Car and Driver is, "Not crazy about the new M3."

[Rupes]

Doesn't look like C&D's long term test of the new M3 is starting out very well. I'm on my mobile device, but will try and post the entire story when I get home.

[mjposner]

Same gripes as everywhere, to firm, to fast, numb steering, piped in sound, no na engine. Also, competition has simply gotten better, Lexus RC F came close, Mustang 350 is loved, new Vette is a big hit, Hellcat way faster, etc.

Still interested down the line, but must drive to really know. Of course, I generally dislike Japanese cars, Mustang just not snobby enough, corvette is only a two seater, and Hellcat is just too obnoxious and that interior. So doesn't leave much, RS5 or AMG (don't like mercedes that much either). The new Jag?

[V1.47fan]

I think most car mags are just mad because BMW is not buying their ad spots like they used to anymore, instead BMW is heavily spending on internet ads.

[BimmerRookie]

GT350 is next for me, given the E93 decides to quit or break on me..

[V8FunNaturally]

The m4 has a fatal combination of numb steering (no hydraulics) and unpredictable throttle at the limit of adherence (RWD turbo). I believe bmw failed the car in those choices, not in its execution. If you screw up the architecture of a bridge it does not matter if the best builder builds it. If you drive it around town then it's just like a 335i, if you try a spirited drive the m4 has the lack of poise and short focus of an impatient teenager. The car can stupidly get the rear sideways but it's not in a glorified way, just silly and immature joyride way. Just like that donut video bmw marketing emailed. And it's what we are starting to hear from all those reviews now that the initial hype cloud is gone.

If you search for big names RWD turbo performance cars you will find none, because that's a troubled choice. ALL porsche turbo 911 are AWD, all merc turbo are AWD, all Audi turbo are AWD, the GT-R (turbo) is AWD.
One exception is the Ferrari Cali T. But Ferrari did a better job by making the available torque gear dependent, limiting it at the RPM low end except in higher gears trying to imitate ' a Naturally Aspirated car " response. Why imitate when you can have the real thing.

[Black Gold]

Originally Posted by sunsweet

The m4 has unpredictable throttle at the limit of adherence (RWD turbo).

all merc turbo are AWD, all Audi turbo are AWD, the GT-R (turbo) is AWD.
.

can you find me an example of someone writing the bolded portion, specifically?

second of all, that is 100% false about Mercedes.

the e63 is available in RWD, the new turbo amg gt is RWD only, and the C63 amg will be RWD only.

[Law]

Full Article here:
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...rm-test-review


A very lukewarm reception...especially for C&D

[OneMmmm]

Originally Posted by mjposner

Same gripes as everywhere, to firm, to fast, numb steering, piped in sound, no na engine. Also, competition has simply gotten better, Lexus RC F came close, Mustang 350 is loved, new Vette is a big hit, Hellcat way faster, etc.

I've not seen any praise for the RC F anywhere. I even recall Lexus having to cancel part of a press driving event in Japan because of a lack of interest.

Mustang GT350: This hasn't even been tested by the press as far as I know. It does look very promising though.

Vette -- Absolutely! No argument there.

Hellcat -- Agree that the Hellcat just isn't appealing. Wouldn't mind listening to its soundtrack though!

The new C63/C63s should provide a swift kick in the ass... waiting to see this debut in the hands of C&D, R&T, MT, and especially Chris Harris.

[Rat3d ///M]

That is all fine with me. The more bad reviews, problems and complaints these cars get, the longer my E90 will hold it's value.

[IEDEI]

i'm surprised at how negative the reviews for the M3 are these days.....i've been considering an F80 M3 as a 'family car' to join my current stable in a couple of years---but i feel a bit more skeptical about it these days. Will have to take a drive one of these days to see if all these complaints are substantiated.

[V8FunNaturally]

Originally Posted by KennyPowers

can you find me an example of someone writing the bolded portion, specifically?

second of all, that is 100% false about Mercedes.

the e63 is available in RWD, the new turbo amg gt is RWD only, and the C63 amg will be RWD only.

Absolutely, There are several on those lines. Check other threads giving other reviews references too.

Road and Track Magazine: Performance Car of the year (Porsche 2014 GT3 wins)

"[The M4] is also unacceptably traction-compromised..."

" This car requires rheostat-precise use of the throttle to avoid unpredictable yaw. "

"This car is nightmarish to control under power, It's so much work, and there's no joy to be had as a result."

"The M3 is the only car to actually scare me at the Motown Mile. Going around the fast final turn, the torque spikes and sends me into a long, lazy, 100-mph slide that I don't recover until well down the front straight."


And 2)

2014 E63 AMG V8 biturbo is permanent AWD

The AMG GT is RWD but at least hydraulic steering

CLS63 AMG is AWD

C63 S AMG is initially announced as RWD but i bet there will be an AWD option.

