BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > E90/E92 M3 Technical Topics > Engine, Transmission, Exhaust, Drivetrain, ECU Software Modifications
 
EXXEL Distributions
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      03-31-2012, 03:51 PM   #89
Verify
Captain
23
Rep
638
Posts

Drives: M3
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: MD-NY

iTrader: (1)

It's clear Evolve is run by true professionals with proper business ethics. Their past and present performance is beyond reproach.
The fact that they not only give you the straight facts, they show you why. Their credibility is unquestioned, never have they been accused of falsifying any data. Their commitment to informing the customer on the how and why is unrivaled.

Bms and their dp fix currently fits my needs, but as I endevour on a path for more performance, I'll be going with Evolve to fit fulfill those needs
Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 04:34 PM   #90
Darkboyz68
Jedi
Darkboyz68's Avatar
United_States
13
Rep
210
Posts

Drives: 2012 e92 M3 LMB
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: So Cal

iTrader: (10)

im in the market for a tune myself. Based on OP's original topic, i too want to make an informed decision on which software tune to invest my money in...

i created a basic comparison table of the 3 SF tunes, if we can fill this out, this will assist OP, myself and others interested in purchasing a software tune in the future...
Attached Images
File Type: pdf tune comparison.pdf (169.2 KB, 236 views)
__________________
2012 M3 e92 LeMans Blue, RPi GTC full race system, RPi scoops, BMW performance decklid, GTS wheels, OEM gloss blk mirrors ...

Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 05:16 PM   #91
geneatals
Ninja
geneatals's Avatar
United_States
390
Rep
4,014
Posts

Drives: 2019 530e
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: So Cal (SFV)

iTrader: (3)

would love to see a tuner shootout at this upcoming mfest...let's be done with the internet banter and let all these companies just put up or shut up....
__________________
2019 AW G30 530e l ZPP l ZMP l ZDH
Retired: 2016 F80 M3, 2012 E90 M3, 2008 535i
Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 05:24 PM   #92
Verify
Captain
23
Rep
638
Posts

Drives: M3
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: MD-NY

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by geneatals View Post
would love to see a tuner shootout at this upcoming mfest...let's be done with the internet banter and let all these companies just put up or shut up....
That would be awesome!
But, it only shows power, not the overall effects of each tune.
In theory, all the tunes should arrive at the same whp ad only so much one can tune for n/a... If they all even abide by conservative, long term reliable tuning

The application of the power is as important as peak.

Why hasn't this been suggested before though?
Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 05:37 PM   #93
Darkboyz68
Jedi
Darkboyz68's Avatar
United_States
13
Rep
210
Posts

Drives: 2012 e92 M3 LMB
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: So Cal

iTrader: (10)

Quote:
Originally Posted by geneatals View Post
would love to see a tuner shootout at this upcoming mfest...let's be done with the internet banter and let all these companies just put up or shut up....
+100!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baggy_M View Post
That would be awesome!
But, it only shows power, not the overall effects of each tune.
In theory, all the tunes should arrive at the same whp ad only so much one can tune for n/a... If they all even abide by conservative, long term reliable tuning

The application of the power is as important as peak.

Why hasn't this been suggested before though?
so if all results stay equal or close enough, then the determining difference will be price and maybe overall customer service experience.
__________________
2012 M3 e92 LeMans Blue, RPi GTC full race system, RPi scoops, BMW performance decklid, GTS wheels, OEM gloss blk mirrors ...

Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 05:49 PM   #94
Krozi
Colonel
Krozi's Avatar
United_States
162
Rep
2,736
Posts

Drives: 2008 E92 ///M3 Alpine White
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: SoFla - Bonita Springs

iTrader: (24)

Quote:
Originally Posted by geneatals View Post
would love to see a tuner shootout at this upcoming mfest...let's be done with the internet banter and let all these companies just put up or shut up....
__________________

2008 E92 ///M3 Alpine White//Fox Red//6MT//
Florida Bimmer - Join us on FaceBook!
Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 06:09 PM   #95
CanAutM3
General
CanAutM3's Avatar
Canada
21105
Rep
20,741
Posts

Drives: 2021 911 turbo
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Montreal

iTrader: (1)

Garage List
DINAN anyone ??

Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 06:49 PM   #96
Rekrul
Captain
Rekrul's Avatar
63
Rep
820
Posts

Drives: 19 M5 Comp, 16 GT3RS
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Purgatory

iTrader: (1)

Like I said before. IF any tuner can guarantee BMW will not see their tune on DME if one flashes back to stock and is confident in their long term reliability performance. They would sell tunes like crazy.
Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 07:05 PM   #97
alpine335i
Captain
alpine335i's Avatar
United_States
44
Rep
687
Posts

Drives: 08 e92 M3 6MT, 08 e90 328xi
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Poughkeepsie, NY

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rekrul
Like I said before. IF any tuner can guarantee BMW will not see their tune on DME if one flashes back to stock and is confident in their long term reliability performance. They would sell tunes like crazy.
They already sell tunes like crazy. Most people aren't worried about such things. Just a select few.
__________________
2008 Alpine White E92 ///M3
Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 07:54 PM   #98
Darkboyz68
Jedi
Darkboyz68's Avatar
United_States
13
Rep
210
Posts

Drives: 2012 e92 M3 LMB
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: So Cal

iTrader: (10)

Mike, Roman, Sal, others?? Are you guys down for this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by geneatals View Post
would love to see a tuner shootout at this upcoming mfest...let's be done with the internet banter and let all these companies just put up or shut up....
Quote:
Originally Posted by Krozi View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
DINAN anyone ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rekrul View Post
Like I said before. IF any tuner can guarantee BMW will not see their tune on DME if one flashes back to stock and is confident in their long term reliability performance. They would sell tunes like crazy.
__________________
2012 M3 e92 LeMans Blue, RPi GTC full race system, RPi scoops, BMW performance decklid, GTS wheels, OEM gloss blk mirrors ...

Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 08:00 PM   #99
Verify
Captain
23
Rep
638
Posts

Drives: M3
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: MD-NY

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkboyz68 View Post
+100!



so if all results stay equal or close enough, then the determining difference will be price and maybe overall customer service experience.
It comes down to a few things. Reliability, do any get random codes, throttle mapping, customer service. Price should never be an issue or a factor, you just have to figure out if they are charging due to r&d, or having to charge more because they are just a middleman, or just plain price gouging.

Personally, I like knowing my $ goes to the company that did the r&d, that knows what they are doing, can answer my calls/emails, and can tell me what, is going on, as they did the legwork. Very few companies meet all of that criteria, and its easy to see who they are
Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 08:05 PM   #100
alpine335i
Captain
alpine335i's Avatar
United_States
44
Rep
687
Posts

Drives: 08 e92 M3 6MT, 08 e90 328xi
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Poughkeepsie, NY

iTrader: (2)

Tuner shoot-out will never happen
__________________
2008 Alpine White E92 ///M3
Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 08:14 PM   #101
M3SQRD
Major General
M3SQRD's Avatar
1931
Rep
5,306
Posts

Drives: E92 M3,G20 330ix,F22 240iX,F82
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Mid-Atlantic

iTrader: (11)

Quote:
Originally Posted by alpine335i View Post
Tuner shoot-out will never happen
Agreed.
Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 08:34 PM   #102
m3an
Banned
m3an's Avatar
39
Rep
1,590
Posts

Drives: M3
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: South Florida

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by alpine335i View Post
Tuner shoot-out will never happen
x10..
and there's no need. Any guy can set a car on kill to make good numbers for a day, and what does it prove?. Each tuner represents their own name. Free market enterprise. To the people who are worried about BMW detecting one, you shouldnt be doing it to begin with if you're worried.
Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 08:38 PM   #103
alpine335i
Captain
alpine335i's Avatar
United_States
44
Rep
687
Posts

Drives: 08 e92 M3 6MT, 08 e90 328xi
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Poughkeepsie, NY

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by talontid
Quote:
Originally Posted by alpine335i View Post
Tuner shoot-out will never happen
x10..
and there's no need. Any guy can set a car on kill to make good numbers for a day, and what does it prove?. Each tuner represents their own name. Free market enterprise. To the people who are worried about BMW detecting one, you shouldnt be doing it to begin with if you're worried.
Exactly!!!
__________________
2008 Alpine White E92 ///M3
Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 09:23 PM   #104
Darkboyz68
Jedi
Darkboyz68's Avatar
United_States
13
Rep
210
Posts

Drives: 2012 e92 M3 LMB
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: So Cal

iTrader: (10)

why dont we let Mike, Sal, and Roman respond if this is possible...

