labor and diagnostics at outrageous markups and there you are

I can't see more than $1k at a dealer for the ICV, there's only one of them, there's less labor, and it's 1/3 the cost of the throttle actuators

[geneatals]

Originally Posted by Canuckles

Just had my icv replaced as a precaution, 2011.75 with 24k kms. Not uncommon obviously for our cars.

precaution? really?

[Lorde]

Originally Posted by arter

Had my IND shop change it on my car.
$375 for the part and about $150 for the labor ( mostly getting down to it as it is under everything.

Don't know how the dealers get to $3000+

$375 for the part...where? Lowest anyone has seen has been about $750. MSRP is over $1000.

[Richbot]

You are thinking of the throttle actuators, the idle control valve is much cheaper, ecstuning sells it for under $300

But a throttle cable is cheaper still, wtf bmw, wtf.

[Canuckles]

Originally Posted by geneatals

precaution? really?

My car has been running like a champ, she has idled well and I hadn't had the rpm 'hunt' in a while. S.a. said they saw a few codes thrown, asked if they could replace it, I asked if there was something more serious. He says no, just know its a common issue and they wanted to replace. Not going to argue with a new icv, so yes slightly precautionary.

Also asked how much the throttle actuator and corresponding parts are, was quoted $1500 not including labour.

[luiscarlos59]

Welcome to the M spending spree!! I just replaced the valve and cost me including labor aprox 1,200k usd.

2 days later another christmas light came on, the engine light and now the problem is the secondary air pump ("emissions air pump") ...which is quoted around 500 usd.
Im out of warranty so I have to pay everything but im so dissapointed with the car i want to sell it.