Dct clutch slip with Ess 650 kit

[spr]

Cool! I'll have to check it out.

Originally Posted by burnrbr

The Schwaben scanner does, in fact, perform the clutch adaption routine which teaches the TCU the thickness of both clutches. Checkout the pictures below of the scanner screens as I went through the process today. Unlike uploading a DCT tune, the car has to be running with the transmission temperature between 60 - 100 degrees Celsius, in neutral, and with the brake engaged. The car would rock/shake a bit as the DCT was engaging and measuring the clutches during the procedure.


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Personally, I run the clutch adaption routine every 15K - 20K miles so that the DCT can optimally use the current state of the clutches. Having driven a manual for 19 years, I would alter my use of the clutch pedal based on the current thickness of the clutch. Thinner DCT clutches without proper calibration naturally leads to more power being applied before the optimum contact and friction point during a gear shift or launch. It's like giving it too much gas before the clutch starts to engage which can lead to either advanced clutch wear or too much slip. This, of course, is only during gear changes. The fact that the DCT can vary the line pressures based on clutch thickness can help with holding power while in gear. Please look at the before and after clutch adaption pressures in the pictures. They went up after the adaption routine.


I am not stating that running the clutch adaption routine will fix your slipping clutches. I am stating that you can run the clutch adaption routine by yourself with the Schawaben scanner and not need an indie or dealer.

[Patrón]

Originally Posted by JHFW89225

Whats the other theory?

Inadequate dct fluid level.

[Patrón]

Originally Posted by Uber///M

There is SO MUCH false information in this thread. IF you are supercharged and you are experiencing clutch slip, the clutches are already toast. There is no adaptation reset or clutch adjustment that is going to fix this issue. It's a mechanical slip problem. Not a hydraulic line pressure problem or a mechanics problem. You are mechanically exceeding the torque holding capability of your DCT clutch packs. 100%. You will have to replace with a new stock clutch pack and drum, OR upgrade to something more durable to avoid having this problem again. Either way it's going to be 5 grand plus or minus.

Yup.

Originally Posted by spr

Untrue. I know a few people that have reset the clutches and the minor slip went away. Also the clutches themselves from don't cost 5k.

SSP are $2,200 and the labor to change them out correctly and reset the metronics is not cheap.

[Solo_M_Tech]

Originally Posted by Patrón

Yup.

SSP are $2,200 and the labor to change them out correctly and reset the metronics is not cheap.

I've done the SSP upgrade on a customers car (F13 M6) and no the labor and parts were not cheap. ($7k)

As I stated before the clutch slip learn in is a bandaid. We tried it first and it lasted 3 days before the clutches were slipping again.

[burnrbr]

Originally Posted by Uber///M

Unless you have the specialty tools from BMW you can't do this job DIY. The install/ removal tool just to get the drum out is $900.

Yeah, it would be an investment in the tools. SSP has a complete kit for $790.

http://sspperformance.shopgate.com/item/343239

I bought a spare DCT with 30k miles on it for $1700 delivered. It was way cheaper than a new set of clutches and it will be a lot less labor to swap in. I think of my spare DCT as an insurance policy especially with new ones costing $11k.

It seems that a lot of boosted cars run either the GTS or custom DCT tune with higher line pressures. OP, do you have a DCT tune?

[burnrbr]

Originally Posted by Uber///M

I've done the SSP upgrade on a customers car (F13 M6) and no the labor and parts were not cheap. ($7k)

As I stated before the clutch slip learn in is a bandaid. We tried it first and it lasted 3 days before the clutches were slipping again.

How was the drivability with the new SSP clutches? I imagine the swifts on power were more crisp, but I'm interested the start / stop smoothness and normal driving in auto mode. My car is my daily driver, hence my concern for the non-performance aspects.

[burnrbr]

Originally Posted by Patrón

Inadequate dct fluid level.