Quote:
Originally Posted by talontid View Post
x10..
and there's no need. Any guy can set a car on kill to make good numbers for a day, and what does it prove?. Each tuner represents their own name. Free market enterprise. To the people who are worried about BMW detecting one, you shouldnt be doing it to begin with if you're worried.
Quote:
Originally Posted by alpine335i View Post
Exactly!!!
__________________
2012 M3 e92 LeMans Blue, RPi GTC full race system, RPi scoops, BMW performance decklid, GTS wheels, OEM gloss blk mirrors ...

Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 09:38 PM   #105
flipm3
E46 + E90 + F80
192
Rep
2,894
Posts

Drives: E46 + E90 + F80
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Illinois

iTrader: (1)

Garage List
2009 BMW M3  [0.00]
2002 BMW M3  [0.00]
I have been following this thread and at first I wasn't going to respond, but there are some accusations that I think are extremely false.

To call Sal@Evolve just "a very good salesman" is probably one the most unethical and unprofessional things I've seen on this board in awhile. Simply because it is one vendor publicly and personally insulting another when it's known by many to clearly be false.

I just want to share once again my personal experience with Sal as a true tuner and great person to work with.

A little over a year ago before Evolve Automotive strongly entered the E46 and E90 US Market, I chose them to tune my E46 M3. To prove that Sal is a REAL TUNER, he spent several hours with me remotely tuning my car. Throughout this time, he would analyze the data I sent him, making changes to maps accordingly, and send them my way to flash my car. On top of that, he would explain to me in great detail on the certain changes he makes to different areas of the DME and why does it. Instead of comparing himself to other competitors on the market, he would prove and show me why he chooses his own method of tuning apart from the others. Back then, it was often thought that only around 10whp could be extracted from the E46 M3 through a tune. Well Evolve Automotive proved otherwise and helped me gain 17whp on a heat-soaked motor on the dyno with no adaptations on the road. The Evolve E46 M3 tune sold abundantly and speaks for itself. Many people even switched to their tune and made power on top of their previous tune.

I am one of many clients who have the same exact experience. There are COUNTLESS E46 M3's who have been remotely tuned by Sal and Evolve with such a vast array of modifications. Some other otherwise stock, many have Alpha-N tunes for their CSL or CF Airboxes, some are full blown race cars. Sal and Evolve have been doing this same method for the E39 M5 crowd for years. Other's have mentioned Evolve's reputation on M5Board trying to use it against them, well I believe it's the contrary that is true. Anyone can hop onto M5Board and see the amazing praise and acknowledgement that Evolve as a company and entity deserve.

For another company to out right call Sal a salesman is rude and truly embarrassing on their behalf because we all know the endless posts that he makes to try show us, as a community, the R&D side of things. Me having a great interest in how things work and why certain things are done, greatly appreciates the effort that Sal and Evolve have gone through to educate this message forum and BMW community. It's rather rare these days for automotive tuners to share things from a design perspective. As a consumer, I'm not the type to just throw thousands of dollars at a company without any proof of the work they do.

In regards to the statement of Evolve trying to hide that they have their exhausts manufactured by a 3rd party. Well Evolve has said many times that they have their exhausts fabricated by Supersprint. I don't think Sal or anyone at Evolve knows this, but I personally contacted Alessandro at Supersprint Italy to ask some questions. I told him the stuff I've gotten done by Evolve. Alessandro only had great things to say about their workings with Evolve.

It is actually a great advantage that Evolve has a good relationship and partnership with companies like Supersprint. I'm sure many can agree, but I'd rather have a company like Supersprint with their great build quality fabricate the products that Evolve designs than some other factory that doesn't hold the same reputation or quality.

I could go on and on about how great it's been to work with Evolve Automotive, just as much as others have great things to say about ESS, AA, OE, Gintani, etc. But what I believe that sets Evolve Automotive apart from others is that they are simply here to share information, fact, and truth. I don't see them bashing or ridiculing other vendors or sponsors the way others do in a negative manner. Others have been trying to bash and talk bad about the products they have and continue to develop. Evolve Automotive along with anyone else has the right to stand up and fight for their name.

To the OP, I'm sure you didn't expect for any of this "drama" to pop up on your thread. If you are interested in hearing my personal experience with Evolve and their tune for my E90 M3, please check out this link. You will not be disappointed and I think you'll find working with Evolve Automotive to be rather enjoyable.

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=659146

Best of luck with your decision on your tune.

