Dinan performance software vs Dinan mid pipe software: Are they the same thing?

N8dawg · 02-14-2011, 01:33 PM

I'm contemplating either getting a Akra GT4 system or a RPI GTM system and I would like a warranty friendly tune to avoid the CEL. on Dinancars.com, 'Performance Engine Software' is $800 and 'Racing Middle Exhaust Software' is $1000. Yet they have identical descriptions. Are these ECU tunes the same thing?

BMRLVR · 02-14-2011, 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by N8dawg

I'm contemplating either getting a Akra GT4 system or a RPI GTM system and I would like a warranty friendly tune to avoid the CEL. on Dinancars.com, 'Performance Engine Software' is $800 and 'Racing Middle Exhaust Software' is $1000. Yet they have identical descriptions. Are these ECU tunes the same thing?

While I have been unable to get a definitive answer on this I believe the answer is yes. It seems that the "Dinan Racing Middle Exhaust Software" is indeed the same software as the regular "Dinan Performance Engine Software" except the catalyst efficiency monitoring is disabled with the "Exhaust software".

I run the "Dinan Racing Middle Exhaust Software" with my Akrapovic Evolution system and it seems to work fine. I have been toying with the possibility of going with the "ESS Akrapovic Software" however after talking to members that have had both and members that went from stock to the "ESS Akra" software I am not convinced that their will be enough of a gain to warrant the cost involved.

Also like you mentioned Dinan is warranty friendly. This is especially true for me since my dealer flashed my car for me before I took delivery and reassured me the warranty on the car would never be questioned from their end!

biglare · 02-17-2011, 01:08 AM

I have had both Dinan software versions before I had the SC installed. First I had their software with their exhaust and stock mid-pipe. Everything performed great!

After installing the Dinan mid-pipe and their mid-pipe software I noticed an increase in power, but no doubt it was the catless mid-pipe itself and not the software.

It is my understanding that the Dinan software is conservative and does provide gains for both versions. Of course the Dinan mid-pipe software will prevent the CEL as the mid-pipe does not have cats.

If you go with the Dinan setup you will get good gains, but not the absolutely highest in the industry. I hope this helps!

As for the ESS software for a catless setup, they installed this right before I installed the ESS S/C and their software made another 12-15hp more than the Dinan mid-pipe software. This was measured on a Maha Dyno right before they installed my SC.

I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any other questions that I can help with.

Kyoshi71 · 02-20-2011, 06:42 AM

If you have the standard Dinan tune and contemplated Akra Evo, what do you do?

1) Upgrade to the Dinan Racing Mid-Exhaust tune (even though that tune is meant for a no-cat system)?
2) Keep the standard Dinan tune (can you add the Akra cat-delete without upsetting the Dinan tune)?
3) Do O2 extenders work on an Akra Evo?

To upgrade to the Racing Dinan tune, I believe you only pay the difference between the both, not the whole cost, right?

kitw · 02-20-2011, 07:47 PM

02 extenders more than likely won't work.

I have the Dinan tune and have the Akrapovic Evo... The Dinan Stage 2 works perfectly for it. The Akrapovic has the cats in the same location as the stock secondary cats, after the 02 sensors, so unless you get software (or a Delete-R) you are going to get a CEL / SES light.

Which doesn't actually affect performance.

It turns out the Dinan software doesn't make much power, and doesn't allow the readiness tests to complete, so it doesn't have much advantage over the Delete-R, especially because it costs more than double.

Draff1 · 02-21-2011, 11:21 AM

Just asked this same question on another similar thread since I have stage 1 Dinan tune and am about to get the Akra Evo system: Does Dinan address the torque dip? As far as I can see, removing the cats or significantly reducing back-pressure will create a condition that the ECU cannot resolve, even with many of the tunes available. Some claim to be able to reduce the dip but none eliminate it. I need to know if Dinan stage 2 makes an attempt at it before I pay the $200 to upgrade.

asp17 · 02-23-2011, 01:17 PM

I was told by a Dinan reseller in my area that they are the same software but the $1000 one deletes the increased emissions CeL.
I did read somewhere in the Forums that there is a difference in the mapping because of the cat delete. But This local place wouldn't confirm that. They actually refused to sell me the stage 2 software because I didn't have a "Dinan" Midpipe I have an AA w/ cat delete.

