Gintani SC kit = Game Over

[niterider]

Originally Posted by Nawaaz

^ Definitely the exhaust tips!

They turn me ON!

lol, dont worry urs is on its way

[endofanera7]

Congrats on the numbers bro!

[Nawaaz]

Originally Posted by niterider

lol, dont worry urs is on its way

YIPEEEEEEEEE!

[niterider]

Originally Posted by endofanera7

Congrats on the numbers bro!

Thanks! Let me know when ur ready for ur kit and Ill talk to Alex for u

[bigpuna]

Originally Posted by niterider

Thanks guys...Heres the graph for the non believers This is on 9.5lbs on 91oct. by the way.

Nice numbers but it looks like you have some tuning issues from 2k -5k. As far as dyno numbers between dynojet and dyno dynamics you should get a dyno on a dynojet as the dyno dynamics is very operator settings dependent and the numbers can be skewed very easy. Dyno Dynamics dynos are not always 10%-20% lower then dynojets. If properly calibrated they should read a little lower but there is that If part. Dynojets can print out all the corrections made so it is easy to see how accurate the numbers are and what changes were made if any. I had a shop dyno my old Z4M on a Dyno Dynamics and because the guy entered the wrong information the car dynoed about 20hp to high. The only reason I knew this was because he told me. He later corrected the load and weather corrections settings, we ran it again and the power came down. Dynojets on the other hand dont rely on the operator as much so you see more consistant numbers from them that is most likely why you see AA, ESS and VF all use Dynojets.

[endofanera7]

Originally Posted by niterider

Thanks! Let me know when ur ready for ur kit and Ill talk to Alex for u

but 1st you need to give me a ride in the beast

[powertrip]

Gintani's dyno reads 5-8% lower than a Dynojet, so it's not the lowest reading Dyno Dynamics out there.

[Jonmartin]

I'm pretty sure Gintani's dyno is just as low as most other Dyno Dynamics out there especially since both my car and Niteriders car made between 315-320whp stock. So if he gained ~215whp thats pretty damn good if you ask me. And out of the many cars I've seen dyno on this machine as well as other dynojets they were no where near close in numbers. So regardless of the dyno used what is important is the gain produced.

My stock Dynos for comparison:

[powertrip]

Yeah I'm making my guess based on my numbers on their dyno, as well as your 379 vs 398 on a Dynapack. If Gintani's dyno read really low like RPI's, your 379 would be 560ish to the crank which just isn't happening. Didn't you calculate that 379 equated to 500 crank on your car? You are correct though, the increase in power is no joke. I've come to expect this from Alex .

Originally Posted by Jonmartin

I'm pretty sure Gintani's dyno is just as low as most other Dyno Dynamics out there especially since both my car and Niteriders car made between 315-320whp stock. So if he gained ~215whp thats pretty damn good if you ask me. And out of the many cars I've seen dyno on this machine as well as other dynojets they were no where near close in numbers.

[Jonmartin]

Originally Posted by powertrip

Yeah I'm making my guess based on my numbers on their dyno, as well as your 379 vs 398 on a Dynapack. If Gintani's dyno read really low like RPI's, your 379 would be 560ish to the crank which just isn't happening. Didn't you calculate that 379 equated to 500 crank on your car?

Well I've seen M3's dyno at RPI and they were right inline with my stock numbers. Also when I made the 500 crank calculation It was using PG's calculation method. Based on the Calibrated numbers PG quoted.

Basically like this.

414 / 315 = 1.314 x 379 = 498.1

and my DP results

414 / 335 = 1.235 x 398 = 491.8

[niterider]

Originally Posted by bigpuna

Nice numbers but it looks like you have some tuning issues from 2k -5k. As far as dyno numbers between dynojet and dyno dynamics you should get a dyno on a dynojet as the dyno dynamics is very operator settings dependent and the numbers can be skewed very easy. Dyno Dynamics dynos are not always 10%-20% lower then dynojets. If properly calibrated they should read a little lower but there is that If part. Dynojets can print out all the corrections made so it is easy to see how accurate the numbers are and what changes were made if any. I had a shop dyno my old Z4M on a Dyno Dynamics and because the guy entered the wrong information the car dynoed about 20hp to high. The only reason I knew this was because he told me. He later corrected the load and weather corrections settings, we ran it again and the power came down. Dynojets on the other hand dont rely on the operator as much so you see more consistant numbers from them that is most likely why you see AA, ESS and VF all use Dynojets.

