HELP Comsidering trading my M for a CTS-V

[SCCAForums.com]

Originally Posted by GatorBlue371

An 08' M will be out of warranty in a year... unless the Owner ran up the miles.

??? Are you aware of the same BMW warranty I am? 4 Years 50K miles? Assuming the car was bought in 2008... he'd be fine till 2012? And I don't know if this OP keeps his cars more than 3 years or not?

Looked at the Z06, but didn't like their crash test ratings
So which car met your crash test ratings? What did you buy and what do you drive now?

SMG? Have you driven the CTS-V? The shifts are very comparable.
This would lend me to believe you have not.. Yes, I have driven the CTS-V... I considered purchasing as well, when I was selling the M5... It is a true 'SLUSHBOX'... and shifts NOTHING like an SMG car... It's clear you have not driven the two if you believe differently. It was so awful (to me) that I figured I would probably purchase the T6060 manual if I were to go Cadillac.


This is not just hypothetical, but unsupported.
How can you say unsupported? Cadillac is now Government Motors? The sustainability of this company is by far in the worst position ever, thus why they are giving cars away... and hopefully they will be here in the long run, for warranty and support. However... it brings up another point... the OP has not mentioned... but the 60 day money back guarantee... is a good position to be in... get his car paid off... and get a free test drive for 59 days... and then can choose something else if doesn't meet his needs... so that's another bonus for the Cadillac

So your planning on everyone that he hangs out with being as ignorant as you? My guess is that if he buys the car, he'll gain a reputation for having the car that eats M's
I haven't resorted to personal attacks in our differing of opinions gator... but can't the same be said for just purchasing a GT500 then? I mean... reputation, and perception is something that is considered when paying that kind of money for a car (IMO)... When I drove the CTS-V... my 'Impression' was it is a damn nice $45K car... when they are there... they'll be awesome rides... and it looks like their getting there quicker than I thought.

Little will they know that he had to settle
Again... why buy an M car at all... might as well get a Pontiac G8 GXP... I mean I think plenty would disagree owning an M car is a 'Settle'...

I think what it ends up coming down to, and why the '08 M5 may not be an option (again if an E90 DCT is not as well)... is the OP doesn't have a dealer willing to give him the same deal for his car, and that is too good a deal to pass up it sounds like. I was merely trying to offer an alternative, that still gave the OP a BMW alternative that could meet his needs. His title did say "HELP"... I took it as... Help me not leave the BMW M Series, but still meet my family needs.

Dave

[jmos77]

You are right on the money. There wasn't a BMW dealer willing to give me what I needed on the trade for my M but the Caddy dealer stepped up. Your opinions are very much apprecicated and I thank you for them. As indicated I am only 40 and the V is simply a very viable option to move to a very capable and fast 4 door. I simply couldn't find a great deal on a 4 door M3 with DCT or I probably would have seriously considered it. As far as the question on the 335 I did have one of those as well aroind 2 years ago and I am now in the M3. Thanks again and have fun no matter what your driving.

[ihyln]

If you need 4 doors and aren't taking a bath on the trade I say do it. CTS-V is a fine car.

[SCCAForums.com]

Originally Posted by GatorBlue371

I Have driven a CTS-V, and have been driven IN an M5. Shifts appeared to be comparable. Let me ask you... in any of the countless reviews that have been done between the two... do any of them mention the M5 having a superior tranny?

[/B]

If the M5 you rode in was not in S6... it's leagues different. (Most are not.. because many are a bit shy of defeating the Traction Control 100%, which is the only way to get to S6) And as for the mags... all those I read (when comparing to BMW) actually compared 6 speed to 6 speed. Which I'd actually say the nod goes to Cadillace for Manual Trans, but would say nod goes to BMW for Automatic. Although most tests will also show the Automatic CTS V is quicker than the 6 speed CTS V... so another nod to the Cadillac there.

Good luck on the RS5, I love the audi styling... but I just love 'drifting' around corners too much...