To everyone else, hopefully we can stop pointing finger and insulting other tuners or making false claims. The best part of this automotive culture is that we have a common ground that we share. Everyone will always have their differences and opinions.
__________________
F80 M3 DCT|Alpine White . Black Leather | My Build Thread
E90 M3 DCT|Melbourne Red . Speed Cloth | My Build Thread
E46 M3 6MT|Jet Black . Black Nappa Leather | My Build Thread
Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 10:04 PM   #106
1MOREMOD
-
1MOREMOD's Avatar
United_States
11815
Rep
23,187
Posts

Drives: Race car->
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: check your mirrors

iTrader: (5)

i agree sal at evolve is very helpful guy to have in your corner. i will use their products again for sure.
__________________

02 Tiag e46 M3|6MT|GC plates|MCS c.o.|GC bars|GC race control arms|GC bushings|BW eng. & tran. mounts|subframe kit|BW race shifter|BW Jaffster|Euro header|BW exhaust|K&N c.a.i.|Epic race tune|Rouge pulleys|Seibon CF hood|CSL bumper|apr gt 250 & splitter|ST-40|XR-2|SS lines|half cage|Recaro profi|Profi 2 harness|BMWpedals|BW studs|
Appreciate 0
      03-31-2012, 10:07 PM   #107
Leonardo629
Lieutenant Colonel
Taiwan
168
Rep
1,792
Posts

Drives: 2013 M3 Coupe
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Taiwan

iTrader: (10)

I'm ready to go with an ESS tune as soon as Roman post an "end of E9x M3 ESS tune sale" thread
Appreciate 0
      04-01-2012, 05:14 AM   #108
Moxie
Lieutenant Colonel
Moxie's Avatar
United_States
67
Rep
1,895
Posts

Drives: AW 328d Touring/SG 335d
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: North Carolina

iTrader: (12)

Quote:
Originally Posted by geneatals View Post
would love to see a tuner shootout at this upcoming mfest...let's be done with the internet banter and let all these companies just put up or shut up....
I doubt it will happen - Been through the same drama a couple years ago. Didn't happen then either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rekrul View Post
Like I said before. IF any tuner can guarantee BMW will not see their tune on DME if one flashes back to stock and is confident in their long term reliability performance. They would sell tunes like crazy.
From what I've read, the only way BMW will see it is if you go over 8300 rpms or exceed the speed limiter. Then it will be stored in shadow memory. Other than that, neither of these tunes will be detected after they are flashed back - Feel free to correct me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkboyz68 View Post
+100!



so if all results stay equal or close enough, then the determining difference will be price and maybe overall customer service experience.
Not a fan boy, Just the facts as i know them - Results should be close enough. I haven't seen ESS have a "Sale" since the initial introduction of the remote tune. Evolve has sales regularly. I picked mine up at the Black Friday sale for hundreds less than ESS. Timing is everything - Last I checked ESS charges extra for the Akra Evo tune - Evolve doesn't.

Evolve was first to come out with the remote tune...couple months later ESS showed up with one. Evolve was first to have code reading/clearing capability...several month later I'm told ESS now can do it. Evolve gives second car discounts, constantly adding options, is less expensive than ESS & while I can't speak for ESS's customer service, I can vouch for Sal, Paul & Evolve to be top tier. In the end, go with whoever you feel most comfortable with....or stay stock.

Close thread.
Appreciate 0
      04-01-2012, 09:31 AM   #109
Verify
Captain
23
Rep
638
Posts

Drives: M3
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: MD-NY

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moxie View Post
I doubt it will happen - Been through the same drama a couple years ago. Didn't happen then either.
What do you mean by tried before? Between who and why didn't it happen?
Appreciate 0
      04-01-2012, 10:20 AM   #110
Moxie
Lieutenant Colonel
Moxie's Avatar
United_States
67
Rep
1,895
Posts

Drives: AW 328d Touring/SG 335d
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: North Carolina

iTrader: (12)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baggy_M View Post
What do you mean by tried before? Between who and why didn't it happen?
Hate to bring up old shit, but it was between ESS & Power Chip in Feb 2010. After 8 pages of threads, probably 9-10 pages if you count those that were deleted the thread was locked.

IMHO, I think these remote tunes are equal. Just comes down to the tangibles & intangibles - additional add-ons, cost, customer service & the ability/willingness to provide future add-ons at little to no cost. Return customer rebates are a bonus....name calling/unprofessionalism doesn't sell the product....just makes you look like an ass.
Appreciate 0
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:58 PM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST