Buttonwillow C13 being chased by 996 GT3 and I spin pretty big :)

[knolow]

Nice driving. Minus the wipe out you did a good job keeping him off.

[TheKosherStogie]

^thanks!

And from the videos and what I've seen on the track nothing sketchy about Tri-Jeans driving. Unless he was refered to you getting a little sideways sometimes which is some of the most fun

[Billj747]

Originally Posted by Ti-Jean

GT3 is mine, it's a 996 GT3 relatively stock except for suspension (JRZ race single adjustable with 800/1000 springs). I was running on NT01 for the session on the video.

Sorry about the shaky camera... it annoys me as well... looking for a better mount.

What are you finding sketchy?

Its a little hard to tell due to the jerky video but it looked over-sprung, a bit twitchy, skipping over bumps, and snapping loose. You have good car control but it looked a bit stiff especially for BW. How much does your car weigh?

[OC3]

Seems to me that those snapping-loose-and-so-had-to-correct scenes have more to do with steering input errors than any suspension setup issue.

On these 3 corners:

0:25 Sunrise (pinched the steering wheel - i.e. didn't unwind soon enough. After the apex, see how the car follows the inside contour of the track, rather than moving out towards the track out)

2:13 Sunset (pinched the corner. Turned in too early - i.e. when the tail comes out, the nose still hasn't cleared the apex)

2:29 Sunrise (pinched the corner. Turned in too early - i.e. when the tail comes out, the nose still hasn't cleared the apex)

I know this because, as many of my Oh Sh*t Moments video show, I've done a ton of that.

[Billj747]

It would be much easier to tell with a better mounted camera but without knowing the weight of the car or tire size, its hard to say but I'd think it should hook up better coming out of buttonhook than that, and 800 sounds a bit high for a fairly stock GT3.

Would like to see more laps with better camera mounting.

[OC3]

If, by "buttonhook," you're referring to Off-Ramp, then those two I think also seem to be steering-input related:

0:35 Jean unwinds the steering wheel and tracks out (see how closer he is to the left edge of the track than he is on the next lap where he has to correct).

2:40 Jean pinches the steering wheel a bit (see how far he is from the trackout at the left, compared to DD_GT3_RD's E92 M3 in front of him).

I've gotten a ride in Jean's GT3 and, while I'm no pro and are don't have the most sensitive butt, the car seems to be setup well...

I think, for most of us weekend hobbyists, spins, oversteers, etc, mostly are due to bad lines and less-than-ideal steering inputs - i.e. I don't think we go fast enough and drive consistently well enough to expose less-than-ideal car setups.

[Ti-Jean]

Originally Posted by Billj747

Its a little hard to tell due to the jerky video but it looked over-sprung, a bit twitchy, skipping over bumps, and snapping loose. You have good car control but it looked a bit stiff especially for BW. How much does your car weigh?

Thanks for the inputs I bought the car a few months ago and don't have exact weight but it 's most likely right around 3000lbs. The car feels pretty stiff to me. I have several pictures of both front and back wheels on the passenger side off the ground coming out of cotton corner. My shocks are single adjustable and I had them 3 clicks from full soft in front and 6 clicks from full soft in the rear that day.

Originally Posted by Billj747

It would be much easier to tell with a better mounted camera but without knowing the weight of the car or tire size, its hard to say but I'd think it should hook up better coming out of buttonhook than that, and 800 sounds a bit high for a fairly stock GT3.

Would like to see more laps with better camera mounting.

I promise I'll get a better camera mount for my next event Tires were Nitto NT01 245 front and 315 rears.

Here is a different video of my driving (different day) with same setup and same track. Any and all comments are appreciated, good or bad

[Ti-Jean]

Originally Posted by OC3

Seems to me that those snapping-loose-and-so-had-to-correct scenes have more to do with steering input errors than any suspension setup issue.

On these 3 corners:

0:25 Sunrise (pinched the steering wheel - i.e. didn't unwind soon enough. After the apex, see how the car follows the inside contour of the track, rather than moving out towards the track out)

2:13 Sunset (pinched the corner. Turned in too early - i.e. when the tail comes out, the nose still hasn't cleared the apex)

2:29 Sunrise (pinched the corner. Turned in too early - i.e. when the tail comes out, the nose still hasn't cleared the apex)

I know this because, as many of my Oh Sh*t Moments video show, I've done a ton of that.

