DCT vs. PDK

[///M Ryder]

Originally Posted by FVM3

many of the double clutch transmission move like regular autos when you come to stop. Merc, vw etc

Well those never made my list and they damn sure won't make it now ........Phil

[///M Ryder]

Bump for added discussion. The F8x guys are now discussing this........Phil

http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1074863

[bigjae1976]

A PDK transmission is about as Porsche as a Volkswagen Cayenne. Porsche doesn't make the PDK hardware. I could be mistaken...I believe ZF manufactures both the DCT and PDK. The main fundamental difference is the software.

[///M Ryder]

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

I could be mistake ...but a PDK transmission is about as Porsche as a Volkswagen Cayenne. Porsche doesn't make the PDK hardware. I could be mistaken...I believe ZF manufactures both the DCT and PDK. The main fundamental difference is the software.

I thought the DCT was Getrag ..............Phil

[bigjae1976]

Originally Posted by ///M Ryder

I thought the DCT was Getrag ..............Phil

I think you're right...oops. I still stand by my opinion that Porsche makes the PDK and is solely responsible for its awesomeness of lack there of.

[///M Ryder]

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

I think you're right...

Did you peep in on the F8x discussion? Good info........Phil

[anselmw]

Just to add my 2 cents. We have the latest PDK in my wife's Macan turbo and I have the DCT in my E90 M3.

From my experience so far, the PDK generally shifts much smoother in all modes than the DCT. I think that is what makes it feel slower but when I compare seat of pants feel after the shift and acceleration. it feels like the PDK is slightly faster. The downshifts seem to work similar to the DCT but smoother. I do love the nice paddles in the porsche, better than the old buttons.

In terms of shifting I prefer the m DCT harsher feeling shifts but do notice some sluggishness in certain situations. I am hoping the bpm DCT tune I put in today fixes that. PDK so far has not exhibited any of the known delays in the stock DCT software.

[gago1101]

my F80 DCT was leagues ahead of my '11 Panamera turbo PDK in terms of response times and total shift time- from the time you pull the lever to the time it completes the full gear change. The actual gear change in the PDK is fast, but the response time of the Panamera Turbo PDK was dismal compared to the F80 M3 DCT under normal loads.

I also drove the latest '14 Panamera and the PDK felt much better than the one found in the '11 model, but still could not match the DCT in the M3. Now I expect a better PDK in my new GT3.

[Amirsm3]

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

I think you're right...oops. I still stand by my opinion that Porsche makes the PDK and is solely responsible for its awesomeness of lack there of.

Nailed the PDK being manufactured by ZF, btw

[Longboarder]

Originally Posted by gago1101

my F80 DCT was leagues ahead of my '11 Panamera turbo PDK in terms of response times and total shift time- from the time you pull the lever to the time it completes the full gear change. The actual gear change in the PDK is fast, but the response time of the Panamera Turbo PDK was dismal compared to the F80 M3 DCT under normal loads.

I also drove the latest '14 Panamera and the PDK felt much better than the one found in the '11 model, but still could not match the DCT in the M3. Now I expect a better PDK in my new GT3.

Agree 100%

This is the biggest gripe with the PDK because it is engineered to interface with the user like an automatic.

This is why the DCT to most enthusiasts elicits a better experience.

The PDK in my experience actually shifts much faster than the DCT...but I love the interface with the DCT as it feels like a dual clutch, not an auto. Much more sporty - and like an F1 or a Ferrari single clutch. Pretty cool!

[W///]

Originally Posted by Longboarder

Agree 100%

This is the biggest gripe with the PDK because it is engineered to interface with the user like an automatic.

This is why the DCT to most enthusiasts elicits a better experience.

The PDK in my experience actually shifts much faster than the DCT...but I love the interface with the DCT as it feels like a dual clutch, not an auto. Much more sporty - and like an F1 or a Ferrari single clutch. Pretty cool!

You know what's kind of ironic is that the X5/6M (the newest ones) are 8spd automatics, but they made them try to somewhat behave like the DCT's. So if you put the car in drive, it doesn't move forward until you touch the gas pedal. Kind of a neat gimmick

[Longboarder]

Originally Posted by W///

You know what's kind of ironic is that the X5/6M (the newest ones) are 8spd automatics, but they made them try to somewhat behave like the DCT's. So if you put the car in drive, it doesn't move forward until you touch the gas pedal. Kind of a neat gimmick

That is cool. And that may be the first dual clutch to hold as much torque/power as the PDK. I'm putting my PDK to the test here pretty soon.

My 2013 X5 has the ZF 8-speed used in a lot of BMWs and it even feels more like a dual clutch than the PDK

[Denk]

Porsche's manual is sublime. I'm a DCT fan with the S65 but on a 991 I'd take the stick over PDK, it's telepathic. DCT>PDK for me.

[bigjae1976]

Originally Posted by W///

You know what's kind of ironic is that the X5/6M (the newest ones) are 8spd automatics, but they made them try to somewhat behave like the DCT's. So if you put the car in drive, it doesn't move forward until you touch the gas pedal. Kind of a neat gimmick

You know the M "purists" are already up and arms about an M SUV...can't blame the M division for trying to hide the slushbox.

To be fair...automatics and programming have come a long way in the last couple of years.

[W///]

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

You know the M "purists" are already up and arms about an M SUV...can't blame the M division for trying to hide the slushbox.

To be fair...automatics and programming have come a long way in the last couple of years.

They really have. To be completely honest, I wouldn't be surprised if car makers stop using dual clutch systems and stick with automatics in a couple of years.

[bigjae1976]

Originally Posted by W///

They really have. To be completely honest, I wouldn't be surprised if car makers stop using dual clutch systems and stick with automatics in a couple of years.

True. Whether or not we want to admit it...we'll all drive slush boxes in the future.

[radiantm3]

Originally Posted by bigjae1976

You know the M "purists" are already up and arms about an M SUV...can't blame the M division for trying to hide the slushbox.

To be fair...automatics and programming have come a long way in the last couple of years.

The worst part about my X5M (E70) is the transmission. I can't stand how slow it takes to shift. I need to shift like 2000 rpms before redline in first gear if I don't want to hit the limiter. The new 8 speeds are nicer, but man do I hate slush boxes.