BMRLVR · 02-23-2011, 01:59 PM

Just go with the Dinan tune!

Like you I would like to be able to remove/reduce the dip that occurs in the 2-3K RPM range with the Akrapovic Evo system but it seems that has not been done with too much success yet . I am currently running the Dinan middle exhaust tune with my Akra Evo system and it works well. I have been PM'ing with quite a few ESS Akra tune users (one in particular had Dinan Software, switched to ESS Akra, and is now going back to the Dinan) and according to the ESS Akra users the dip still exists quite prominently even with the ESS Akra Software. Since the dip still does exist and the power gains are not huge it is not worth it to me to change from my Dinan Software.

The thing that seals the deal on Dinan for me is the fact that my dealer flashed my car for me and told me that they will honour my warranty no questions asked with the Dinan Software.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Draff1

Just asked this same question on another similar thread since I have stage 1 Dinan tune and am about to get the Akra Evo system: Does Dinan address the torque dip? As far as I can see, removing the cats or significantly reducing back-pressure will create a condition that the ECU cannot resolve, even with many of the tunes available. Some claim to be able to reduce the dip but none eliminate it. I need to know if Dinan stage 2 makes an attempt at it before I pay the $200 to upgrade.

Draff1 · 02-23-2011, 11:48 PM

I agree. Piece of mind and OEM-like drive-ability is why many choose Dinan. I guess I expect a bit more from them in terms of addressing the torque dip since they pride them selves on performance without compromise. Maybe it means that the dip can't be addressed with software?

BMRLVR · 02-25-2011, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Draff1

I agree. Piece of mind and OEM-like drive-ability is why many choose Dinan. I guess I expect a bit more from them in terms of addressing the torque dip since they pride them selves on performance without compromise. Maybe it means that the dip can't be addressed with software?

Dinan don't address the torque dip because it is not an issue with their middle exhaust. The Torque dip is an issue that seems more prominent with the Akrapovic Evolution system than any other exhaust.

Dinan's software is specifically for their middle exhaust and it works well with it. I am sure the dip could be addressed with playing with the valve overlap in the VANOS tables however it would take some trial and error to get it right. Believe me the dip is in an area of the powerband where most people never spend much time. Yes the dip is there but I have learned to stay out of the rev-range it exists in by downshifting before the revs drop below 3K RPM

kitw · 02-25-2011, 11:17 PM

It really didn't bother me. I suspect part of it is caused by the H pipe design, but that guess isn't scientific, it's just the only X pipe on the market that has it. I just swapped over to a Challenge Sport X pipe and an Arqray Titanium catback... and the torque dip seems to be similar. Maybe a little better.

Draff1 · 02-26-2011, 11:30 AM

I called and e-mailed Dinan and (to no surprise) have not received a call back or e-mail. If they could ever match their service with their technical expertise they would double sales.

Not sure the TQ dip is exclusive to Akrapovik but if Dinan calls me back I will try to get some real answers.

jimmy ny · 02-26-2011, 11:57 AM

stage1 and stage 2 is the same program. only difference is cel is turned off for cat-inefficiency code. cel will work for other issues. but it will not pass a state readiness test. i just had stage 1 put in my car and it works great. i run their intake and pulley also. i also have AA hfc xpipe and borla exhaust. car runs great and really fast.

Draff1 · 02-26-2011, 01:19 PM

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthr...=303632&page=3

Check this link....Dyno result shows masive TQ dip on Dinan's system too. Back to my earlier comment about this being an issue with the ECU unable to resolve the massive change in back pressure from idle to 2800 RPM. I've never driven one with a full system but I can't see how that isn't noticeable. Looks to be 80ft/lbs!

BMRLVR · 02-26-2011, 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Draff1

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthr...=303632&page=3

Check this link....Dyno result shows masive TQ dip on Dinan's system too. Back to my earlier comment about this being an issue with the ECU unable to resolve the massive change in back pressure from idle to 2800 RPM. I've never driven one with a full system but I can't see how that isn't noticeable. Looks to be 80ft/lbs!

