E85+ Syvecs + ESS 650

[M1rider]

Hey community,

As some of us have seen syvecs has just released their new S6 Plus DME for the e92 m3 last month.

With the new tuning capabilities on the horizon I was interested in the possibility of running E85 on my supercharger setup. I've read a bunch of threads about e85 being incorporated on the car but most of the problems seem to be with fueling, tuning, and than last but not least the boost that can be run thru the stock motor. I've seen the flex fuel kit being offered but I don't see that as a good option. I'd rather pick up the new syvecs and get the car tuned for e85 use.

But onto my understanding and maybe where other forum members can help me possibly achieve this setup.

First:

As most of the forum members know the stock fuel system is pretty much maxed out with the 650 kits and I was looking at ways to upgrade the fuel system. I've seen that DLSJ5 was running a custom fuel kit that is now being running on a customer with an AA S/C kit at about 9PSi with methanol. But I'm wondering why something like a Walboro 450 cannot be run, sorry sort of new to fueling issues.

Also if so where could we find info on the system that DLSJ5 was running?

Second:

With the new tuning capabilities the next issue would be the tuning, I have not reached out to ESS yet about this possibility but I'm not sure if someone else would be able to tune the car safely. I know the Vortech V3si unit can do around 630-650 whp but if this setup were to exceed the S/C I know Vortech now offers their V2 unit that can hold more power.

Last:

We all have seen around 8Psi of boost put through the motor as a consistent safe option, but with a couple few cars running over 8PSi. I know e85 offers a lot more with regards to heat produce vs gas, and as I've read has way less detonation on the rods in the motor.




So my question is, is it plausible to think that with a new fuel system and the Syvecs DME we can't get an extra 60-70whp out of the kit with the same/ slight increase in boost levels. Obviously anyone running a stock motor should thing about changing rod bearings which I have just had done.


But I would love to hear some info from the community on where the future of power can be had. I've that seen Lucas is running gintani TT setup with around 11psi on e85 and he's doing around 700whp.

As known 650 kits normally dyno around 580whp but I would love to get some more out of my kit. I have seen methanol could be an option to get more but e85 on all other platforms has been so beneficial and I would love to get it solved for the E9x.


Thanks and all input is positive. Sorry for the sloppy format, posted from my phone and will edit when I get to a computer

[Patrón]

Is this build for specific racing? (1/2 mile, mile events)

if you are not going to substantially increase the boost over 8ps, why not just run 100+ race gas when you want the full potential of the kit? I've pondered the syvecs myself but it seems expensive for what I would utilize it for and could potentially get similar results with 100+ race gas. even if i did get a flex fuel kit or the syvecs I would not run e85 every day hence my suggestion of race gas when the need arises.

[M1rider]

^^^ thanks for the input, the use for e85 would be for roll racing. The car is not my daily anymore so using e85 was a thought to gain more power. I've seen that syvecs offers on the fly map changing so changing from an e85 map to a 93 map would not seem like too much of an issue. I've run the kit on race gas and have just let the ECU adapt, haven't actually switched to a race gas map. (Not sure if there is one)

[whats77inaname]

Originally Posted by M1rider

^^^ thanks for the input, the use for e85 would be for roll racing. The car is not my daily anymore so using e85 was a thought to gain more power. I've seen that syvecs offers on the fly map changing so changing from an e85 map to a 93 map would not seem like too much of an issue. I've run the kit on race gas and have just let the ECU adapt, haven't actually switched to a race gas map. (Not sure if there is one)

Benvo offers his tunes for 91 or 93 octane, so I'm sure that someone could make a race gas tune. IIRC, he also has an E85 based tune that someone out there is running (it was in their sig, can't remember who, though.) Gintani also has an E85 tune, IIRC.

I've spoken at length to Roshaun @ Powerhaus about tuning the car based on a smaller pulley to increase the boost. You might want to drop him a line.

[Weyne Masters]

Go to Syvecs ,you cam go up to 660 WHP with e-100 and 2 WALBRO + OEM pump!
Above that you fuel lines and Rail must upgrade to 14 MM instead 8 MM.
You should use 170 LBS Injectors(best choose is ID 1700x)
With appropriate Fuel sistem!We have cars running up to 700 WHP 100 Meth .stock INTERnAL stock road bearings!
Syvecs isn't cheap! But is the best thing for M3.

[OM VT3]

1700 are far to big unless you wanted to make 1500hp

[Patrón]

Originally Posted by M1rider

^^^ thanks for the input, the use for e85 would be for roll racing. The car is not my daily anymore so using e85 was a thought to gain more power. I've seen that syvecs offers on the fly map changing so changing from an e85 map to a 93 map would not seem like too much of an issue. I've run the kit on race gas and have just let the ECU adapt, haven't actually switched to a race gas map. (Not sure if there is one)

the quick map changes is a huge plus as well as the traction control features (if i remember correctly). if you have the money i think it's the best option out there.

i'm going the cheapo route and just use high octane race gas when the need arises and 93 for every day use.

