Need to have winter tires?

[besiktas]

i had no issues in snow with the CS3's, even though i tried my chances hard, i got stuck only once (over one foot of snow in WV - it wasnt the tires fault, my car literally sat on snow and my rear tires was not touching the ground ) However i cant tell the same for the PS2's. winter with PS2's it was a nightmare, so i got a set of dunlop 3d winter/snow tires for this season.

[abehwang]

Originally Posted by besiktas

i had no issues in snow with the CS3's, even though i tried my chances hard, i got stuck only once (over one foot of snow in WV - it wasnt the tires fault, my car literally sat on snow and my rear tires was not touching the ground ) However i cant tell the same for the PS2's. winter with PS2's it was a nightmare, so i got a set of dunlop 3d winter/snow tires for this season.

You drove the CS3 in snow? Everyone has PS2s and heard how horrible they were in the snow but I never heard of anyone with CS3s in the snow

[abugiacomo]

Originally Posted by kmarei

"as long as you are careful"
I'll ask you this
You're driving in say 30 degree weather, no snow, just cold weather, on your way to work.
And the idiot in front of you brakes hard for no reason
You slam on your brakes
But since your summer performance tires don't have enough grip
You brake in 70 feet, as opposed to the normal 55 feet
Only problem is the other car was 60 feet away
So you slam into the car in front of you
All that, just to save $1.5K?
Not sure if you're into gambling, but those look pretty bad odds

You may be right, and it might be a conspiracy by the tire companies
In which case, you've just saved 1500 dollars
Or
They were right, you saved yourself damage to your car, and no deductible
And no hassle of seeing your car destroyed, through something you did

wow -- such a chilling, thought provoking post...unfortunately i don't live my life based on far-fetched, hypothetical scenarios...instead, i'll go on my 11 year track record of driving sports cars on performance tires during winters in dc without a single incident -- no fender benders, no sliding into a curb, no running in to a car that stops short right in front of me -- nothing...and a couple other points;

"You may be right, and it might be a conspiracy by the tire companies"

you (and others) make reference to this notion that i believe the concept of winter tire utility to be a conspiracy by the tires companies...i'm not sure where you're getting that from, but it's certainly not something i ever said...maybe you should actually read a person's posts before attacking them...

"Not sure if you're into gambling, but those look pretty bad odds "

what "odds" are you talking about exactly?...have you somehow come up with the actual odds that this random hypothetical scenario will come true?...for the record, i am in to gambling, and i'll take that bet all day long...

since it seems to have gotten lost in the shuffle, please allow me to reiterate my basic point visa-vie this thread...from my experience, assuming one drives carefully, i believe winter tires to be unnecessary in the dc-metro area given the fact that our average high temp winter temp is ~45 degrees and the average total annual snowfall is ~16 inches, particularly within the context of this thread where the op clearly states that he has access to public transport in a pinch...i base this claim on 11 years of incident-free winter driving on performance tires in this area...

if you disagree with this, that's your prerogative...i'm not going to try and persuade you to change your mind or come up with some retarded "what if" scenario that somehow proves me right...i'm simply providing my opinion to the op -- hopefully he finds it to be useful...

[Boost3dm3]

get the winter setup. The first year I had the car around this time the weather was 50 during the day but at night got down to the upper 30s. No rain, no snow and the car was losing traction all the time. Ordered winter setup and took the oem ps2 tires off and they were hard as rocks. Got the winter setup and no problems driving in cold temperatures and even in a bit of snow!

[besiktas]

Originally Posted by abehwang

You drove the CS3 in snow? Everyone has PS2s and heard how horrible they were in the snow but I never heard of anyone with CS3s in the snow

Yes my car came with CS3's. from Nov 09 till about March 2011. I was very happy with them, in both dry and wet, and in snow, they performed much better than i expected.
Then when those tires were dead after 15k, i switched to PS2. PS2 ride is significantly quieter and softer, handling in dry is significantly better. but if there is any precipitation, feel a significant loss of traction compared to the CS3's. Little bit of snow with PS2 turned into a nightmare. if i still had the CS3's, i probably wouldnt get the winter set but with the PS2, and with the way i step on the gas, i chose to be on the safe side.
I am currently running on Dunlop Winter Sport 3D's. it took some time (about 200 miles) to break in those tire. when i first installed them i was slipping a lot and had no traction but as i put more and more miles on, the traction is improving. currently i am happy with the traction and probably be happier once the tire are fully broken in

[kmarei]

Originally Posted by abugiacomo

wow -- such a chilling, thought provoking post...unfortunately i don't live my life based on far-fetched, hypothetical scenarios...instead, i'll go on my 11 year track record of driving sports cars on performance tires during winters in dc without a single incident -- no fender benders, no sliding into a curb, no running in to a car that stops short right in front of me -- nothing...and a couple other points;

"You may be right, and it might be a conspiracy by the tire companies"

you (and others) make reference to this notion that i believe the concept of winter tire utility to be a conspiracy by the tires companies...i'm not sure where you're getting that from, but it's certainly not something i ever said...maybe you should actually read a person's posts before attacking them...

