Sponsored by The Tire Rack

[speedfan]

Hi guys,
I thought I should ask you guys since the M owners probably change wheels more often.

I'm in the market for 19" wheels.
As the title says, which 1 do you think is stronger?

I like the mesh style, but Im already riding on them. So, having the new style like Advan RS is also a good idea. However, MORR is fully forged with 8k tons I was told, whereas Advan RS is flow form cast. So, MORR is stronger, correct?

btw, how much approximately is the Advan RS? they can't be more than $3k right?

I cant decide at this point.
any input please,
Thanks,
Dung

[gthal]

I looked at both wheels very seriously and went with the Morr wheels. What I liked about Morr was the look, weight and strength as a combination. They actually send out the testing reports on the wheel strength when you buy a set which is nice to have.

The Morr wheels weigh slightly less for the fronts and slightly more in the rear. So, let's call weight even. I don't know the strength ratings off hand for the Advans but I would expect they are very strong... I would expect the Morr wheels to be as strong or stronger due to the forging.

I think you should get whichever one you like the look of the most. What I didn't like about the Advans is that they are not as concave and the spokes actually come out from the face before bending back to the hub... just not a style I loved. I can say the Morr wheels look amazing in person (much better than in pictures) and quality is very, very high. The other thing is I think the Advans were a little less money if that matters to you.

Good luck in the decision.

[Cal@Sonic MS]

You can't go wrong with the MORR VS8.2.
They are extremely light and strong, spec is below.
- 19x9.0 ET22mm - 19.8 lbs (painted & cleared)
- 19x10 ET20mm - 23.6 lbs (painted & cleared)

Plus like the above poster mentioned, the MORR has an extremely deep concave rear profile.

In regards to structural strengh, the MORR VS8.2 are fully JWL, VIA and TUV certified. The ADVAN RS are JWL/VIA certified but does not have TUV (German) certification...
Judging from that fact in addition to the proprietary MORR MonoForging technology, I would say the MORR wheel is superior.

[speedfan]

Originally Posted by gthal

I looked at both wheels very seriously and went with the Morr wheels. What I liked about Morr was the look, weight and strength as a combination. They actually send out the testing reports on the wheel strength when you buy a set which is nice to have.

The Morr wheels weigh slightly less for the fronts and slightly more in the rear. So, let's call weight even. I don't know the strength ratings off hand for the Advans but I would expect they are very strong... I would expect the Morr wheels to be as strong or stronger due to the forging.

I think you should get whichever one you like the look of the most. What I didn't like about the Advans is that they are not as concave and the spokes actually come out from the face before bending back to the hub... just not a style I loved. I can say the Morr wheels look amazing in person (much better than in pictures) and quality is very, very high. The other thing is I think the Advans were a little less money if that matters to you.

Good luck in the decision.

I think you put it perfectly of how I feel about the Advan RS.
It's good to know Morr sends out the test report!
Thanks gthal

Originally Posted by Cal@Sonic MS

You can't go wrong with the MORR VS8.2.
They are extremely light and strong, spec is below.
- 19x9.0 ET22mm - 19.8 lbs (painted & cleared)
- 19x10 ET20mm - 23.6 lbs (painted & cleared)

Plus like the above poster mentioned, the MORR has an extremely deep concave rear profile.

In regards to structural strengh, the MORR VS8.2 are fully JWL, VIA and TUV certified. The ADVAN RS are JWL/VIA certified but does not have TUV (German) certification...
Judging from that fact in addition to the proprietary MORR MonoForging technology, I would say the MORR wheel is superior.

Well said. Thanks Cal.

[Cal@Sonic MS]

Originally Posted by shift@red

"Monoforging" is just a "flow formed forge (cast)" isnt it?

Technically yes, just semantics. MORR dubs it "Monoforging", AKA SpunForged / Rotary Forged / Flow Formed Cast.

However, MORR differentiates themselves by utilizing extensive technologies in order to absolutely minimize the weight...without sacrificing structural integrity.