Thanks for posting this. I have never seen a dynosheet from a Dinan Midpipe till now, this is a pretty old post I can't see how I missed it.

As for it being not noticeable, it is definitely noticable however it is very easy to avoid that RPM range. I put about 7000 miles on my Akrapovic Evo system before I even noticed the dip. I first noticed it on some Costal Highways in Nova Scotia when cruising at about 45-50 MPH in 6th gear. If you downshift to 5th it totally takes care of the dip since it puts your RPM above the range where the dip exists. I can honestly see how many people don't even know that the dip exists, their driving style never keeps them in that RPM area.

///M Ryder · 02-26-2011, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Draff1

I called and e-mailed Dinan and (to no surprise) have not received a call back or e-mail. If they could ever match their service with their technical expertise they would double sales.

Not sure the TQ dip is exclusive to Akrapovik but if Dinan calls me back I will try to get some real answers.

I've never had a problem speaking with a Dinan Tech......in fact when I had my E36 I called and actually spoke with Steve Dinan. As far as the software question, my understanding is the same as others have posted. The mid exhaust download addresses the CEL and the catless system, nothing more....Phil

STALKER · 02-27-2011, 12:58 PM

I have run both the Akra ESS tune and the Dinan middle racing tune.
Both work with the full Akra system just fine.
The ESS Akra tune had a bit more "oomph" to it, but I started getting some strange codes, so I flashed my car back to the Dinan software to be safe. Only happens in cold weather and Roman@ESS was very helpful. No complaints there.
No codes or engine warning light since I have had the Dinan SW back on there, but Im going to wait to see what happens.

As for the dip, never really bothers me since I tend to down shift for passing. Only time I might notice it is if I am in a high gear in the city and I need a burst of speed.

I have run both tunes out on track, both worked very well and had zero issues.

I initially went with the Dinan software because it is a conservative tune and would not have any warranty issues, plus at the time, they were offering a 20% discount on the tune, which did not make it to much more then the CEL plug in deletor, so for me it was a no brainer.

Jason.J · 05-06-2013, 10:56 AM

I have a new bmw m3 e92, I was thinking akra evo+ dinan stage 1 or just take dinan stage2, what would you think? let me know, thanks

epbb · 05-06-2013, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jason.J

I have a new bmw m3 e92, I was thinking akra evo+ dinan stage 1 or just take dinan stage2, what would you think? let me know, thanks

I'm also pretty new, and I've been doing a ton of forum reading over the past couple weeks. From what I've read, it seems that collectively, the most popular / best exhaust is the Akra, and the most popular / best tune at the moment is the BPMSport tune. This is what I'm leaning towards myself.

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=816790
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=784717
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=801185

momo3605 · 05-06-2013, 01:48 PM

I went with the Dinan tune because it was just ridiculously cheaper than anything else. Generally Dinan is more expensive than other 3rd parties, but in this case, it was a nobrainer for me.

And I've seen those BPMSport threads, and I'm not sure if the gain ON TOP of dinan is worth an extra $1k