[Law]

Originally Posted by sunsweet

The m4 has a fatal combination of numb steering (no hydraulics) and unpredictable throttle at the limit of adherence (RWD turbo). I believe bmw failed the car in those choices, not in its execution. If you screw up the architecture of a bridge it does not matter if the best builder builds it. If you drive it around town then it's just like a 335i, if you try a spirited drive the m4 has the lack of poise and short focus of an impatient teenager. The car can stupidly get the rear sideways but it's not in a glorified way, just silly and immature joyride way. Just like that donut video bmw marketing emailed. And it's what we are starting to hear from all those reviews now that the initial hype cloud is gone.

If you search for big names RWD turbo performance cars you will find none, because that's a troubled choice. ALL porsche turbo 911 are AWD, all merc turbo are AWD, all Audi turbo are AWD, the GT-R (turbo) is AWD.
One exception is the Ferrari Cali T. But Ferrari did a better job by making the available torque gear dependent, limiting it at the RPM low end except in higher gears trying to imitate ' a Naturally Aspirated car " response. Why imitate when you can have the real thing.

You forgot about the 911 GT2. Turbo + RWD, a winning combination

http://www.worldcarfans.com/11210114...ash-at-160-mph

Which is Exactly Why Porsche Discontinued It (or hesitant to release a new one)

Traditionally, the GT2 is a rear-wheel drive version of the 911 Turbo, but making the rear wheels do all of the work could make a new GT2 worse than the current Turbo S, because it wouldn’t have as much traction.

Traction has always been an issue for the GT2, which is pitched as both a more elemental alternative to the high-tech Turbo and a more extreme version of the naturally-aspirated GT3. Less-precise handling is part of its character.

[thekurgan]

As much as I distrust most of the internet reviews (aka "First Impression" reviews) on forums, I can literally trip over all the fucks I haven't given about C&D.

[rjd598]

isn't this the first "bad" review of the f8x? i mean as in overall not picking out little things they didn't like. other reviews overall liked the car but complained usually about sound

[V8FunNaturally]

Originally Posted by thekurgan

As much as I distrust most of the internet reviews (aka "First Impression" reviews) on forums, I can literally trip over all the fucks I haven't given about C&D.

This isn't C&D or not some internet review. It's a serious magazine.

[thekurgan]

Originally Posted by sunsweet

This isn't C&D or not some internet review. It's a serious magazine.

Right.

[gatorfast]

Im not crazy about all of these threads bashing the new M3. Who cares.

[V8FunNaturally]

Originally Posted by Law

You forgot about the 911 GT2. Turbo + RWD, a winning combination
Which is Exactly Why Porsche Discontinued It (or hesitant to release a new one)

[/URL]

Very good point. Thanks for pointing that out.

[Black Gold]

Originally Posted by sunsweet

Absolutely, There are several on those lines. Check other threads giving other reviews references too.

Road and Track Magazine: Performance Car of the year (Porsche 2014 GT3 wins)

"[The M4] is also unacceptably traction-compromised..."

" This car requires rheostat-precise use of the throttle to avoid unpredictable yaw. "

"This car is nightmarish to control under power, It's so much work, and there's no joy to be had as a result."

"The M3 is the only car to actually scare me at the Motown Mile. Going around the fast final turn, the torque spikes and sends me into a long, lazy, 100-mph slide that I don't recover until well down the front straight."


And 2)

2014 E63 AMG V8 biturbo is permanent AWD

The AMG GT is RWD but at least hydraulic steering

CLS63 AMG is AWD

C63 S AMG is initially announced as RWD but i bet there will be an AWD option.

yeah so not one of those comments says that the throttle isn't linear. only the second one says anything about throttle control at all

newsflash, high powered cars with RWD are trickier to drive than lower powered ones. that applies to ANY car.

and again, like I said, you were dead wrong about amg offering no rwd turbo cars. their flagship sports car and sports sedan are rwd.

EDIT : enough said here, this forum is for the e9x, not the f8x.

[W///]

Originally Posted by gatorfast

Im not crazy about all of these threads bashing the new M3. Who cares.

Yea seriously. Why don't you guys keep that in the F80 section. Has absolutely nothing to do with the E9x.

[grantmax]

These threads are becoming a daily occurrence. I don't need a biased review written by some professional motorhead to tell me which car I'd rather drive.

My favorites are the "will [insert F8x part] fit my E9x" threads.

[Alex07M3]

Originally Posted by W///

Yea seriously. Why don't you guys keep that in the F80 section. Has absolutely nothing to do with the E9x.

Has a lot to do with the E9x(it's the new version) and even more with the E9x owners who are the most liable people to buy the new car.

And you know how it is on the other forum, really not the best place to discuss the flaws of the new car!