Originally Posted by OC3

If, by "buttonhook," you're referring to Off-Ramp, then those two I think also seem to be steering-input related:

0:35 Jean unwinds the steering wheel and tracks out (see how closer he is to the left edge of the track than he is on the next lap where he has to correct).

2:40 Jean pinches the steering wheel a bit (see how far he is from the trackout at the left, compared to DD_GT3_RD's E92 M3 in front of him).

I've gotten a ride in Jean's GT3 and, while I'm no pro and are don't have the most sensitive butt, the car seems to be setup well...

I think, for most of us weekend hobbyists, spins, oversteers, etc, mostly are due to bad lines and less-than-ideal steering inputs - i.e. I don't think we go fast enough and drive consistently well enough to expose less-than-ideal car setups.

Thanks for the inputs... looks like I need to watch for pinching and turning too early. Keep the comments coming... It will help me catch-up and become faster than you

[OC3]

Originally Posted by Ti-Jean

Thanks for the inputs... looks like I need to watch for pinching and turning too early. Keep the comments coming...

To re-iterate the obvious, when you go TC off, invariably, these issues come up. And, conversely, with TC on, these issues get masked and the driver is oblivious to these dynamics (missing out on a substantial part of the tracking experience, IMO).

As you get faster, everything happens faster and so it's harder to get the timing of turn-in's just right.

Check out this video, at 0:51. (which was part of this thread --> http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=501897)

Awesome save, for sure. Anyhow, as his car starts getting sideways, look how the nose of the car hasn't even cleared the apex yet. A clear indication that he simply turned in too early, while going in way too hot. At that speed, the apex should be the latter half, or latter 1/3, of that berm; but, he turned into the front half of that berm.

I'm just glad that he has quick hands and had the presence of mind to stay on throttle as he corrected his way out of it.

.

Originally Posted by Ti-Jean

It will help me catch-up and become faster than you

Bring it on! Friendly battles are always fun, as long as we don't let things get to the point of swapping paint, lulz (which, actually, could be fun too, ahahahaha).

[The HACK]

IMO, the issue with Ti-Jean's "driving" is someone who came from a BMW chassis trying to learn to drive a Porsche. The line and inputs were fine for a BMW, but since Porsche's weight distribution is that of a front engined, front wheel drive car going backwards, trying to drive it like a BMW will result in some snap oversteer tendencies.

What you'll need to do to adjust for driving a Porsche's rear engine, rear wheel drive format is make the turns more "squared" than you would in your BMW. Brake later, turn-in later, hold on and trail your brakes just a little bit longer to point in the right direction, then use the weight bias to the rear to your advantage and power out of the turn. If you drive the same line as you normally would in a BMW, and throttle in the same spot, the end result is what you see in the video, initial understeer followed by snap oversteer.

Of course, we're all Monday morning quarterbacking here. It's impossible for anyone to give real advice as to driving style via video.

[USCTrojanMan29]

Originally Posted by The HACK

IMO, the issue with Ti-Jean's "driving" is someone who came from a BMW chassis trying to learn to drive a Porsche. The line and inputs were fine for a BMW, but since Porsche's weight distribution is that of a front engined, front wheel drive car going backwards, trying to drive it like a BMW will result in some snap oversteer tendencies.

What you'll need to do to adjust for driving a Porsche's rear engine, rear wheel drive format is make the turns more "squared" than you would in your BMW. Brake later, turn-in later, hold on and trail your brakes just a little bit longer to point in the right direction, then use the weight bias to the rear to your advantage and power out of the turn. If you drive the same line as you normally would in a BMW, and throttle in the same spot, the end result is what you see in the video, initial understeer followed by snap oversteer.

Of course, we're all Monday morning quarterbacking here. It's impossible for anyone to give real advice as to driving style via video.

I started to fly into turns braking late and trail braking towards the apex and then start getting onto the gas as I hit the apex and noticed that my lap times began to drop a bit. I'm still getting used to tracking the GT3 by braking late and being able to either early or late apex turns.

[bigjae1976]

Fail on the camera mount. Nice on sliding a Porsche 911 (although it is a GT3) like that!