KW Clubsport or OHLIN R&T: Help me Decide

[Exclusivs]

Planning for a new coilover setup in the upcoming weeks, and my choices have fallen upon 2 candidates; KW Clubsport (2-Way) or Ohlin R&T.

It's pretty obvious the KW Clubsport is a proven track warrior coilover, right under the competition version.
Pro's: Integrated camber plates.
Con's: Stiffer ride for a daily driver.

The Ohlin R&T, relatively new to the market, but have read nothing but good things. No slouch on the track, and also a compliant comfortable ride for daily function. Setup would require pairing with a separate brand of camber plates, IE: Vorshlag or Ground control.
Pro's: Best of both worlds, track performer and daily comfort.
Cons: Softer spring rates. No integrated camber plates.

Specific Application info:

6-spd E92 M3
12-15 planned track days per yr
Double duty: Daily Driver/Weekend Warrior
Current Coilover: KWV3

[Lalit@autocouture]

Ohlins + Vorshlag plates get my vote. For a DD, the Clubsports are far too stiff for my liking. I'm sure you don't miss the north east roads lol

[Malek@MRF]

While the Ohlins are a great suspension, they are not on the same level as the KW Clubsport coilover for track duty.

Once setup correctly, the CS ride very well and daily drivable without a doubt.

[Exclusivs]

Originally Posted by Lalit@AUTOcouture

Ohlins + Vorshlag plates get my vote. For a DD, the Clubsports are far too stiff for my liking. I'm sure you don't miss the north east roads lol

No, I do not Which is why Clubsports may be liveable on the West. Did you run both?

Originally Posted by Malek@MRF

While the Ohlins are a great suspension, they are not on the same level as the KW Clubsport coilover for track duty.

Once setup correctly, the CS ride very well and daily drivable without a doubt.

Curious, as to why you think Ohlins are not on par w/ Clubsport?

[Jremmy]

I love my ohlins. Only have had one track day on them but they handle great and when dialed down for DD use, are more comfy than the stock ZCP EDC suspension IMHO.
If you you "out grow" them as you get faster at the track, you can always do the swift spring conversion to make them a little more track oriented.
I would PM josh/tightie. He recently switched from ohlins to kw and is probably one of the best people to ask regarding this question. The bottom line is that you really can't go wrong with either setup.

[Semi-Poor]

I just had Ohlins installed for their comfort and "real world" capability. Totally get why track guys would want stiffer more track focused setup. My car may see a track day once a year with spirited weekend back road driving. So for me the choice was easy since my usage balance is so skewed. I think the Ohlins ride somewhere between "comfort and sport" versus stock ZCP. Feel like I gave up little to nothing comfort wise with big gains in performance and aesthetics. Your call is much tougher to make, I live in CT so crappy roads were a constant not a variable in my equation. Best of luck, think you will be a winner either way.

[Lalit@autocouture]

Originally Posted by Exclusivs

No, I do not Which is why Clubsports may be liveable on the West. Did you run both?



Curious, as to why you think Ohlins are not on par w/ Clubsport?

We had Clubsports on Big Purp which were going to be replaced with Ohlins but the car was sold prior to the new setup being delivered. Both of our shop E92's, my recently sold AW and Sal's MR have since been on Ohlins and I've got not a single bad thing to say about them. The swift spring setup (check it out here) along with Vorshlag camber plates is win. Throw some RD sways in the mix and .

[Yaw]

Ohlins R&T are most definitely on par with the clubsports for track duty and pairing them with the Vorshlag camber plates is a proven combination. As for the softer springs, this is an approach to achieve greater mechanical grip. If you are looking to increase lateral stiffness, get larger antiroll bars.

[STALKER]

Originally Posted by Malek@MRF

While the Ohlins are a great suspension, they are not on the same level as the KW Clubsport coilover for track duty.

Once setup correctly, the CS ride very well and daily drivable without a doubt.

Maybe on smooth roads. CS is shit ride quality compared to JRZ RS1 or Ohlins RT for street use on anything bumpy.

I had CS, adjusted them many many many times.

[Exclusivs]

Originally Posted by Lalit@AUTOcouture

We had Clubsports on Big Purp which were going to be replaced with Ohlins but the car was sold prior to the new setup being delivered. Both of our shop E92's, my recently sold AW and Sal's MR have since been on Ohlins and I've got not a single bad thing to say about them. The swift spring setup (check it out here) along with Vorshlag camber plates is win. Throw some RD sways in the mix and .

Good to hear. The only "bad" thing, I've heard so far in regards to Ohlins in the "Servicing." Though, it is recommended to service all coilovers at a certain point in their life-span, apparently Ohlins puts a bigger stress on it. Though, being the coilover is relatively new to the market, I don't think many guys have done this or even plan on it. More of a preventative measure so to speak?

Originally Posted by Yaw

Ohlins R&T are most definitely on par with the clubsports for track duty and pairing them with the Vorshlag camber plates is a proven combination. As for the softer springs, this is an approach to achieve greater mechanical grip. If you are looking to increase lateral stiffness, get larger antiroll bars.

Excellent! Good to know this, are you running Ohlin R&T + Sways?

Originally Posted by STALKER

Maybe on smooth roads. CS is shit ride quality compared to JRZ RS1 or Ohlins RT for street use on anything bumpy.

I had CS, adjusted them many many many times.

