Bolt-on Rollcage for E92 M3 - Anyone?

[Gearhead999s]

Originally Posted by Ryan239

Yeah, a bolt in setup is a compromise all around, but if you look at most welded-in setups, they aren't using much more of a footplate in terms of size; I think where they'll really help is by angling the footer up along the side and helping to secure the structure in more spots than just the floorboards.

Going to a fully caged car is definitely a smart idea. It's a lot of extra baloney to deal with, cause now you need a truck and a trailer, someplace to store the truck and trailer, but from a safety perspective it's a lot better.

Yeah I am thinking about a proper racecar for lapping days once again because of the safety side of things.A street car on track is a comprimise at best,but the logistics of having having a trailered playtoy is not something that I look forward to.

[lucid]

Originally Posted by Ryan239

Going to a fully caged car is definitely a smart idea. It's a lot of extra baloney to deal with, cause now you need a truck and a trailer, someplace to store the truck and trailer, but from a safety perspective it's a lot better.

Yeah, I've been trying to avoid this scenario for over a year now, but I caved in last week and bought a trailer for $2k, and a 04 Expedition for $8.8k, and rented a spot for the trailer (people are giving stuff away way under any kind of standard valuation these days). I kind of made this decision after my trip to the Glen. More than a 1000 miles on the car in 4 days. It would have 100k miles in 4 years if I kept that up. Plus, we all know this is a heavy beast in street trim, and although it handles like a champ, you have to fight all that. Anyway, will start looking into a track car ideas for next year soon. What kind of race car do you have?

[lucid]

Originally Posted by Gearhead999s

Yeah I am thinking about a proper racecar for lapping days once again because of the safety side of things.

What type of car would you consider? I am considering E36 M3, E46 M3, or an S2000 at this point.

[Gearhead999s]

Originally Posted by lucid

What type of car would you consider? I am considering E36 M3, E46 M3, or an S2000 at this point.

An E36-46 that I could also race in BMW club events.There are a lot of guys in this area with those cars and it looks like a fun place to play & lots of different tracks to play at.I also like that they run the rule of 13 like the vintage guys do,so contact should be minimized.
Failing that it would be a newer Mustang as our group owns 4 Ford stores in the Toronto area and that would be a popular thing around hereOur chairman is always impressed when he walks into my office with the BMW calender & Ducati models!Calabogie has built up 2 Mustangs with full suspension & safety gear as rental lapping cars @ $1500 day.

[lucid]

Originally Posted by Gearhead999s

Calabogie has built up 2 Mustangs with full suspension & safety gear as rental lapping cars @ $1500 day.

NASA/PDA was renting semi built-up Mustangs at Limerock. Can't remember the exact figure, but I believe it was around ~$1200/day, but that might have included the event registration fee as well. I've been keeping track of my own consumables and insurance costs with this car. Not a pretty scene. This isn't a cheap hobby.

[Gearhead999s]

Originally Posted by lucid

NASA/PDA was renting semi built-up Mustangs at Limerock. Can't remember the exact figure, but I believe it was around ~$1200/day, but that might have included the event registration fee as well. I've been keeping track of my own consumables and insurance costs with this car. Not a pretty scene. This isn't a cheap hobby.

I got into the bikes because of the relative low cost of running of running around on 2 wheels.3 days on tires @ $400 vs 3 days @ $1600 if you are lucky.My rears are toast after 2 days and I might get 1 more day out of the fronts if I flip them.

$30/day vs $150/day for fuel & on & on.I love the bike stuff but you can pay a big price physically for your mistakes and I take a long time to heal @ my age

I figure it costs me $1000-1500 a day on track or about $500 - 750 per hour!.When we were racing in the early 90's it was was costing us $5000 -8000 a weekend for a 3 hour race with no crash damage

[Gearhead999s]

Mustang Rental @ Calabogie

http://www.calabogiemotorsports.com/...106&Itemid=145

[lucid]

Originally Posted by Gearhead999s

I figure it costs me $1000-1500 a day on track or about $500 - 750 per hour!

Is that for consumable parts of the whole cost including registration, gas, and lodging, etc?

[Gearhead999s]

Originally Posted by lucid

Is that for consumable parts of the whole cost including registration, gas, and lodging, etc?

Consumables.My bar bill can be highly variable depending on the company

[lucid]

Originally Posted by Gearhead999s

Consumables.My bar bill can be highly variable depending on the company

Wow, that's high. You either constantly drift the car and put down your rubber, or are constantly with great company, or both! Or maybe you are including body repairs in that calculation?

My consumables seems to be running at more like $400/track day.

[Gearhead999s]

Originally Posted by lucid

Wow, that's high. You either constantly drift the car and put down your rubber, or are constantly with great company, or both! Or maybe you are including body repairs in that calculation?

My consumables seems to be running at more like $400/track day.

Maybe part of my problem is the way I drive

http://www.motorsportphotography.ca/...y_29_2009.html

[Gearhead999s]

Originally Posted by lucid

Wow, that's high. You either constantly drift the car and put down your rubber, or are constantly with great company, or both! Or maybe you are including body repairs in that calculation?

My consumables seems to be running at more like $400/track day.

Actually I did a more accurate calculation on consumables as I am seeing with based on the 4 days that I have done so far.The $1000CDN/day is more accurate based on the following wear rates on a 2 1/2 hour trackday.