True they do range but unless the Dyno user is really retarded (which is def not the case here) DynoJets will always read atleast 10% higher and on average 18%, this is from several peoples experiences not just mine. I dynoed on a DynoJet after a DynoDynamics on same day conditions and the difference was about 12%. However this was on a new DynoJet with less then a year of wear. Now I just said 18% because that has shown to b the average difference when comparing these 2 dynos. This is thru many peoples experiences, magazine testing, tuners etc...

They have dynoed several M3s and many other cars, Im sure they know what they are doing. They just recently dynoed a turboed B18 (honda) that did 513whp on Gintanis DD and the next day which was about the same temp the car did 615whp on a Dyno Jet. Thats about a 19% difference.

As far as ur last comment, other companies use DynoJets mainly because they are much more affordable not because "they prefer them." The AWD DynoDynamics that Gintani has is much more expensive then a DynoJet.

[bigpuna]

Originally Posted by Jonmartin

I'm pretty sure Gintani's dyno is just as low as most other Dyno Dynamics out there especially since both my car and Niteriders car made between 315-320whp stock. So if he gained ~215whp thats pretty damn good if you ask me. And out of the many cars I've seen dyno on this machine as well as other dynojets they were no where near close in numbers. So regardless of the dyno used what is important is the gain produced.

Correct but to get an accurate comparison you need to rely on the dyno operators accuracy and honesty during the two sessions With the dyno dynamics because the correction factors and load settings do not print out on the dyno sheet the only person who knows what settings were used for the different runs is the operator, the customer has to believe what he is told. It is very easy on a Dyno Dynamics to have a 10% correction difference from one run to the next. The dynojet prints out the corrections used so customers can see if the settings from one session to another were the same.

[niterider]

Originally Posted by endofanera7

but 1st you need to give me a ride in the beast

For sure!

[niterider]

[QUOTE=bigpuna;5892366]

Originally Posted by Jonmartin

I'm pretty sure Gintani's dyno is just as low as most other Dyno Dynamics out there especially since both my car and Niteriders car made between 315-320whp stock. So if he gained ~215whp thats pretty damn good if you ask me. And out of the many cars I've seen dyno on this machine as well as other dynojets they were no where near close in numbers. So regardless of the dyno used what is important is the gain produced.

Correct but to get an accurate comparison you need to rely on the dyno operators accuracy and honesty during the two sessions With the dyno dynamics because the correction factors and load settings do not print out on the dyno sheet the only person who knows what settings were used for the different runs is the operator, the customer has to believe what he is told. It is very easy on a Dyno Dynamics to have a 10% correction difference from one run to the next. The dynojet prints out the corrections used so customers can see if the settings from one session to another were the same.

They use SAE correction factor, u can see it on the screen as they Dyno ur car.

[Jonmartin]

Originally Posted by niterider

+1 and I've never seen Alex change settings between runs and that would be hard to miss lol..

[niterider]

Originally Posted by Jonmartin

+1 on that too. lol Plus if this was true dnt u think he would had "sabotaged" the dyno when Jon dynoed with his G power SC kit so that it looked like it made no power and everyone would buy his kit???

Yeah not happening. Alex isnt shady like that. He would rather improve his kit to make more power before he would change some dyno numbers. And trust me as soon as people get their ESS, Vf etc kits, I will b in Mexico waiting

[yowhuddupb]

damn! congrats Brian! i remember when you first bought it too! it has definitely came a long way brotha! trying to get rid of my 335 for a M now!