[M1rider]

Hey Weyne Masters I've actually been seeing some of your stuff about looking at the syvecs, I contacted them and just waiting to hear back from their US based dealer that is closest to me. Thanks for the info, I'm guessing the blue injectors on the 650 kit will be overrun with the fueling needed.

[M1rider]

@OM VT3 what injectors do you believe would need to be run???

[M1rider]

@Patrón yea I believe they have boost control through gears from roll racing, also im a DCT (I know huge bummer) but they have features like clutch pressure which would be huge for the DCT as well. There's nothing wrong with running straight 93 tho, I've been here for a couple of years and think I need more power

[OM VT3]

Originally Posted by M1rider

@OM VT3 what injectors do you believe would need to be run???

On a stock motor probably an id750

[Weyne Masters]

ID 1700x is perfect FOR 100% METH! And 700 WHP.

[Weyne Masters]

VT3 just because you do not understand how to works 100 % don't be Rude and ignorant!
For roll race and Drag 100% Meth is the better option!
With Syvecs you can run up to 8 maps,off corse running 100% Meth instead gas on streets it's tuff call.
And also,if ID1700 X run with Meth ,ethanol is a piece off cake!

[OM VT3]

Originally Posted by Weyne Masters

VT3 just because you do not understand how to works 100 % don't be Rude and ignorant!
For roll race and Drag 100% Meth is the better option!
With Syvecs you can run up to 8 maps,off corse running 100% Meth instead gas on streets it's tuff call.
And also,if ID1700 X run with Meth ,ethanol is a piece off cake!

Meth will do more damage then good there's a reason why the flush the fuel systems of drag cars at the end of every meet

[AWTT335i]

Originally Posted by OM VT3

Meth will do more damage then good there's a reason why the flush the fuel systems of drag cars at the end of every meet

Why would you assume he doesnt know that? So far everything he has said has been on point.

Methanol is absolutely a superior fuel, assuming you take the drawbacks into consideration. Every platform pushing the absolute limits its going to be running it...

[M1rider]

Originally Posted by OM VT3

Meth will do more damage then good there's a reason why the flush the fuel systems of drag cars at the end of every meet

Really want to run e85, not so much methanol. But in looking on injector dynamics website and trying to calculate which injector i would need i was unsure of some of the parameters. The fuel pressure on the e92 m3 at max is around 94psi (i believe) and the stock injectors run a 192cc. I dont think weyne is so far fetched with the ID1700 but its around 2k for the set of injectors. Vs the ID1050X which is around 1k for the set and seems like they should do the job.

Walboro 450 E85 PUMP
ID1050X Injectors

what else would i need for the fueling system to complete e85 delivery? just fuel lines and maybe fuel rail?

[OM VT3]

Originally Posted by AWTT335i

Why would you assume he doesnt know that? So far everything he has said has been on point.

Methanol is absolutely a superior fuel, assuming you take the drawbacks into consideration. Every platform pushing the absolute limits its going to be running it...

Just like using a 1700cc injector.....On point

[AWTT335i]

Originally Posted by OM VT3

Just like using a 1700cc injector.....On point

Depending on the HP goal, 1700cc injectors would be appropriate for pure methanol usage... although it may need an even bigger injector unless you are comfortable pushing passed 80% IDC.

[M1rider]

Does anyone know how many CCs the blue injectors are that come with the ESS 650 kits ? I've seen the 525 kit are around 425cc injectors.

[OM VT3]

Originally Posted by M1rider

Does anyone know how many CCs the blue injectors are that come with the ESS 650 kits ? I've seen the 525 kit are around 425cc injectors.

They are 440cc

[OM VT3]

Originally Posted by AWTT335i

Depending on the HP goal, 1700cc injectors would be appropriate for pure methanol usage... although it may need an even bigger injector unless you are comfortable pushing passed 80% IDC.

Just for E85 as the OP said

[M1rider]

Originally Posted by OM VT3

Just for E85 as the OP said

Ive seen a couple of posts stating ESS has the injectors running well over the 80% threshold. I know that is not considered the safest thing to do. 440cc seems a bit small but thanks for the info.

Also the ID725, 850, and new 1050x are all within 100$ of eachother. Doesnt seem like a bad idea to run something a little bit larger than you need to be under that duty cycle threshold.

Really interested to see if anyone has any more insight on fueling systems though. Like i said i would like to run the SYVEC paired with the ID1050x with say a walboro 450. Not sure if i would need to change the size of the fuel rail as Weyne Masters mentioned