"Not sure if you're into gambling, but those look pretty bad odds "

what "odds" are you talking about exactly?...have you somehow come up with the actual odds that this random hypothetical scenario will come true?...for the record, i am in to gambling, and i'll take that bet all day long...

since it seems to have gotten lost in the shuffle, please allow me to reiterate my basic point visa-vie this thread...from my experience, assuming one drives carefully, i believe winter tires to be unnecessary in the dc-metro area given the fact that our average high temp winter temp is ~45 degrees and the average total annual snowfall is ~16 inches, particularly within the context of this thread where the op clearly states that he has access to public transport in a pinch...i base this claim on 11 years of incident-free winter driving on performance tires in this area...

if you disagree with this, that's your prerogative...i'm not going to try and persuade you to change your mind or come up with some retarded "what if" scenario that somehow proves me right...i'm simply providing my opinion to the op -- hopefully he finds it to be useful...

entertaining post
but you never answered any of my questions
what happens if the person in front of you stops, and you need to brake hard?
summer tires have less grip than winter tires
so your stopping distance is longer
do your 11 years of experience have any effect on your braking distance?

watch this video
[u2b]

[/u2b]

[gthal]

Originally Posted by kmarei

entertaining post
but you never answered any of my questions
what happens if the person in front of you stops, and you need to brake hard?
summer tires have less grip than winter tires
so your stopping distance is longer
do your 11 years of experience have any effect on your braking distance?

watch this video
[u2b]

[/u2b]

I think you are wasting your breath (or should I say, typing). Some people believe that because they have been OK before that nothing will happen going forward... maybe he is right, maybe luck, who knows? That's fine as we all make our own decisions. IMO, winter tires tires are cheap insurance and I never understood why people spend $70k + on a car and then cheap out on the most important safety component But, hey, not my car.

[MDSKIER]

Get a winter tire setup and be done with it.

[MDyDinanM]

Lol @ people so content in trying to win the argument in winter vs summer tires.

Are winter tires better for colder conditions and safer? Yes

Is driving BMW summer performance tires in cold/snowy weather reduce traction, grip, and feels like driving on brick shoes? Yes, and member Kmarei is 100% correct. Its physics.

Is anyone going to change each others minds on those of us who keep summer tires In the winter vs those that switch? Probably not.

Is it going to effect anyone on here as to those driving on summers during the winter? Chances are nil...since we care about our cars just as much as anyone else on here and go to great lengths to avoid fender bender situations and other misc hazards on the road.

Like member abugiacomo, I probably won't be getting winter tires either. DC area has had some bad snow, hail, rain, etc days, but as he points out, it doesn't really get that bad enough on a frequent basis. I'll drive in freezing temps, carefully of course. Will I drive when it's snowing, depends on how bad it is. Will I drive when its over a foot of snow on the ground - nope as I'll wait until the salt and clearing crews come through. If conditions are too extreme, I won't drive, especially since I take Metro to work usually, and I can always use my wifes car, which has all seasons

lol

[besiktas]

Yesterday, under heavy rain, I revved up the engine and the traction was pretty good with my winter tires, cant wait to dive around in snow.

[Nine]

I want to have winter tires, just having a hard time tracking them down

[mazing]

Get winter set or at a minimum all seasons. Drop from 19" to 18". Check the marketplace people are always selling setups. You could get by with decent all seasons (I have Conti DWS on Gloss Black Powder Coated VMR rims and TPMS) (so the entire swap is a bolt on for $2K could probably get it done under $2K without custom wheels just make sure the offsets will work and that the TPMS in almost all cases will need to be changed as sensor is different than 2009 or 2010) Find the rims and use Curry's Auto for the tires. They are running a sale still for $10 over cost (tell them Mike with Black M3 CV sent you and ask for Damon)

Why gamble with a $60K+ car, its a minimal investment over the long haul and better to be penny wise than potentially dollar foolish (or even worse personal injury to boot) Its just not worth it. Not suggesting chains and studs just get some and be done

[abugiacomo]

january 6 and 7 2012 in the dc-metro area -- 60+ degrees and sunny...just got back from some back road blastin (it's therapeutic whenever one of my staff and/or clients gets on my nerves)...thank god i have my summer tires on! ;-)...

[novablackm3]

better safe than sorry. winter tires will last a few seasons. also my summer tires were getting pretty stiff after winter use so i put on blizzaks