[Jonmartin]

Originally Posted by PencilGeek

You two are missing the point. BigPuna is pointing out one of the little known secrets about Dyno Dynamics dyno's: they have a secret screen that you (the user) don't see, and in this screen the dyno operator can change the correction "factor." He's not talking about changing the "SAE Correction," he's talking about a multiplier that scales the measured results (multiplies them) before printing on the screen. DD operators can change this value to anything they want -- such as 1.25. All measured results would be measured by 1.25 before displaying on the screen, and the end user would never know it.

I know of one DD dyno in SoCal that does not set this multiplier to 1.0 (unscaled results). He set it to 1.13 -- meaning the DD results are multiplied by 1.13 before displaying on the screen.

We both know that. Fact is for them to make the change between runs we would see it especially since we're looking at the screen the whole time so unless they can change these settings while dynoing the car at the same time remotely thats really not likely.

[bigpuna]

Originally Posted by niterider

Also for those of u who are more familiar with DynoJets. The difference between a DynoDynamics and a DynoJet from what Ive read and what Ive experienced is DynoDynamics reads about 18% lower then a dynoJet.

So just so u guys can get an idea, 534whp on a DynoDynamics is about 630whp on a DynoJet.

My comparisons of dynos were based around trying to correct your math. From my expierence with FI is not possible to produce 630 whp on 91 octane at 9.5 psi of boost on a 12.5:1 CR motor. I was simply trying to explain that the the corrections you were using based on what you were told or read were off. If the Dyno Dynamics Gintani uses is really around 15% lower then a dynojet and it is making 535 whp then you would be looking at a dynojet number on your kit of 630 whp on 91 octane at 9.5 psi. Add in the 15% loss that this car has on a dynojet and you are saying that your car is making close to 740 crank HP. I hope you understand where I was going with this.

If you are saying that the Gintani kit is making 740 HP on 91 octane and 9.5 psi then everything you have said makes total sense but it goes against science To make this math work you would need to do one of three things. 1. Raise your octane rating 2. Raise your boost 3. Lower your % difference between what Gintani made on the dyno VS what the car would make on a dynojet.

So the question for you is is this a kit that customers can buy and it will make 740 HP on 91 octane ?? If so then you have one hell of a kit on your hands

[Sales@Gintani.com]

Since these assumptions came up on our thread some of you might be implying that we are not being honest with our numbers...

Everyone might think that we are just a new company that came out of no where but we have been around since 2003 doing heavy research and development ...


Any dyno, any time, you pick the place, and we will be there.

[bigpuna]

Originally Posted by Raz@Gintani.com

Since these assumptions came up on our thread some of you might be implying that we are not being honest with our numbers...

Everyone might think that we are just a new company that came out of no where but we have been around since 2003 doing heavy research and development ...


Any dyno, any time, you pick the place, and we will be there.

Raz I dont think anyone is saying you are not being honest with your numbers but if the info that was posted by niterider is correct and your dyno reads 18% lower then the average dynojet then your kit makes around 740 HP on 91 octane with 9.5 psi of boost. can you confirm your kit is rated at these numbers ? If not can you tell us what it is rated at ?

[DLSJ5]

Originally Posted by bigpuna

My comparisons of dynos were based around trying to correct your math. From my expierence with FI is not possible to produce 630 whp on 91 octane at 9.5 psi of boost on a 12.5:1 CR motor. I was simply trying to explain that the the corrections you were using based on what you were told or read were off. If the Dyno Dynamics Gintani uses is really around 15% lower then a dynojet and it is making 535 whp then you would be looking at a dynojet number on your kit of 630 whp on 91 octane at 9.5 psi. Add in the 15% loss that this car has on a dynojet and you are saying that your car is making close to 740 crank HP. I hope you understand where I was going with this.

If you are saying that the Gintani kit is making 740 HP on 91 octane and 9.5 psi then everything you have said makes total sense but it goes against science To make this math work you would need to do one of three things. 1. Raise your octane rating 2. Raise your boost 3. Lower your % difference between what Gintani made on the dyno VS what the car would make on a dynojet.

So the question for you is is this a kit that customers can buy and it will make 740 HP on 91 octane ?? If so then you have one hell of a kit on your hands

The ESS kit made 602whp on 93 octane at 8-9psi, DIN CF, but in your opinion does this go against science as well?