I think it will be great to hear the OP's reviews in 60 days or so... no doubt the CTS-V is a solid car, and the deal he's getting is too good to pass up.

Sorry to see ya have to leave the M lineup... I've owned a lot of cars in my 'short' years... and I really appreciate everything the M family involves.

Peace,
Dave

[smmmurf]

No way, the M3 is the best car out right now. If anything, get an M3 Sedan.

[warzilla]

Good luck to the OP on the CTS-V. I really hope you like it after owning for a while.

[jmos77]

So I finally pulled the trigger and wanted to thank everyone for their comments and share some initial thoughts of the two cars. First they are truly two very different machines that go about their business in very different ways. I will also say that both cars are amazing vehicles and yo simply cannot go wrong with either one. THese are simply subjective observations and each person will have their own opinions on each.

Engine:
M3: To me sinmly one of the sweetest sounding cars on the top end that I have ever driven. The only issue I ever had was a lack of low end torque and to enjoy this engine you need to be in the upper revs. Yhis can and always will be intoxicating to hear and feel. It is much easier to launch this car and get up to speed and doesnt require alot of finesse at launch/ Simply depends on what you like.

CTS-V: A true HP and Torque animal. THe biggest difference that is immediately obvious is the amount of torque this engine makes at all RPM ranges. This car is also much harder to get off the line and get the power down but once you do it is downright scary for a car of this size. THere is instant power at all levels and the car pulls hard all day long. It also has a more traditional America V8 rumble which some may or may not love just an observation. There is a slight drone which is more pronounced than in the M

Suspension:

M: THe M is one of the best handling cars you will ever drive. The steering feel is impossible to replicate as I always compared this to a surgeon with a sclapel, it is simply that precise. You can always put this car exactly where you want it. Always in control and never nervous at all. THe suspension setup in nearly perfect and offers a great balance. I think it will always be hard to find a car that will keep you as connected as the M does. The Cayman S is close but still not there.

CTS-V: The V handles surprisingly well and can hang tough with most cars o the road. The Magnetic suspension offers 2 options so you can have a sport and touring mode which is very nice. THe steering is somewhat vague as compared to the M and not nearly as precise but it still gets the job done and you feel connected and in control most of the time. The V loves to kick the rear out and is alot of fun as lond as you can keep all the power in control.

Interior:

M: On the M you either love it or you hate it. The interior is all business and somewhat cold compared to others especially the V. I still find the seats in teh M to be the best in the business got spirited driving I always got a little tires on longer drives. All in all the M lacks slightly in creature comforts and overall feel but is still a very functional interior.

CTS-V: The interior of the V is probably one of the bigger surprised for me in that it is a beautiful interior with all the creature comforts you can imagine. It has a fantastic 8" pop up GPS display with one of the best IPOD and interaces I have seen. Some may not like the piano black trim on the interior but I personally like it along with the graphite trim and hand stiched interior. It also has really nice ambient lighting at night and all in all is a great place to spend time. I also like the skyview sunroof which is a nice option.

The bottom line is like any car in this category it comes down to a simple matter of needs and preference. They are bot incredible cars and have their different virtues. THe V is a scary fast car that can haul teh entire family and the M is simply one of the best overall packages on the road today. Regardless of what you drive enjoy and be safe. Thanks again for all of the feedback. At the end of the day I simply couldnt pass up such a great deal.

[SCCAForums.com]

Great Job JMOS... and great review... much of the same things I experienced when comparing the two.

My only other minor issue, was the 'screen door' like skyview cover... that just sort of 'hangs there' when attempting to cover the skyview roof. I realized they had to do this, as there isn't enough room to 'slide back' a more solid solution... but I think I'd probably just have to leave it rolled up... I felt that was a tacky piece... wish it could be 'tighter/flatter' more like a 'sunroof' slider.

Enjoy the ride and the deal!

[bobbyd1961]

go ahead trade in an exotic BMW M3 for a caddilac

[Garissimo]

Originally Posted by jmos77

So I finally pulled the trigger and wanted to thank everyone for their comments and share some initial thoughts of the two cars. [...]