These technologies include, but are not limited to - Vehicle Specific Profiles (VSP) and Finite Element Analysis (FEA) by using Vehicle Specific Load Ratings (VSLR) and Vehicle Specific Weight Optimization (VSWO).

More information and technical details can be found on MORR's webpage.

[gthal]

Originally Posted by Cal@Sonic MS

Technically yes, just semantics. MORR dubs it "Monoforging", AKA SpunForged / Rotary Forged / Flow Formed Cast.

However, MORR differentiates themselves by utilizing extensive technologies in order to absolutely minimize the weight...without sacrificing structural integrity.

These technologies include, but are not limited to - Vehicle Specific Profiles (VSP) and Finite Element Analysis (FEA) by using Vehicle Specific Load Ratings (VSLR) and Vehicle Specific Weight Optimization (VSWO).

More information and technical details can be found on MORR's webpage.

Andy @ Morr told me specifically that they are forged. This very issue came up in the group buy thread. I think his exact words were "have you ever seen a 19lb wheel that is 19x9 that is cast?"

Either way they are very light and very strong and I would have chosen them in any event but it would be nice to clarify.

[GOLFFRR]

I vote for the Morr's

[datbimmerdoe]

ummm, MORRRRRRRRRR



/end thread

[calintexas]

I'm pretty sure Morr starts with a forged blank. Depending on the Advan model, they either start with a casting or a forged blank also. Without the certification test results or actual comparison testing, it's difficult to know which wheels are actually stronger or more durable. Generally, at a similar total wheel weight, you can expect the wheel that started as a forged blank to be a stronger and more durable wheel than the one that started with a casting. There's a great video that shows flow forming from a casting and from a forged blank in the Wheel Manufacturing Methods "sticky" thread: http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=357430.

Morr is a small company that has done what appears to be a very fine job designing, engineering, and developing a wheel that perfectly fits our cars at a very reasonable price. They provide attention to detail and personal service, and they have differentiated themselves from a number of other brands by fully certifying their wheels to JWL/VIA and TUV standards.

Advan is a Yokahama brand. Yokahama is an industrial giant with vast technical resources.

I don't think you can go wrong with either brand.

[Mahmood07]

For what it's worth, I have hit huge potholes and have driven on the worst Boston and NYC roads with my Advan RS with no damage. So I am not sure how important strength of the wheel would be between the two. Go with the ones that look better to you.

[Z K]

I had Advan RS on an previous car. They come in at a lower price point because they are not forged - they are "Flow Formed". Their casting process is very advanced so the wheels come out very strong and light. The paint job could be better as they chipped rather easily from rocks kicked up by other cars... but it's no different than car paint. As mentioned, they are made by Yokohama which also makes OEM wheels for Japanese cars. Also used on WTCC cars and WRC cars in competition. http://www.advanwheels.com.au/about/why-advan.aspx

Basically, it comes down to pricing and which design you like.

[Vudoo4u2]

Originally Posted by shift@red

"Monoforging" is just a "flow formed forge (cast)" isnt it?

Originally Posted by shift@red

Thanks, that's what I thought. Not a true forged wheel in the most literal sense of the manuf. process.

This is incorrect (not trying to flame you, just trying to make sure the thread ends with the proper info)

You can flow form a cast wheel, and you can flow form a forging blank

The latter is what MORR uses, they are not cast wheels, they are a true forged wheel (in every sense of the term)

[gthal]

Originally Posted by Vudoo4u2

This is incorrect (not trying to flame you, just trying to make sure the thread ends with the proper info)

You can flow form a cast wheel, and you can flow form a forging blank

The latter is what MORR uses, they are not cast wheels, they are a true forged wheel (in every sense of the term)

Yeah, that confirms what Morr told me. Thanks for clarifying!

[ianot]

How much for a set of those MORR rims - 19"

[speedfan]

Originally Posted by shift@red

Thanks for clarifying. That was not what had been explained, and no one has ever said different, until your post.
However, they are not a true forged wheel in every sense of the word. Hence part of the reason they need to come up with a term called 'monoforging'.

