Solid subframe bushings

italyix · 06-10-2012, 01:33 PM

I just bought the TMS subframe bushings, the delrin encased aluminum ones, along with their diff bushings. I can report back once they are installed.

Also, TMS made if very clear on the phone that running the stiffer engine and tranny mounts will make for a very noisy rides far as NVH goes. They did not recommend those for a DD.

klammer · 06-10-2012, 02:07 PM

Am very interested in this (subframe mounts) as am planning on replacing mine at the end of the season or maybe sooner. Planning on switching to 18's to soften the blow of the new subframe mounts. Eagerly anticipating some feedback from those making the switch. Never launch nor plan on launching the car, just dual duty, track/commuter duties...

Singletrack · 06-10-2012, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by klammer

Eagerly anticipating some feedback from those making the switch.

Me too.

flipm3 · 06-13-2012, 09:33 AM

Good discussion here.

On another note, AKG Motorsport makes a 75D Poly Subframe Bushing for all E90s.

They haven't broken into the E9X market as much, but they are well known in the E30, E36, and E46 crowd. Known for their racing and street products.

Forum sponsor, VS Motorsports, is an authorized dealer for them. Maybe they can share some information about them. They also just installed the solid TMS bushings and mounts in their GTS4 E92.

TurboBimmer · 06-13-2012, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flipm3

Good discussion here.

On another note, AKG Motorsport makes a 75D Poly Subframe Bushing for all E90s.

They haven't broken into the E9X market as much, but they are well known in the E30, E36, and E46 crowd. Known for their racing and street products.

Forum sponsor, VS Motorsports, is an authorized dealer for them. Maybe they can share some information about them. They also just installed the solid TMS bushings and mounts in their GTS4 E92.

What does the 75D refer to? Is that a stiffness rating? How would those bushings compare to the OEM M3 ones?

italyix · 06-13-2012, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autobahn335i

What does the 75D refer to? Is that a stiffness rating? How would those bushings compare to the OEM M3 ones?

75 Durometer, its a stiffness rating yes.

HP Autosport · 06-17-2012, 08:40 AM

We have installed several of these for local racers and what we really mean by that is race cars. These solid bushings aren't meant for street duty at all because of the huge increase in NVH.

tibra1 · 06-17-2012, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HP Autowerks

We have installed several of these for local racers and what we really mean by that is race cars. These solid bushings aren't meant for street duty at all because of the huge increase in NVH.

Thanks for chiming in Harold

Malek@MRF · 06-17-2012, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tibra1

Quote:

Originally Posted by HP Autowerks

We have installed several of these for local racers and what we really mean by that is race cars. These solid bushings aren't meant for street duty at all because of the huge increase in NVH.

Thanks for chiming in Harold

That's a non m3 rear subframe.

The GTS has solid mounts, so does the new M5 (a luxury sedan).

We have installed these at our shop and the increase in harshness is very little, Especially on street compliant suspension and tires.

shendrick · 06-17-2012, 01:18 PM

The epic e46 subframe tear-outs weren't that long ago. Are you guys really sure that you want to head in that direction? Although it is possible that they reinforced the e90 chassis far better - I would guess that taking flex out of the bushings will put lots more stress on the chassis and accelerate sheet metal cracks and tear-outs. Check the Turner site for some nasty e46 vids that they use to sell reinforcing kits.

klammer · 06-17-2012, 06:10 PM

I have the TMS delrin subframe mounts and am just waiting for install. Will see if I feel any difference on street or track. As always, cautiously optimistic

bigjae1976 · 06-17-2012, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shendrick

The epic e46 subframe tear-outs weren't that long ago. Are you guys really sure that you want to head in that direction? Although it is possible that they reinforced the e90 chassis far better - I would guess that taking flex out of the bushings will put lots more stress on the chassis and accelerate sheet metal cracks and tear-outs. Check the Turner site for some nasty e46 vids that they use to sell reinforcing kits.

Reducing the subframe slop is supposed to reduce the likelihood of the failure.

HP Autosport · 06-18-2012, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malekreza11

That's a non m3 rear subframe.

The GTS has solid mounts, so does the new M5 (a luxury sedan).

