M3 maual transmission characteristics?

[jaehshim]

Just had a chance to drive a 2012 gti 6mt and i am shocked...
It is so different from my 09 M3 6MT.

My gearbox is factory oem, about 20k miles on it.

1. Reverse gear
The amount of force needed for reverse is so different.
Ours is push hard left then up, these are jus push in with one finger and it goes in left up so easily.

2. 1st and 2nd gear
Mine tends to " grind" on 1st and 2nd gear compared to 3rd,4th,5th and 6th. What i mean by grind is that it requires lots of force, and it feels very mechanical. Gti was totally different. It was probably the smoothest tranny ive ever driven.

3. Local & highway cruise
Again, gti was so smooth compared to m manual.

For those who have driven gti manuals, whats your opinion on it? Is this "mechanical" feel just unique characteristics of M transmissions?
How can i make it smooth like the gtis, SSK?

[exmowner]

our syncros are designed to take a beating and deal with higher horsepower and torque numbers then the gti as well. Go test drive a gti with 60,000 miles and let me know what you think. They wear terribly. I personal like my 6sp feels like a true drivers car.

[jaehshim]

Originally Posted by exmowner

our syncros are designed to take a beating and deal with higher horsepower and torque numbers then the gti as well. Go test drive a gti with 60,000 miles and let me know what you think. They wear terribly. I personal like my 6sp feels like a true drivers car.

I see...

Is there any other "mechanical" reasons based on engineering standpoint?
How does E90 Non-M cars drive (328 & 335i manual)like? similar to the M manual?

I used to drive some random Manual cars in the past (TJ Wrangler and EP3 Civic Si). I was just totally shocked with this GTI(VAG) manual tranny. In a good way it is so smooth and easy without any "grindy feel", quite literally 0 resistance when gear changing, gear going in so smooth.
Yet in a bad way the gear goes in so easy and without much force that it might jus pop out of the engaged gear with little force to the shifter.

[lve2xlr8]

Drive an s2000 or a Porsche if you want to experience sublime shifting.

[Z K]

Originally Posted by lve2xlr8

Drive an s2000 or a Porsche if you want to experience sublime shifting.

+1 The best feeling gear boxes are from Honda and Porsche. So smooth and direct. Out of the Japanese manufacturers Nissan has by far the worst manuals. Very vague and mushy.

[HotIce]

Originally Posted by lve2xlr8

Drive an s2000 or a Porsche if you want to experience sublime shifting.

This.

[HotIce]

I drove a 'vette In MT guise and while shifts are nice, to could get a smooth change. I also drove an STI and all I have to say is...forget about it. The clutch bites late, and is mush. Worst Mt trans I have driven to date.

[ChrisDUS]

Originally Posted by Z K

+1 The best feeling gear boxes are from Honda and Porsche. So smooth and direct. Out of the Japanese manufacturers Nissan has by far the worst manuals. Very vague and mushy.

Maybe standard Porsches. Just like standard BMWs.

But 996 GT3 RS, 996 GT2, 997 GT3RS Mk.2 all had similar shift feel as the M3.

They all feel very mechanical inkl. the noises that go with that. That's how it is and that's why they withstand track abuse.

Try this with a VW gearbox.

But for a DD, I'd rather have a gearbox like in the VWs or standard BMWs.

Had by GF drive my M3 yesterday for the first time and god did it feel harsh and rough. Definitely need some feeling and understanding to drive the M3 6MT smoothly.

[karussell]

I drove them back to back yesterday for first time. getting into the GT3 RS again its much more direct feeling than M3. I think I prefer the M3 manual as a daily driver which it will be for me. both great gear boxes. love the clutch pedal feel in the gt3 more though. also the lightweight flywheel. whats available for M3 manual transmission to make it a little more free revving? don't care if it makes more noises. more noises the better.

[LarThaL]

I have no issue with the M3 gearbox. The shifter is a little light but you get used to it and it makes for very fast shifts, as does the clutch.

[Dreamz]

Originally Posted by Z K

+1 The best feeling gear boxes are from Honda and Porsche. So smooth and direct. Out of the Japanese manufacturers Nissan has by far the worst manuals. Very vague and mushy.

Even shifting in my 6MT Accord was heaven. I was appalled when I bought my Z. I'm hoping when it's time to order my M that it's a lot better than my Nissan.

[Ghetto2315]

Originally Posted by lve2xlr8

Drive an s2000 or a Porsche if you want to experience sublime shifting.

