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07-13-2016, 08:40 PM | #23 | ||
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Nothing beats the low end torque, quality, ease of installation, and fit/finish of this kit
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07-13-2016, 10:33 PM | #24 | ||
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07-13-2016, 10:40 PM | #25 |
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Some vortechs whine. Some are barely noticeable. These engines have a lot of mechanical noise anyway. I would not base my decision on whine. Ideally, Id drive a good example of each and then decide which I liked more for my driving style.
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07-14-2016, 07:42 AM | #26 |
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Gentlemen, good discussion here about the differing power bands.
One thing I would like to point out with the ESS kit is that despite the lower boost in low rpm range, it still produces a lot more torque than stock and throttle response is further heightened. No need to grab a lower gear to pass in traffic ever. But much more importantly, the ESS powerband actually allows you to use all that power in every gear. It matches the chassis perfectly and with a good set of street tires and maybe some more solid subframe bushings to unitize the subframe and chassis, you can actually out launch nearly every car including all wheel drive cars. I showed this in my vid above where I out launched a couple Audi AWD cars including an R8 v10 which is a low 3-second 0-60 beast.
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07-14-2016, 10:09 AM | #27 | |
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07-14-2016, 10:56 AM | #28 |
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I've been craving low end torque lately and have considered moving to the F8x for that reason. At the same time I am seriously considering going Harrop on the e9x. Ultimately this would be a much cheaper option, especially since my car is decently modded already. For me it would be for DD enjoy-ability and then of course it would be fun to have more power on tap at the track as well (road course). Good comments all around. Longboarder your car is a beast!
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07-14-2016, 11:47 AM | #29 |
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///Mobbin - I have a 625 kit now and the power is fantastic.
Longboarder is spot on with his assessment and feedback, these kits have more than sufficient low end grunt to scratch that itch. It simply comes down to personal taste for your driving style and appetite. I will say - I have rode in a Harrop M3...very impressed with the power off the line, and the whine/noise isn't an issue once above 40 mph or so....and the fit/finish is wonderful. |
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07-14-2016, 11:55 AM | #30 | ||
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Regarding boost, the blower is always spinning even at idle. While it's likely that boost is still zero at say 2,500 rpm, the car makes way more power than stock at that level. In fact while the positive displacement Harrop blower makes high boost at the same 2,500 rpm, the dynos that I've seen with an overlay of the ESS dynos show that the Harrop isn't making much more power at this level. Yes it's making more power, but not a lot more than with the centrifugal vortech. These motors like to spin and so does the centrifugal. So the real fun begins at 5,000rpm and becomes almost unreal past 7,000rpm particularly with the 650 system that uses a different pulley system that doesn't slip at the top end unlike the 625 that seems some slippage and less boost up top.
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07-14-2016, 12:19 PM | #31 |
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Study posts 1085-1089 in the attached link to compare the twinscrew to the centrifugal.
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthr...ess625&page=50 |
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07-14-2016, 01:18 PM | #32 | |
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I'm always switching up cars and as I get older my tastes change. I really love my M3 and thought about swapping it for a Ferrari 430 or 458 but I actually liked my M3 better the way I have it built. I would definitely swap it for a hybrid "hyper" car but unfortunately the Porsche 918, LaFerrari and MacLaren P1 are way out of my price point. Maybe there is something else out there with similar technology that would interest me.
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07-14-2016, 03:10 PM | #33 |
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Does anyone know what OEM platform the Harrop (Eaton) supercharger went into? They mentioned this in some of their earlier marketing materials.
EDIT: Answer found, it's the same Eaton supercharger found in the new Z06 Corvette, LINK That's pretty cool.
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07-14-2016, 08:28 PM | #34 | |
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Now it's on Audi 3.0 TFSI V6, Corvette ZR1, Cadillac CTS-V, Jaguar XFR, Lotus Evora S, Range Rover 5.0 V8, Mustang GT500.
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07-14-2016, 10:48 PM | #36 |
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07-15-2016, 12:28 AM | #37 | |
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Mine for instance stock at 32k the bearings when changed were into the copper, from 32k-59k I was supercharged and on new bearings at which point they spun. I say if your going to supercharge then have your bearings pulled/swapped. If your showing excessive wear then I would not supercharge the car even on new bearings as your just going to see the same wear just faster. Built motor with new crank/better tolerances etc at that point would be only safe way to run it for any decent amount of time. Trust me.. its a very bad feeling when this engine craps out on you, term 'money pit' comes to mind.
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07-15-2016, 06:55 AM | #38 | |
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07-15-2016, 11:54 AM | #39 | |
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Yes I have over 100 dyno pulls at EAS trying numerous configurations (ESS 600, ESS 625, ESS 650, with stock exhaust, with catless exhaust, with 200 cel exhaust, with meth, without meth with water tank, pump gas, race gas, ethanol mixes, etc) I've posted most of the dynos here. The car made the most power on the dyno with the ESS 650 kit catless MRF mid pipe with Akra slip-on with what I guess is about 93-94 octane. (mix of pump 91 with some VP100 pump which I found out later was actually 97 octane). It made consistent 580 wheel HP on the EAS dyno in this form. Highest was 583. I later turned the car into my daily, swapping the MRF mid pipe to a full Akra Evolution. On my daily blend of e17-e22, the car makes about 570 wheel HP. On race gas mix with MS109 and pump 91 it makes around 560 wheel HP. I race the car on the same ethanol and pump gas mix. It's cheap and reliable. My water/ice tank gives the car no extra power on the dyno, but it helps the car keep HP. We can lose 100+ or more when the IATs rise, which is a serious problem with the inefficient ESS air to water intercooler. My DCT is stock with the GTS software.
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07-15-2016, 01:42 PM | #40 | |
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My bearings spun 3,000 miles after a perfect blackstone report. They even gave me a note telling me how pristine it looked for a supercharged report. Your really not going to know whats going on with bearings unless you look at them, while oil report does catch some that are going bad.. are alot it does not catch.
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07-15-2016, 03:44 PM | #41 | |
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Do you have to do a custom tune for this setup?
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07-15-2016, 05:01 PM | #42 |
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Like most of the feedback you've been given so far, the supercharger kits definitely help in the torque deficiency the s65 suffers from. The only thing you may miss about the m3 after getting a supercharger is that you no longer have to wind up the motor nearly as much since your almost always in the powerband with a supercharger.
As for supercharger kits, I would say get one from ESS. Many vendors relatively near queens have great experience with their systems and it's much less of a hassle to install compared to for example, an Active Autowerke supercharger like what I have. |
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07-16-2016, 12:31 AM | #43 |
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Yes need a custom tune, ESS has one for 4.4l low compression 625 that just needs a few tweaks and ill be good to go.
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07-16-2016, 12:54 AM | #44 |
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I had the harrop kit on my car and OMG i loved it. Still do. I literally cant find a replacement car after I sold mine (93k miles and I couldnt take having a convertable anymore) and needed more space for my dogs (bought a raptor). Everyday I still look at used E92s and already have a part list ready. Just need to finish up my projects so I can start funding this one again
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