On a side note, the Schwaben scanner allows one to perform the DCT fluid refill routine to properly fill the transmission. For those who don't know, only filling the fluid in the DCT until it runs out of the fill hole in the side of the DCT will leave it under filled. You have to perform a fill oil routine with the car running which circulates the fluid through the DCT cooler and lines thereby reducing the fluid level in the DCT and allowing more fluid to be added via the same fill hole in the side of the DCT. When the fluid starts to come back out of the DCT during the second fill, the DCT has the proper amount of fluid.

[Solo_M_Tech]

Originally Posted by burnrbr

How was the drivability with the new SSP clutches? I imagine the swifts on power were more crisp, but I'm interested the start / stop smoothness and normal driving in auto mode. My car is my daily driver, hence my concern for the non-performance aspects.

Car drove and felt stock. The clutches just held the massive 900 ftlbs of torque (762 ftlbs at the wheel) The modified S63 produced. Driveability wasn't affected at all.

[Patrón]

Originally Posted by burnrbr

How was the drivability with the new SSP clutches? I imagine the swifts on power were more crisp, but I'm interested the start / stop smoothness and normal driving in auto mode. My car is my daily driver, hence my concern for the non-performance aspects.

My car in D mode is as smooth as my '15 accord.

[OM VT3]

Originally Posted by Patrón

My car in D mode is as smooth as my '15 accord.

Do you have SSP clutches

[Patrón]

Originally Posted by OM VT3

Do you have SSP clutches

Yes sir, August of last year and about 2,000 miles so far.

[M1rider]

Got an ESS 650 as well and I'm noticing some slipping while at WOT over about 7k RPMs. 2nd gear does not seem to have an issue, but once I'm in 3rd gear I seem to hit a wall like I'm overloading the clutches and there struggling to catch and having a lot of bog. Tried to get a video that I can post. At first I was thinking it was spark plug break up. But after contemplating and switching my DCT tune. I'm noticing a lot more clutch slip. I went from the GTS software from BPM back to the ESS DCT software.

There was a tiny bit of slip with the GTS software but much more slip with the ESS DCT tune. Could this be due to higher fluid pressure. Also, I think there are some stock DCTs available. But I would want to upgrade, I know I've seen a lot of debate about both companies but between Dodson and SSP which kits have been installed more. And if I buy a kit could I buy the 2600$ SSP clutch kit or would I need the whole trans kit with the baskets etc.

Thanks

[OM VT3]

Originally Posted by M1rider

Got an ESS 650 as well and I'm noticing some slipping while at WOT over about 7k RPMs. 2nd gear does not seem to have an issue, but once I'm in 3rd gear I seem to hit a wall like I'm overloading the clutches and there struggling to catch and having a lot of bog. Tried to get a video that I can post. At first I was thinking it was spark plug break up. But after contemplating and switching my DCT tune. I'm noticing a lot more clutch slip. I went from the GTS software from BPM back to the ESS DCT software.

There was a tiny bit of slip with the GTS software but much more slip with the ESS DCT tune. Could this be due to higher fluid pressure. Also, I think there are some stock DCTs available. But I would want to upgrade, I know I've seen a lot of debate about both companies but between Dodson and SSP which kits have been installed more. And if I buy a kit could I buy the 2600$ SSP clutch kit or would I need the whole trans kit with the baskets etc.

Thanks

I'm a little unsure at what power level you need the baskets it doesn't really say

[whats77inaname]

Originally Posted by Patrón

Yes sir, August of last year and about 2,000 miles so far.

I didn't know you went SSP with that rebuild! Nice!

Originally Posted by Uber///M

I've done the SSP upgrade on a customers car (F13 M6) and no the labor and parts were not cheap. ($7k)

As I stated before the clutch slip learn in is a bandaid. We tried it first and it lasted 3 days before the clutches were slipping again.

Situations like this are why I'm glad I went 6MT. I can't recall of the last time I heard of a 6MT on 650 kits having slippage issues.