+3

I had an 08 Civic Si Coupe (identical to the S2K's shifter) for my DD back in the day and the shifting was superb

[gatorfast]

I owned a MKV gti and actually remember the clutch/shifter being similar to the M3 in terms of ease of use. I prefer the M3 shifting more though. If you think the M3 feels mechanical, try driving a Z4 M. The M3 shifts effortlessly compared to the M coupe.

[Rodgers]

Regarding the comparison to the 328i gearbox, the m3 is stiffer, more direct, mechanical. The 328 is excellent but the clutch lacks the precision found in the m. This is obviously due to the mechanical design conditions (double HP, 50% more torque).

Unlike others here my gearbox is excellent and my 1-2 is quite good. It should be noted I have spent considerable time in other makes and while each is different in feel, throw and engagement the M is hard to fault. Fast and light and you will be alright.

This car demands an extremely fast left foot and shift due to the low rotational inertia in the drivetrain. The s2000 is excellent as stated in the previous post.

[tjsabec]

I have 103,000 miles on my 2008 gti... I think the shifter still feels good, but the clutch feels like crap. I don't think the two shifters feel all that much different though.

[kchu221]

Originally Posted by Z K

+1 The best feeling gear boxes are from Honda and Porsche. So smooth and direct. Out of the Japanese manufacturers Nissan has by far the worst manuals. Very vague and mushy.

+1

i had a 2011 g37 manual before my m3 6mt, and my g37 was hard to get used too...

[quiksi]

Originally Posted by lve2xlr8

Drive an s2000 or a Porsche if you want to experience sublime shifting.

- a fantastic manual transmission is one thing that Honda has yet to screw up in spite of itself...

[WarrantyTracker]

Originally Posted by jaehshim

Just had a chance to drive a 2012 gti 6mt and i am shocked...
It is so different from my 09 M3 6MT.

My gearbox is factory oem, about 20k miles on it.

1. Reverse gear
The amount of force needed for reverse is so different.
Ours is push hard left then up, these are jus push in with one finger and it goes in left up so easily.

2. 1st and 2nd gear
Mine tends to " grind" on 1st and 2nd gear compared to 3rd,4th,5th and 6th. What i mean by grind is that it requires lots of force, and it feels very mechanical. Gti was totally different. It was probably the smoothest tranny ive ever driven.

3. Local & highway cruise
Again, gti was so smooth compared to m manual.

For those who have driven gti manuals, whats your opinion on it? Is this "mechanical" feel just unique characteristics of M transmissions?
How can i make it smooth like the gtis, SSK?

Funny, mabye it's a BMW thing. What you say of the M manual could also be said of the manual in my '79 323i Euro. Though I should point out it's the 5 speed from an E30, which a PO put in at about 160,000 miles. I don't know whether the swap was to get the extra gear, or because the E21 original 4-speed got lunched. Regardless, the car has driven like a champ ever since, but we don't really know how long, because the E30 tranny doesn't have the necessary speedo/ODO pickup on it.

[RedHawk1980]

My 2012 E92 6mt tranny shifts alot easier than my 05 E46 manual. Clutch is way different also. The e46 clutch worked my left thigh but had such a smooth travel. I must say I like the feel of the E92 clutch better. Lots easier to engage smoothly and not such a workout.

[isugoo]

Originally Posted by lve2xlr8

Drive an s2000 or a Porsche if you want to experience sublime shifting.

+1000.

[ilya335]

One of the reasons why I ended up going with DCT.

As others have mentioned, the shifting and clutch feel on lets say a Porsche (in my case it was a 2010 Boxster S) or a S2000 is absolutely sublime! The M3 6mt never felt that way, and I also believe it's the same mt in the 335i's.

I know others have done mods such as the clutch spring removal, cdv, and adding a ZHP knob or a short shift kit to the 6mt, which improve overall feel. But it will never have that "Winchester rifle bolt cocking" feel to it.

Don't get me wrong though, I still occasionally miss the 6mt feel and connection you get with a car, but I guess I'll just have to wait for another time.

[mgiglio2]

When I first got my M3 I was somewhat disappointed with the manual transmission/clutch engagement. Searched a bunch on the forums and found a thread about removing the clutch spring, did it and things got better. Then I updated to the newest software and things improved more. The transmission is still far from perfect but MUCH better. I would recommend both of these two anyone who isn't happy with the transmission.