That's a really nice comparison. Thanks for taking the time to share your thoughts and enjoy your flying V!

[shchow]

Originally Posted by jmos77

So I finally pulled the trigger and wanted to thank everyone for their comments and share some initial thoughts of the two cars. First they are truly two very different machines that go about their business in very different ways. I will also say that both cars are amazing vehicles and yo simply cannot go wrong with either one. THese are simply subjective observations and each person will have their own opinions on each.

Engine:
M3: To me sinmly one of the sweetest sounding cars on the top end that I have ever driven. The only issue I ever had was a lack of low end torque and to enjoy this engine you need to be in the upper revs. Yhis can and always will be intoxicating to hear and feel. It is much easier to launch this car and get up to speed and doesnt require alot of finesse at launch/ Simply depends on what you like.

CTS-V: A true HP and Torque animal. THe biggest difference that is immediately obvious is the amount of torque this engine makes at all RPM ranges. This car is also much harder to get off the line and get the power down but once you do it is downright scary for a car of this size. THere is instant power at all levels and the car pulls hard all day long. It also has a more traditional America V8 rumble which some may or may not love just an observation. There is a slight drone which is more pronounced than in the M

Suspension:

M: THe M is one of the best handling cars you will ever drive. The steering feel is impossible to replicate as I always compared this to a surgeon with a sclapel, it is simply that precise. You can always put this car exactly where you want it. Always in control and never nervous at all. THe suspension setup in nearly perfect and offers a great balance. I think it will always be hard to find a car that will keep you as connected as the M does. The Cayman S is close but still not there.

CTS-V: The V handles surprisingly well and can hang tough with most cars o the road. The Magnetic suspension offers 2 options so you can have a sport and touring mode which is very nice. THe steering is somewhat vague as compared to the M and not nearly as precise but it still gets the job done and you feel connected and in control most of the time. The V loves to kick the rear out and is alot of fun as lond as you can keep all the power in control.

Interior:

M: On the M you either love it or you hate it. The interior is all business and somewhat cold compared to others especially the V. I still find the seats in teh M to be the best in the business got spirited driving I always got a little tires on longer drives. All in all the M lacks slightly in creature comforts and overall feel but is still a very functional interior.

CTS-V: The interior of the V is probably one of the bigger surprised for me in that it is a beautiful interior with all the creature comforts you can imagine. It has a fantastic 8" pop up GPS display with one of the best IPOD and interaces I have seen. Some may not like the piano black trim on the interior but I personally like it along with the graphite trim and hand stiched interior. It also has really nice ambient lighting at night and all in all is a great place to spend time. I also like the skyview sunroof which is a nice option.

The bottom line is like any car in this category it comes down to a simple matter of needs and preference. They are bot incredible cars and have their different virtues. THe V is a scary fast car that can haul teh entire family and the M is simply one of the best overall packages on the road today. Regardless of what you drive enjoy and be safe. Thanks again for all of the feedback. At the end of the day I simply couldnt pass up such a great deal.

Nice review!
I see that you are also in NJ. Mind if I ask which Caddy dealer...Desimone?
I am also debating between the CTS-V or the E63 when my lease ends in 5/2010.
I already test drove the CTS-V hard and scared the salesman, LOL.
Waiting to test drive the E63 when the dealer gets one for the showroom later this month...

[footie]

The CTS-V is surely a step up in size and weight compared to the M3, a bit like moving to an M5 without the increase on dosh that would be required for that move.

I never driven one so don't know how it compares but I don't personally like the excessive amount of chrome it uses, apart from that it's a decent looking car both inside and out. But man does it have a lot of poke.

[SCCAForums.com]

Originally Posted by shchow

Nice review!
I see that you are also in NJ. Mind if I ask which Caddy dealer...Desimone?
I am also debating between the CTS-V or the E63 when my lease ends in 5/2010.
I already test drove the CTS-V hard and scared the salesman, LOL.
Waiting to test drive the E63 when the dealer gets one for the showroom later this month...