02-14-2011, 01:33 PM	#1
N8dawg First Lieutenant 53 Rep 383 Posts Drives: 2008 E90 M3 Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: St Petersburg, Florida iTrader: (0)	Dinan performance software vs Dinan mid pipe software: Are they the same thing? I'm contemplating either getting a Akra GT4 system or a RPI GTM system and I would like a warranty friendly tune to avoid the CEL. on Dinancars.com, 'Performance Engine Software' is $800 and 'Racing Middle Exhaust Software' is $1000. Yet they have identical descriptions. Are these ECU tunes the same thing?
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02-17-2011, 01:08 AM	#3
biglare Bulldog 482 Rep 3,355 Posts Drives: BMW & Porsche Join Date: May 2008 Location: ? iTrader: (3)	I have had both Dinan software versions before I had the SC installed. First I had their software with their exhaust and stock mid-pipe. Everything performed great! After installing the Dinan mid-pipe and their mid-pipe software I noticed an increase in power, but no doubt it was the catless mid-pipe itself and not the software. It is my understanding that the Dinan software is conservative and does provide gains for both versions. Of course the Dinan mid-pipe software will prevent the CEL as the mid-pipe does not have cats. If you go with the Dinan setup you will get good gains, but not the absolutely highest in the industry. I hope this helps! As for the ESS software for a catless setup, they installed this right before I installed the ESS S/C and their software made another 12-15hp more than the Dinan mid-pipe software. This was measured on a Maha Dyno right before they installed my SC. I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any other questions that I can help with. __________________ Prev: Individual F80 M3 - Fjord Blue/Silverstone(interior) \| Fashion Grey(exterior) GTS
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02-20-2011, 06:42 AM	#4
Kyoshi71 Colonel 93 Rep 2,528 Posts Drives: 2010 M3 Coupe Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: New York iTrader: (0)	If you have the standard Dinan tune and contemplated Akra Evo, what do you do? 1) Upgrade to the Dinan Racing Mid-Exhaust tune (even though that tune is meant for a no-cat system)? 2) Keep the standard Dinan tune (can you add the Akra cat-delete without upsetting the Dinan tune)? 3) Do O2 extenders work on an Akra Evo? To upgrade to the Racing Dinan tune, I believe you only pay the difference between the both, not the whole cost, right? __________________ "But resist we much; we must; and we will much; about that be committed." ~Rev. Al Sharpton 2010 E92 M3\|Silverstone II\|M-DCT\|NCSW\|2MT\|ZCW\|ZPP\|ZTP\|302\|507\|Gas Guzzler Tax
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02-20-2011, 07:47 PM	#5
kitw Colonel 471 Rep 2,991 Posts Drives: F91 M8, 991.2 GT3 Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Bay Area, CA iTrader: (20)	02 extenders more than likely won't work. I have the Dinan tune and have the Akrapovic Evo... The Dinan Stage 2 works perfectly for it. The Akrapovic has the cats in the same location as the stock secondary cats, after the 02 sensors, so unless you get software (or a Delete-R) you are going to get a CEL / SES light. Which doesn't actually affect performance. It turns out the Dinan software doesn't make much power, and doesn't allow the readiness tests to complete, so it doesn't have much advantage over the Delete-R, especially because it costs more than double.
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02-21-2011, 11:21 AM	#6
Draff1 Private First Class 13 Rep 195 Posts Drives: 2009 Silverstone M3 Coupe Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: San Diego, CA iTrader: (0)	Just asked this same question on another similar thread since I have stage 1 Dinan tune and am about to get the Akra Evo system: Does Dinan address the torque dip? As far as I can see, removing the cats or significantly reducing back-pressure will create a condition that the ECU cannot resolve, even with many of the tunes available. Some claim to be able to reduce the dip but none eliminate it. I need to know if Dinan stage 2 makes an attempt at it before I pay the $200 to upgrade. __________________ 2009 Silverstone II E92 M3 Coupe - DCT Dinan Exhaust, RPi scoops, Dinan Tune, Dinan Pulley, BMC filter, LCI Taillights, MS 15mm spacers, Huper Optik tint.
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02-23-2011, 01:17 PM	#7
asp17 Lieutenant 79 Rep 408 Posts Drives: F98 X4M Comp Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: 305 iTrader: (1)	I was told by a Dinan reseller in my area that they are the same software but the $1000 one deletes the increased emissions CeL. I did read somewhere in the Forums that there is a difference in the mapping because of the cat delete. But This local place wouldn't confirm that. They actually refused to sell me the stage 2 software because I didn't have a "Dinan" Midpipe I have an AA w/ cat delete. __________________ ASP
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02-23-2011, 11:48 PM	#9