So I've heard. It might be a different story for the 3-way Clubsport, which I'm not reading good things about in regards to daily driving/bump compliance, but the 2-way seem to be strictly geared towards track performance, with slack in daily ride comfort. Both great setups, I'm sure I will not be disappointed in either, just need to identify your needs, and cars primary function!

[slicer]

I have been very happy with the ride quality and performance of my clubsport 3-ways on the street and track. I have never had Ohlins so I can't make a direct comparison.

[okusa]

Save up a little more money, go JRZ, and never look back.

[Exclusivs]

Originally Posted by slicer

I have been very happy with the ride quality and performance of my clubsport 3-ways on the street and track. I have never had Ohlins so I can't make a direct comparison.

My understanding is that the 3-way, are much more compliant then 2-way. Hence, I have adjusted my original post to specify (2-way). You have a good setup on your car! I wouldn't hesitate to run Clubsport 3-ways.

Check here: http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=667844

Originally Posted by okusa

Save up a little more money, go JRZ, and never look back.

Interesting, as there doesn't seem to be many M3 guys running JRZ's? Or maybe, they are flying under the radar. Curious as to why you say this?

[Malek@MRF]

Originally Posted by STALKER

Maybe on smooth roads. CS is shit ride quality compared to JRZ RS1 or Ohlins RT for street use on anything bumpy.

I had CS, adjusted them many many many times.

Understandable, but most CS setups that I have seen come into this shop were usually setup incorrectly with compression settings set much higher than they needed to be.

[Yaw]

You don't really get slack for comfort, not really how it works. Either the shock has a nicely shaped force curve on the dyno or it doesn't.

[STALKER]

Originally Posted by Malek@MRF

Understandable, but most CS setups that I have seen come into this shop were usually setup incorrectly with compression settings set much higher than they needed to be.

We played around with it a good amount, our roads are here very poor though due to our harsh winters.

CS is great out on track though.

[radiantm3]

Originally Posted by Exclusivs

Interesting, as there doesn't seem to be many M3 guys running JRZ's? Or maybe, they are flying under the radar. Curious as to why you say this?

Probably because they are more expensive and not as well known of a brand as the other two.

[Exclusivs]

Originally Posted by Yaw

You don't really get slack for comfort, not really how it works. Either the shock has a nicely shaped force curve on the dyno or it doesn't.

Please explain in further detail if you don't mind...

Originally Posted by radiantm3

Probably because they are more expensive and not as well known of a brand as the other two.

Interesting, because you'd think a brand like JRZ - who charges the amount they do for certain coilover setups would have an updated website with proper applications listed. However, they do not even list product for the E9X M3.

That is not to say they make a bad product, just surprising...

[lukester]

It's pretty easy.
Pro for the KW Clubsport:
Camber plate and damper are a solid solution from one company.
No need to reinvent the wheel at that point with parts from 2 vendors which
could cause issues.

It depends on what you're driving.
For me the Clubsport spring rate is at the lowest level for track usage.
Why? It's a 110 front and 120 rear spring.

I'm running 160 or 180 springs in my M3 … but that car is not driven on the road
too much. Just from time to time to get to a track.

But the Oehlins has a 60! spring in the front and 120 in the rear.
What the heck?! This spring setup will cause massive body roll.
You can try to correct it by closing the compression dampening
to nearly max on the front but that's basically the wrong way.

The old KW Clubsport had 90 front and 120 rear and thanks god that
the new version has 110 and 120 rear for a better balance.
So 90 front was already to soft for the e92 M3 for the time to time
track driver.

But the 60 spring in the Oehlins … I don't get it and it explains why
people say that the Oehlins is perhaps even more comfortable than the stock
suspension.

KW:
http://docs.kwsuspension.de/ga-KWCS-...67_1119-13.pdf

Oehlins:
http://www.ohlins.eu/de/automotive/r.../BMS-MI40--15/

my2cents.

[Semi-Poor]

OEM or Ohlins I am hard pressed to list "massive body roll" as an attribute of an M3. Guess I drive too slow.

[Wendall]

KW all the way. They are not stiff at all (stock settings)! I don't see how people want a sports car but cannot take the anything firmer than the mush oem suspension.

Whats great about KW is that you can easily adjust it to be almost as soft as oem or go track ready in less than 10min. I dont even have to jack up my car. I just lay on the floor.

[Wendall]

Originally Posted by lukester

It's pretty easy.
Pro for the KW Clubsport:
Camber plate and damper are a solid solution from one company.
No need to reinvent the wheel at that point with parts from 2 vendors which
could cause issues.

It depends on what you're driving.
For me the Clubsport spring rate is at the lowest level for track usage.
Why? It's a 110 front and 120 rear spring.

I'm running 160 or 180 springs in my M3 … but that car is not driven on the road
too much. Just from time to time to get to a track.

But the Oehlins has a 60! spring in the front and 120 in the rear.
What the heck?! This spring setup will cause massive body roll.
You can try to correct it by closing the compression dampening
to nearly max on the front but that's basically the wrong way.

The old KW Clubsport had 90 front and 120 rear and thanks god that
the new version has 110 and 120 rear for a better balance.
So 90 front was already to soft for the e92 M3 for the time to time
track driver.

But the 60 spring in the Oehlins … I don't get it and it explains why
people say that the Oehlins is perhaps even more comfortable than the stock
suspension.

KW:
http://docs.kwsuspension.de/ga-KWCS-...67_1119-13.pdf

Oehlins:
http://www.ohlins.eu/de/automotive/r.../BMS-MI40--15/

my2cents.

+1.