Here is the way a true forged wheel, ala volks are made. It is NOT the same process morr makes their wheels...so again, not a true forged wheels in every sense of the word.

And this is a flow formed wheel.

wow, very cool vids!

ianot, Morr is retailed for $3500. But there's a deal going on for under $3k.

[ianot]

There out of my price range then. Which of the following rims are the strongest and best:

1. AVG M359
2. Alufelgen SF-17
3. VMR VB3

Are they all TUV approved...

[Cal@Sonic MS]

Originally Posted by ianot

There out of my price range then. Which of the following rims are the strongest and best:

1. AVG M359
2. Alufelgen SF-17
3. VMR VB3

Are they all TUV approved...

AVG M359 - low pressure cast, JWL/VIA certified, no TUV.
Alufelgen SF-17 - low pressure cast, JWL/ VIA certified, not sure on TUV.
VMR VB3 - gravity cast, JWL/VIA certified..no TUV.

Very few wheels in the aftermarket industry are TUV approved. It's a short list, to name a few - HRE, BBS, MORR, Klassen..., there's a few more but I can't think of any more right now.

[Moxie]

Originally Posted by Cal@Sonic MS

AVG M359 - low pressure cast, JWL/VIA certified, no TUV.
Alufelgen SF-17 - low pressure cast, JWL/ VIA certified, not sure on TUV.
VMR VB3 - gravity cast, JWL/VIA certified..no TUV.

Very few wheels in the aftermarket industry are TUV approved. It's a short list, to name a few - HRE, BBS, MORR, Klassen..., there's a few more but I can't think of any more right now.

I couldn't find them in the TuV-Rheinland database. How can you confirm they are TUV? Do you get a certificate with them?

[speedfan]

Originally Posted by Carlos@MORR

That is impression die-forging. It has no quality benefits over non-impression die-forging. Impression die-forging, such as what Volk uses to make their TE-37, is used because of the high volume of wheels they make since machining time is very minimal. The only aftermarket manufacturer I know that uses this method is Volk. No other manufacturer uses it since the tooling cost is approximately half a million dollars.

MonoForging is not a word nor a manufacturing process. MonoForged™ is the name of our 8000-Ton Forged MonoBlock (1PC) product line.

Hi Carlos,
so, bottom line is Morr vs8.2 is 1 piece forged wheel?

Could you describe the forging process of Morr please?

Also, what's the weight load rating for the vs8.2?
Thanks,
D

[gthal]

Originally Posted by ianot

There out of my price range then. Which of the following rims are the strongest and best:

1. AVG M359
2. Alufelgen SF-17
3. VMR VB3

Are they all TUV approved...

I have owned the Alufelgens and they are very good quality. The Alufelgens and the AVG are both manufactured using a better process than VMR. If it were me, I would stick to #1 or #2... plus, VMR is notorious for finish issues. IMO, the VMR wheels would be good winter wheels or if style/cost is your only criteria.

[gthal]

Originally Posted by Carlos@MORR

That is impression die-forging. It has no quality benefits over non-impression die-forging. Impression die-forging, such as what Volk uses to make their TE-37, is used because of the high volume of wheels they make since machining time is very minimal. The only aftermarket manufacturer I know that uses this method is Volk. No other manufacturer uses it since the tooling cost is approximately half a million dollars.

MonoForging is not a word nor a manufacturing process. MonoForged™ is the name of our 8000-Ton Forged MonoBlock (1PC) product line.

Thanks Carlos... you guys should put this info somewhere because this issue comes up often.

[force4rmr]

Originally Posted by gthal

I have owned the Alufelgens and they are very good quality. The Alufelgens and the AVG are both manufactured using a better process than VMR. If it were me, I would stick to #1 or #2... plus, VMR is notorious for finish issues. IMO, the VMR wheels would be good winter wheels or if style/cost is your only criteria.

Have VMR's on my wifes Audi and actually feel the finish is better than on my MORR's..... VMR's are becoming notorious for bending easily though. But to their credit, they stand behind their product and offer excellent customer support, which is an important but often overlooked factor when buying wheels.