Draff1 Private First Class 13 Rep 195 Posts Drives: 2009 Silverstone M3 Coupe Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: San Diego, CA iTrader: (0)	I agree. Piece of mind and OEM-like drive-ability is why many choose Dinan. I guess I expect a bit more from them in terms of addressing the torque dip since they pride them selves on performance without compromise. Maybe it means that the dip can't be addressed with software? __________________ 2009 Silverstone II E92 M3 Coupe - DCT Dinan Exhaust, RPi scoops, Dinan Tune, Dinan Pulley, BMC filter, LCI Taillights, MS 15mm spacers, Huper Optik tint.
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02-25-2011, 11:17 PM	#11
kitw Colonel 471 Rep 2,991 Posts Drives: F91 M8, 991.2 GT3 Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Bay Area, CA iTrader: (20)	It really didn't bother me. I suspect part of it is caused by the H pipe design, but that guess isn't scientific, it's just the only X pipe on the market that has it. I just swapped over to a Challenge Sport X pipe and an Arqray Titanium catback... and the torque dip seems to be similar. Maybe a little better.
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02-26-2011, 11:30 AM	#12
Draff1 Private First Class 13 Rep 195 Posts Drives: 2009 Silverstone M3 Coupe Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: San Diego, CA iTrader: (0)	I called and e-mailed Dinan and (to no surprise) have not received a call back or e-mail. If they could ever match their service with their technical expertise they would double sales. Not sure the TQ dip is exclusive to Akrapovik but if Dinan calls me back I will try to get some real answers. __________________ 2009 Silverstone II E92 M3 Coupe - DCT Dinan Exhaust, RPi scoops, Dinan Tune, Dinan Pulley, BMC filter, LCI Taillights, MS 15mm spacers, Huper Optik tint.
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02-26-2011, 11:57 AM	#13
jimmy ny Second Lieutenant 17 Rep 246 Posts Drives: 2011 bmw m3 Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: new york iTrader: (0)	stage1 and stage 2 is the same program. only difference is cel is turned off for cat-inefficiency code. cel will work for other issues. but it will not pass a state readiness test. i just had stage 1 put in my car and it works great. i run their intake and pulley also. i also have AA hfc xpipe and borla exhaust. car runs great and really fast.
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02-26-2011, 01:19 PM	#14
Draff1 Private First Class 13 Rep 195 Posts Drives: 2009 Silverstone M3 Coupe Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: San Diego, CA iTrader: (0)	http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthr...=303632&page=3 Check this link....Dyno result shows masive TQ dip on Dinan's system too. Back to my earlier comment about this being an issue with the ECU unable to resolve the massive change in back pressure from idle to 2800 RPM. I've never driven one with a full system but I can't see how that isn't noticeable. Looks to be 80ft/lbs! __________________ 2009 Silverstone II E92 M3 Coupe - DCT Dinan Exhaust, RPi scoops, Dinan Tune, Dinan Pulley, BMC filter, LCI Taillights, MS 15mm spacers, Huper Optik tint.
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02-27-2011, 12:58 PM	#17
STALKER Brigadier General 169 Rep 3,831 Posts Drives: 997.2 GT3, Golf R Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Toronto, ON iTrader: (5)	I have run both the Akra ESS tune and the Dinan middle racing tune. Both work with the full Akra system just fine. The ESS Akra tune had a bit more "oomph" to it, but I started getting some strange codes, so I flashed my car back to the Dinan software to be safe. Only happens in cold weather and Roman@ESS was very helpful. No complaints there. No codes or engine warning light since I have had the Dinan SW back on there, but Im going to wait to see what happens. As for the dip, never really bothers me since I tend to down shift for passing. Only time I might notice it is if I am in a high gear in the city and I need a burst of speed. I have run both tunes out on track, both worked very well and had zero issues. I initially went with the Dinan software because it is a conservative tune and would not have any warranty issues, plus at the time, they were offering a 20% discount on the tune, which did not make it to much more then the CEL plug in deletor, so for me it was a no brainer. __________________
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05-06-2013, 10:56 AM	#18
Jason.J New Member 0 Rep 10 Posts Drives: M3 e92 Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: dallas iTrader: (0)	I have a new bmw m3 e92, I was thinking akra evo+ dinan stage 1 or just take dinan stage2, what would you think? let me know, thanks
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05-06-2013, 01:48 PM	#20
momo3605 Major 208 Rep 1,201 Posts Drives: M340i LCI, 718 GTS 4.0 Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Norcal iTrader: (2)	I went with the Dinan tune because it was just ridiculously cheaper than anything else. Generally Dinan is more expensive than other 3rd parties, but in this case, it was a nobrainer for me. And I've seen those BPMSport threads, and I'm not sure if the gain ON TOP of dinan is worth an extra $1k
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