$550 per day for tires based on 3 days average per set
$150 100 octane fuel based on 2 tanks @ race track pricing
$100 for front rotors@ $400 each based on a life of 8 days at the present wear rate
$50 rear rotors @$400 each based on 16 days life
$150 pads per day based on 2 days on fronts & 4 on rears


This does not include any other expenses that might show up.I am probally on the high end of the scale for tire wear and I do not like to run brake pads more than 50% before changing them out.

[lucid]

Originally Posted by Gearhead999s

Actually I did a more accurate calculation on consumables as I am seeing with based on the 4 days that I have done so far.The $1000CDN/day is more accurate based on the following wear rates on a 2 1/2 hour trackday.

$550 per day for tires based on 3 days average per set
$150 100 octane fuel based on 2 tanks @ race track pricing
$100 for front rotors@ $400 each based on a life of 8 days at the present wear rate
$50 rear rotors @$400 each based on 16 days life
$150 pads per day based on 2 days on fronts & 4 on rears


This does not include any other expenses that might show up.I am probally on the high end of the scale for tire wear and I do not like to run brake pads more than 50% before changing them out.

Well, I can see the differences in our accounting:

1. I am assuming the BFG R1s will be good for 7-8 track days. I have 4 on them now, and they seem to be holding up with somewhat less grip.

2. I don't use race gas. That stuff's ~$12/gal around here.

3. I am estimating front rotor life at 10 days.

4. I am seeing front pad life at 3-4 days, and rear pad life at 5-6 days.

[Gearhead999s]

Originally Posted by lucid

Well, I can see the differences in our accounting:

1. I am assuming the BFG R1s will be good for 7-8 track days. I have 4 on them now, and they seem to be holding up with somewhat less grip.

2. I don't use race gas. That stuff's ~$12/gal around here.

3. I am estimating front rotor life at 10 days.

4. I am seeing front pad life at 3-4 days, and rear pad life at 5-6 days.

I run the tire till they are corded,but I am not sure how long the 888's will run on the undertread.The RA1's could be run for a long time with no tread and still be quite useful so I am hoping the these will be the same so I might squeek at least another day which will reduce my cost per day.

I think the the 100 octane was about $2.00/litre which works to about $9.00 /gallon.The 110 octane is about $8.00 /litre which there is no need for.Dont forget that our 94 octane at the pump is $5.22/gallon for reference.

I am looking for a cheaper source for rotors at this point and there might be a supplier in Ottawa that can do 2 piece rotors for much cheaper and are used on a lot of race cars.The rotors from BMW list at over $550 at the dealer..

Pad costs will go down as I have more partially used to cycle in and out of the car.

[lucid]

I was able to get OEM front rotors for $304 a piece. Not at the dealer of course.

[attila]

How could you tell when the rotor is done??

[lucid]

You'll be able to visually see the pad contact area wearing out (it will be lower than the non-contact area), and there will most likely be minor cracking. You can measure its thickness for a more objective evaluation.

[ace996]

Yep... $1000 a day, all in is my figure. And I'm not running r-comps or running race gas.

And how many days do you guys figure before that "oh Sheet" car meets wall/other car day? Then we'll need to figure in many thousands for that consumable.

Much like my days running my prior Ducati 996 on the tracks of the Northeast (how I learned Pocono East and Louden)...it's not "if"...it's "when". After 3 downs on the bike and my birth of my first son, I thanked God for letting me keep all my brain cells and limbs and then moved to cars. But there's nothing like a bike on a track...nothing I know of.

[Gearhead999s]

Originally Posted by ace996

Yep... $1000 a day, all in is my figure. And I'm not running r-comps or running race gas.


, I thanked God for letting me keep all my brain cells and limbs and then moved to cars. But there's nothing like a bike on a track...nothing I know of.

Yep I cannot disagree with you about a bike on track.I sure had some pretty special days on a bike at some pretty great tracks!

[lucid]

Originally Posted by ace996

Yep... $1000 a day, all in is my figure. And I'm not running r-comps or running race gas.

That's pretty much what my all in figure is as well.

Originally Posted by ace996

And how many days do you guys figure before that "oh Sheet" car meets wall/other car day? Then we'll need to figure in many thousands for that consumable.

Annual track insurance is included in my figure.

Originally Posted by ace996

Much like my days running my prior Ducati 996 on the tracks of the Northeast (how I learned Pocono East and Louden)...it's not "if"...it's "when". After 3 downs on the bike and my birth of my first son, I thanked God for letting me keep all my brain cells and limbs and then moved to cars. But there's nothing like a bike on a track...nothing I know of.

I intentionally kept myself away from motorcyles. Never owned one.

[attila]

Originally Posted by lucid

You'll be able to visually see the pad contact area wearing out (it will be lower than the non-contact area), and there will most likely be minor cracking. You can measure its thickness for a more objective evaluation.

OK, but how much can you let them wear out! Like 1-2mm? I hoped the rotors are good for at least 15-18 track days plus normal driving. I already have some wear on them (and lots of deposite somehow after tha least track day.

[lucid]

Originally Posted by attila

OK, but how much can you let them wear out! Like 1-2mm? I hoped the rotors are good for at least 15-18 track days plus normal driving. I already have some wear on them (and lots of deposite somehow after tha least track day.

I actually don't know what the wear specs are on the OEM rotors. I replaced mine due to cracking, which was pretty obvious.