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12-09-2013, 11:27 AM | #1 |
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My Lap Times Track Data: KW Clubsport Vs. Stock ZCP
KW Clubsport 3 way adjustable Vs. Stock ZCP on Vorshlag Camber Plates
Got the KW's from Sam @ AutoTalent, a real pleasure to do business with. Also to Danny @ MiniCorsa for installing them. He is the most punctual and fastest working man in the business. Tom @ Lucent Motors always does my alignment and kills it. Tried keeping the only variable between track days the suspension. I enjoy seeing hard data not just subjective info. But let me say as well I can't even begin to state how much more responsive the coilovers are than stock, the response, how planted, the feedback, how fast the tires get pressed back to the ground. MOST IMPORTANTLY THE CAR IS EASIER TO DRIVE FASTER. Lap Times Stock suspension on Vorshlag Camber Plates w/ 275/18 Rs3 Tires, Stock Brakes with Hawk Dc70 pads vs KW Clubsport 3 ways (same tires and pads) Both stock engine, stock exhaust w/ Dinan muffler, No aero STOCK KW CLUBSPORT Willow Springs International Raceway: 1:33:9 Vs. 1:32:8 = 1.1 seconds ButtonWillow C13: 2:03:6 Vs. 2:01:7 = 1.9 seconds Auto Club Speedway: 1:56:7 Vs. 1:55:1 = 1.6 seconds Update: 1:59:2 @ Buttonwillow after corner balance/alignment and brake pads and more driving time on suspension. Let me state that ive only been to autoclub speedway two times, once stock and once with the KW's. Also Ive only done one track day at each track with the suspension so I can prob cut more time once I get more track time with the suspension What I also gather from the data is the more turns and especially transitions (left to right etc) the more time I cut. Sweeper ill go a bit fast but I feel I gained the most time in the transitions. The car is able to change directions more stable which allows me to stay full throttle in the area longer and get on it earlier.
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17' M2 DCT - KW CS - Re71r - Carbotech
BW C13 - 1:57:2 ACS - 1:49:6 WSIR - 1:30:6 Last edited by TheKosherStogie; 12-27-2013 at 12:21 PM.. |
12-09-2013, 11:30 AM | #2 |
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This is sick. I have never seen such an accurate and concise comparison for these coils or any other for that matter. Great info!!!! Very valuable
There is hope my civic M3 can now be as good as a ZCP. Just maybe Last edited by 325rider; 12-09-2013 at 11:39 AM.. |
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12-09-2013, 12:07 PM | #4 | |
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1. Where you running the same alignment (camber/toe) settings? 2. Was ride height maintained at stock level? 3. I presume similar tire pressure psi but was that the case? 4. Age and condition of tires for each run? 4. lastly, any outside temperature variations, even an estimate? |
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12-09-2013, 12:50 PM | #5 | |
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2. Ride height when stock was stock. Only alignment changed 3. Same psi 4. Stock times were all on day 1 or day 2. I actually think stock times are on day 1. Auto club on kw was day 4. WSIR kw was day 1 and buttonwillow was day 2. 5. Weather was similar except button was colder on kw. |
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12-09-2013, 01:56 PM | #6 | |
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I'm just curious if you couldn't have achieved the same numbers simply by just adjusting your vorshlag camber a tad more maybe .75 to a degree? Because I suspect, just knowing you have put a newer and *supposedly* better suspension under the skirt, would have given you some additional confidence to push your car a bit more? Nonetheless, nice numbers and hope to see the progression on your next run(s). |
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12-09-2013, 02:24 PM | #7 | |
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12-09-2013, 02:26 PM | #8 | |
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those spring rates and drop sound like no fun on the street cant have it all I suppose. nice driving btw, saw your vids on another thread
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12-09-2013, 06:46 PM | #10 |
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Clubsports are surprisingly compliant on the street once you adjust the damper settings appropriately. It took me a bit of trial and error to find out the best dual purpose setting.
They are now very comfortable and I can take it to the track with minor adjustments. KW clubsports are very underrated. Everyone is caught up on the Ohlin RT and JRZ hype, not saying they are anything but top notch, but the KWs are very capable track dampers. Great review thanks for the post.
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E92 M3 SG DCT - AA Filter, Verstraβe Paddles, ECS SS, MH race stud, Stoptech BBK, MR Exhaust,RE Pulley, BPM Tune,Euro bumper and GTS lip, Euro MDM & DCT, KW CS, Recaro PP, TMS Soild Diff Mounts, MRF solid subframe mounts, GTS aero, RPM track built motor.
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12-09-2013, 07:01 PM | #11 |
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^i agree. We have driven these and the ohlins RT back to back and these are more track oriented. The ohlins are good for the street but u need a higher version for the track which in sure are stupendous but costly.
I drive mine on the street and track. My only car. Compression and rebound is a factory settings. Pretty much the middle |
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12-09-2013, 09:02 PM | #13 |
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Thank you for this; I appreciate that competitive racers wouldn't ordinarily volunteer personal data
My own data supports this, although it is difficult for me to determine how much a 2sec advantage on a tight 3km circuit relates to aggressive KW CS settings or improved driving technique. |
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12-09-2013, 10:35 PM | #14 |
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KW 3 way are leaps above and not to be confused with Clubsports (which I think are nothing special.
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12-09-2013, 10:55 PM | #15 |
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12-10-2013, 08:52 AM | #16 |
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The KW CS 3 way vs 2 way are different only on the compression valving to add the low/high speed adjustment. All else is the same as the 2 way.
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E92 M3 SG DCT - AA Filter, Verstraβe Paddles, ECS SS, MH race stud, Stoptech BBK, MR Exhaust,RE Pulley, BPM Tune,Euro bumper and GTS lip, Euro MDM & DCT, KW CS, Recaro PP, TMS Soild Diff Mounts, MRF solid subframe mounts, GTS aero, RPM track built motor.
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12-10-2013, 09:16 AM | #18 |
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Maybe I'm naive or reading it wrong, but especially when you consider the additional camber on the KW setup (and perhaps the cooler temps for Button Willow) this tells me the stock ZCP with camber plates is actually a pretty good setup and will probably suffice for a good number of weekend warriors (perhaps me included).
Am I reading it wrong? |
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12-10-2013, 09:57 AM | #19 | |
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12-10-2013, 10:45 AM | #20 | |
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I am a newb at the track and my car is way overbuilt for my skill level. I have heard of guys with stock M3s with really fast track times. You can make this car very capable with tires, race fluids, pads, camber plates and braided braked lines.
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E92 M3 SG DCT - AA Filter, Verstraβe Paddles, ECS SS, MH race stud, Stoptech BBK, MR Exhaust,RE Pulley, BPM Tune,Euro bumper and GTS lip, Euro MDM & DCT, KW CS, Recaro PP, TMS Soild Diff Mounts, MRF solid subframe mounts, GTS aero, RPM track built motor.
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12-10-2013, 11:28 AM | #21 | ||
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Great minds think alike, Biggy. I am taking the car up to MRF soon to get high-temp brake fluid and SS brake lines and a set of track pads to swap in when the time comes. Someday I'll grab a set of 18" Apex Arc-8s and wrap them in Michelin Pilot Sport Cups. Sorry for the thread-jack, OP. |
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12-10-2013, 01:20 PM | #22 | ||||
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http://kw-suspension.com/us/kw_variant_3.php http://kw-suspension.com/us/kw_clubsport.php Quote:
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