We have installed these at our shop and the increase in harshness is very little, Especially on street compliant suspension and tires.

M3's will be slightly more sensitive with a couple more additional bearing style instead of rubber bushing.

Some 135 and 335i owners complaint about NVH going from oem to M3 mounts. If you are on a street suspension, why even do this in the first place?

Malek@MRF · 06-18-2012, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shendrick

The epic e46 subframe tear-outs weren't that long ago. Are you guys really sure that you want to head in that direction? Although it is possible that they reinforced the e90 chassis far better - I would guess that taking flex out of the bushings will put lots more stress on the chassis and accelerate sheet metal cracks and tear-outs. Check the Turner site for some nasty e46 vids that they use to sell reinforcing kits.

Reinforcing the sub-frame bushings reduces the chances of tearing the unibody, it does not increase it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by HP Autowerks

M3's will be slightly more sensitive with a couple more additional bearing style instead of rubber bushing.

Some 135 and 335i owners complaint about NVH going from oem to M3 mounts. If you are on a street suspension, why even do this in the first place?

The guys that I have done this for did it for preventive measures even though they use the car for track less often than most track toys. Harold, as you know, the subframe bushings cause a decent amount of catastrophic axle hop. In time, it can either damage the subframe mounts, or the unibody itself.

Orb · 06-19-2012, 07:45 AM

The Delrin sub frame bushing from TMS do make a huge difference in handling and are really well made and designed. The car hooks up a lot better and the annoying trait of the rear end are simply gone for good. The bushing do add some NVH but its comparably to less than 50% of what front camber plates add. I am running poly diff bushing and they do add back ground gear noise that would bother a lot of people. Have Cobb stage 2+ on 335i and I do not get any wheel hop and now have a hard time breaking traction at all anymore but I also changed out a few bushing in the rear to BMW motosports ones.

klammer · 06-19-2012, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orb

The Delrin sub frame bushing from TMS do make a huge difference in handling and are really well made and designed. The car hooks up a lot better and the annoying trait of the rear end are simply gone for good. The bushing do add some NVH but its comparably to less than 50% of what front camber plates add. I am running poly diff bushing and they do add back ground gear noise that would bother a lot of people. Have Cobb stage 2+ on 335i and I do not get any wheel hop and now have a hard time breaking traction at all anymore but I also changed out a few bushing in the rear to BMW motosports ones.

Good to hear, as am going to get the delrin subs installed in the next few weeks, hopefully before my next event and will see if there's a noticeable difference for me. Thanks for the feedback.

TX335 · 06-20-2012, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by klammer

Good to hear, as am going to get the delrin subs installed in the next few weeks, hopefully before my next event and will see if there's a noticeable difference for me. Thanks for the feedback.

Let us know how it goes. Your car is a DD, right?

klammer · 06-20-2012, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TX335

Quote:

Originally Posted by klammer

Good to hear, as am going to get the delrin subs installed in the next few weeks, hopefully before my next event and will see if there's a noticeable difference for me. Thanks for the feedback.

Let us know how it goes. Your car is a DD, right?

It is. My wife drives it to work everyday. Fingers crossed.

cvc 22349a · 06-21-2012, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Malekreza11

That's a non m3 rear subframe.

The GTS has solid mounts, so does the new M5 (a luxury sedan).

We have installed these at our shop and the increase in harshness is very little, Especially on street compliant suspension and tires.

That's what a couple of 335i owners have reported on their cars.

Malek@MRF · 06-26-2012, 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cvc 22349a

That's what a couple of 335i owners have reported on their cars.

Right on.

vinniechin · 07-01-2012, 04:06 PM

Hey all,

Very interested if there are any updates to this? Should the diff bushings be done too in conjunction with the subframe or just one over the other? Thanks.

Vin

italyix · 07-01-2012, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vinniechin

Hey all,

Very interested if there are any updates to this? Should the diff bushings be done too in conjunction with the subframe or just one over the other? Thanks.