[Patrón]

Originally Posted by whats77inaname

I didn't know you went SSP with that rebuild! Nice!



Situations like this are why I'm glad I went 6MT. I can't recall of the last time I heard of a 6MT on 650 kits having slippage issues.

even with the large expense and headache, it was worth it and I dont' regret getting a dct. if you can believe it , it changes gears faster.

[spr]

I previously ran the by a tune and switched to the ess as instructed with the kit.

Originally Posted by burnrbr

Yeah, it would be an investment in the tools. SSP has a complete kit for $790.

http://sspperformance.shopgate.com/item/343239

I bought a spare DCT with 30k miles on it for $1700 delivered. It was way cheaper than a new set of clutches and it will be a lot less labor to swap in. I think of my spare DCT as an insurance policy especially with new ones costing $11k.

It seems that a lot of boosted cars run either the GTS or custom DCT tune with higher line pressures. OP, do you have a DCT tune?

[OM VT3]

Originally Posted by Patrón

even with the large expense and headache, it was worth it and I dont' regret getting a dct. if you can believe it , it changes gears faster.

I think I will be buying these

[M1rider]

Spoke with a Dodson supply near me. Said kit shipped for just clutch packs is around 1900$. Quoting me 1200$ for install and calibration. 3100$ all in is just as expensive as buying a new DCT and swapping it. They have done a couple of F80s including there own. Also said he has done a couple of e9x m3s. It's just do you go Dodson for 1900$ or SSP for around 2700$. I've heard good and bad things about both companies. But It seems like Dodson has a little more rep

Edit: F10 M5 owners have basically summed up the Dodson vs SSP argument, SSP seems to be the way better option for the BMW DCT platform.

[Patrón]

Originally Posted by M1rider

Spoke with a Dodson supply near me. Said kit shipped for just clutch packs is around 1900$. Quoting me 1200$ for install and calibration. 3100$ all in is just as expensive as buying a new DCT and swapping it. They have done a couple of F80s including there own. Also said he has done a couple of e9x m3s. It's just do you go Dodson for 1900$ or SSP for around 2700$. I've heard good and bad things about both companies. But It seems like Dodson has a little more rep

Edit: F10 M5 owners have basically summed up the Dodson vs SSP argument, SSP seems to be the way better option for the BMW DCT platform.

I was quite skeptical AFTER I had the SSP clutches installed and reading in the M5/M6 forums, since it's the same transmission, i found some negative info on the dodson product and service.

if you look at the products ssp offers, you see that they know the system well. i'm happy with the direction my shop went with and couldnt' be happier with the smoothness in the lower settings and the grip in the fastest settings. my car seems to lunge forward harder than before. (2nd, 3rd, 4th gear redline changes). i have not done a 5th , 6th or 7th gear redline change.

[BOOF-M3]

Op, did you ever get your slippage sorted out?

[RokkM3]

Had some issues with my car at the weekend. Got code P005A41 Transmission pressure sensor low. Also had codes for all four wheel speed sensors. Lost 1,3,5,7 gears and maybe reverse but not sure. I cleared the codes and went back on the track with all gears. Lap two same exact point car did the same thing and same codes when I checked. So I cleared again and car drove fine all way home. Ideas? Im thinking either too much heat or possibly bad clutch or sensor.

I know this is an old post, but if anyone has any insight it would be appreciated.

[Patrón]

Originally Posted by RokkM3

Had some issues with my car at the weekend. Got code P005A41 Transmission pressure sensor low. Also had codes for all four wheel speed sensors. Lost 1,3,5,7 gears and maybe reverse but not sure. I cleared the codes and went back on the track with all gears. Lap two same exact point car did the same thing and same codes when I checked. So I cleared again and car drove fine all way home. Ideas? Im thinking either too much heat or possibly bad clutch or sensor.

I know this is an old post, but if anyone has any insight it would be appreciated.

valve body errors. is your fluid original?