LOL... my Caddy dealer actually brought the CTS-V to my work, and let me and my partner take the car without him!

So... I was able to REAM it in EVERY WAY!!

At that time, I was in the M5... and my partner and I noticed it didn't pull on the 'big end' like my M5... But wow... that TORQUE!

And my M5 was modded... the CTS-V with a few mods... would be a BEAST!
Dave

[shchow]

Originally Posted by SCCAForums.com

At that time, I was in the M5... and my partner and I noticed it didn't pull on the 'big end' like my M5

I thought the Caddy didn't pull like my M5 either, despite the fact that I know it's faster. Probably the extra 300-400 pounds the Caddy has that makes it feel less tossable.
I really like the CTS-V, and it's 25-30k less than the E63, very tempting...

[Optherion]

Originally Posted by jmos77

teh wife loves speed and wants to drive the car.

This always scares me when I read this. No offense to anyone but it reminds me the time I let a friend of my wife's drive my viper. I watched her go two blocks and do a 180 at a right hand turn and jump the curb. Destroyed the drivers side.

CTS-V Cruiser - M3 Carver

[M156]

Personally a used manual 08 M5 would be on the top of my list if i am looking for a large family sedan.

CTS V is an nice alternative since its almost imoossible to find a manual M5.

I am not sure about ctsv's tranny manual or auto cause i ve never driven one but I know for a fact the SMG in the M5 is pretty frustrating(not as fun as a manual and not as smooth as an auto).

Both of these cars are totally a step up from M3 if you are talking about power. I have driven the M5 extensively and when you walk out of a M5 into a M3 , you will think the M3 feels like a 6cylinder.

[chris719]

Originally Posted by bobbyd1961
go ahead trade in an exotic BMW M3 for a caddilac

Originally Posted by stingray23

exotic?

This guy is an idiot, just take a look at some of his other posts and you'll see. The very definition of the stereotypical BMW driving douchebag.

[graider]

interesting when the OP mentioned the steering precision "The Cayman S is close but still not there" compare to the m3. um....are you sure OP? Cause many are saying otherwise.

[David 12]

"Suspension:

M: THe M is one of the best handling cars you will ever drive. The steering feel is impossible to replicate as I always compared this to a surgeon with a sclapel, it is simply that precise. You can always put this car exactly where you want it. Always in control and never nervous at all. THe suspension setup in nearly perfect and offers a great balance. I think it will always be hard to find a car that will keep you as connected as the M does. The Cayman S is close but still not there."

Not to highjack this thread but I test drove a 2009 M3 coupe and a 2009 Cayman S a couple of months ago. Coming from a 335i coupe, the M3 handling was precise, and balanced is a very good descriptor; but I would apply the "surgical" term more to the Cayman S. The Cayman S did have the 19" carrera S wheel package and PASM.

Dave

[shchow]

If I could do it all over again, I would buy a 2-3 year old M5 that has already taken the depreciation hit, and get the Dinan stroker engine upgrade for 30k...

[chris719]

Out of curiosity, how do you feel your Cayman S compares to your Z4M roadster or coupe?

[TLud]

Originally Posted by shift@red

No offense, but if you think the m3 has better steering feel than a cayman S, or any Porsche sports car for that matter, you must be on A LOT of very powerful drugs. M3 is very blunt compared to a Cayman S, and the suspension & balance are not nearly as good either. The cayman S is easily one of the best handling cars ever made! It is MUCH more connected than any BMW you can buy and is just flat out a better car to drive in every way.
Now if you havnt driven a Porsche, i could understand this quite uninformed comment, but what you said couldnt be any further from the truth.

I'm probably one of the bigger Cayman S proponents on this forum, but I think you overstated your case by saying that the Cayman S is a "flat out better car to drive in every way." I agree that the suspension, balance, handling and feedback are superior to the M3, but the Cayman S falls short in the engine department in my book. Essentially, it felt like the M3 down low, but without the upper end fireworks of the M3.