Vin

Might as well...thats what Im doing

06-10-2012, 01:33 PM	#23
italyix Captain 141 Rep 979 Posts Drives: '08 E90 M3 Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: Bay Area iTrader: (5)	I just bought the TMS subframe bushings, the delrin encased aluminum ones, along with their diff bushings. I can report back once they are installed. Also, TMS made if very clear on the phone that running the stiffer engine and tranny mounts will make for a very noisy rides far as NVH goes. They did not recommend those for a DD. __________________ Mods: too many the list wont fit in the sig page. PM me Tesla Referral code: http://ts.la/juliana77782
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06-10-2012, 02:07 PM	#24
klammer Brigadier General 97 Rep 3,246 Posts Drives: 11 spc gry m3 e90, 19 X5 Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: chicago iTrader: (0)	Am very interested in this (subframe mounts) as am planning on replacing mine at the end of the season or maybe sooner. Planning on switching to 18's to soften the blow of the new subframe mounts. Eagerly anticipating some feedback from those making the switch. Never launch nor plan on launching the car, just dual duty, track/commuter duties... __________________ mods: track ready stuff
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06-13-2012, 09:33 AM	#26
flipm3 E46 + E90 + F80 192 Rep 2,894 Posts Drives: E46 + E90 + F80 Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Illinois iTrader: (1) Garage List 2009 BMW M3 [0.00] 2002 BMW M3 [0.00]	Good discussion here. On another note, AKG Motorsport makes a 75D Poly Subframe Bushing for all E90s. They haven't broken into the E9X market as much, but they are well known in the E30, E36, and E46 crowd. Known for their racing and street products. Forum sponsor, VS Motorsports, is an authorized dealer for them. Maybe they can share some information about them. They also just installed the solid TMS bushings and mounts in their GTS4 E92. __________________ F80 M3 DCT\|Alpine White . Black Leather \| My Build Thread E90 M3 DCT\|Melbourne Red . Speed Cloth \| My Build Thread E46 M3 6MT\|Jet Black . Black Nappa Leather \| My Build Thread
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06-17-2012, 08:40 AM	#29
HP Autosport Supreme Allied Commander 3834 Rep 54,333 Posts Drives: F80 M3 Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Santa Barbara, AP, Brembo, GIAC, Koni, Ohlins, Performance Friction, www.hpautosport.com iTrader: (36)	We have installed several of these for local racers and what we really mean by that is race cars. These solid bushings aren't meant for street duty at all because of the huge increase in NVH. Attached Images
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06-17-2012, 01:18 PM	#32
shendrick Second Lieutenant 8 Rep 255 Posts Drives: 08 e90 M3, 05 e46 zhp, 07 X3 Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Near Boston MA iTrader: (0)	The epic e46 subframe tear-outs weren't that long ago. Are you guys really sure that you want to head in that direction? Although it is possible that they reinforced the e90 chassis far better - I would guess that taking flex out of the bushings will put lots more stress on the chassis and accelerate sheet metal cracks and tear-outs. Check the Turner site for some nasty e46 vids that they use to sell reinforcing kits.
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06-17-2012, 06:10 PM	#33
klammer Brigadier General 97 Rep 3,246 Posts Drives: 11 spc gry m3 e90, 19 X5 Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: chicago iTrader: (0)	I have the TMS delrin subframe mounts and am just waiting for install. Will see if I feel any difference on street or track. As always, cautiously optimistic __________________ mods: track ready stuff
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06-19-2012, 07:45 AM	#37
Orb Lieutenant Colonel 111 Rep 1,764 Posts Drives: 335 Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Canada iTrader: (1)	The Delrin sub frame bushing from TMS do make a huge difference in handling and are really well made and designed. The car hooks up a lot better and the annoying trait of the rear end are simply gone for good. The bushing do add some NVH but its comparably to less than 50% of what front camber plates add. I am running poly diff bushing and they do add back ground gear noise that would bother a lot of people. Have Cobb stage 2+ on 335i and I do not get any wheel hop and now have a hard time breaking traction at all anymore but I also changed out a few bushing in the rear to BMW motosports ones. Last edited by Orb; 06-19-2012 at 11:14 AM..
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07-01-2012, 04:06 PM	#43
vinniechin Vinnie 9 Rep 174 Posts Drives: E93 Space Gray DCT Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Northern NJ iTrader: (1)	Hey all, Very interested if there are any updates to this? Should the diff bushings be done too in conjunction with the subframe or just one over the other? Thanks. Vin
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