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10-31-2008, 11:18 AM | #1 |
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ZR1 vs. GT-R
[u2b]<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/mC-PQca6FJU&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/mC-PQca6FJU&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>[/u2b]
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10-31-2008, 01:48 PM | #4 |
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For all those who believe all of the GT-Rs track performance is from its UFO like handling here we see it getting trounced on both the slalom and skidpad.
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10-31-2008, 02:07 PM | #5 |
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WOW very awesome job Nissan!!!! wow very impressive.... but more WOW's to GM for this masterpiece!!!!
GM's victory here doesnt by any means suggest Nissan didnt do a great job on the GTR! edit: Nissan got a small block V6, turbo'd it and tuned it and got an awesome car to match the Z06. GM got the Z06, FI'd it and tuned it and got something nice. I'd like to see the ZR1 with ACR tho... i hate when people go "unbeatable" and all that bullshit! fuck you edmunds, race that with McLaren F1 or CCX-R and tell me who's unbeatable lol didnt the ACR beat the ZR1 on N'Ring? |
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10-31-2008, 02:48 PM | #6 | |
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Second skidpad figures do not prove cornering ability, the actual speed through a corner is the only thing which matters and due to the way awd car shuffle the power means they can produce less Gs but equally as quick cornering speed. The most interesting thing on the lap with the way the two cars behaved, the GTR was ultra stabled and composed, while the ZR1 was very twitchy which they commented on and this is a smooth track and nothing like the rough and bumpy surface that makes up the ring. P.S. I don't want another 100 post back and forth on this, only highlighting what I know. There is no doubt the ZR1 is an amazing machine, like it's lapped the ring within a whisker of the ACR which I regard as a race car with road plates and generates real downforce. |
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10-31-2008, 04:24 PM | #8 | |
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g force = speed^2/(radius x gravity constant) Cornering g force and speed absolutely are locked in and related in this fashion. Understanding cars in detail requires and understanding of basic science. So again I am not saying you can predict real world track corner g force from the skidpad values on a different radius and different speed. What I am saying is that you can not take two vehicles and have one corner faster but produce less g force in the same corner with the same line! |
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10-31-2008, 05:06 PM | #9 | |||
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The other examples show how speed and Lateral Gs can differ, the Enzo and CXX recording the same Gs reading through Hohe Acht, but differ in speed by 2.4mph and through Brunnchen where the speeds were all but identical yet the G figures were again different for each other. Quote:
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10-31-2008, 06:26 PM | #10 | |
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1. The measurements are not instantaneous, perhaps averaged over a short section. 2. The cars used different lines, hence different radii. 3. The accelerometers were not accurately calibrated. 4. The cars were accelerating tangentially while cornering (i.e. a corner at constant speed is still accelerating, what I mean is that the speedo was also changing). 5. The turns are banked confounding the measurement process. |
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10-31-2008, 06:44 PM | #11 |
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As mentioned previously, the GTR competes with the Z06, not the ZR1.
The new GTR V-Spec out next year can blow away the ZR1 . V-spec: almost completely carbon fiber for estimated 400lbs less, no back seats, more boost to around 520+horsepower. Do the math.
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10-31-2008, 07:24 PM | #12 | |
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As a by-the-way, I don't think you guys are actually disagreeing in the slightest. Bruce |
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10-31-2008, 07:34 PM | #13 | |
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Well we are perhaps closer than total disagreement but I can't see how you can get to not even a slight disagreement. Foot seems to believe they numbers are free to adjust each independently (perhaps even under ideal conditions and based on how many drive wheels in the car). |
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10-31-2008, 07:39 PM | #14 | |
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Sure I'll do the math. If it is anywhere as close to as under rated at the regular model that got the 7:29 it will put out about 600 hp and that indeed will be quite a car. |
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10-31-2008, 07:49 PM | #15 |
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Now back to the matter in hand, the actual GTR that posted the 7:29. Swamp, I got your reply on my observation and well, what do you think?
I would prefer not to debate on the V-spec, especially with the few thousand posts already on the standard version, with the small exception that I believe the weight won't drop by 400lbs but do believe the power will approach the 600hp point (unofficially). |
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10-31-2008, 08:33 PM | #16 |
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GT-R got smoked.
Nice vid. Best Regards, Maika
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11-01-2008, 12:06 AM | #18 |
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I think according to edmunds the ZR1 handles better, but is harder to drive.
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11-01-2008, 12:39 AM | #19 | |
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Did you even watch the video? |
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11-01-2008, 09:11 AM | #20 | |
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I wasn't referring to banked turns. I was referring to differences in lean angle of the cars around whatever turn.
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You're quoting physics 101 scripture, but on the actual planet, attacking a curve in an ideal manner varies from car to car - and of course from driver to driver. The ideal line will vary, and a driver may in fact induce an "artificial" peak G via wheel or throttle action in order to get a given car to behave in a way the driver prefers, for alignment into the next turn, or whatever. As far as I know, nobody who does skidpad tests measures average G with an accelerometer, even though that wouldn't be difficult. They do average G by measuring how long it takes to get around a circle of a given radius, and, on a racecourse, they typically only measure peak G. As an aside, I'm guessing that measuring average G around a given turn would probably generate at least as many questions as it would answer (because of the differences involved in attacking a given curve with a given driver), so as far as I know, it's seldom done. In any event, you two are agreeing on the primary point, mentioned in my first paragraph. Bruce |
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11-01-2008, 03:09 PM | #21 | |
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P.S.......I love 2 cars on your signature....LS430 and GTR
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11-01-2008, 03:34 PM | #22 | |
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