Increased Rev Limiter: Dead Giveaway to BMW?

buddster · 01-29-2010, 11:49 PM

Most of the ECU tuners say the tune can't be detected by BMW because they don't have the equipment. Fair enough. If you get a tune and raise the rev limiter can they see the increased revs and therefore serve as a dead giveaway that the car has been tuned / modified?

SpencerM3 · 01-30-2010, 12:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buddster

Most of the ECU tuners say the tune can't be detected by BMW because they don't have the equipment. Fair enough. If you get a tune and raise the rev limiter can they see the increased revs and therefore serve as a dead giveaway that the car has been tuned / modified?

How can they see the increased revs? \I am going to assume that during service the techs don't rev the car up to 8400 RPM

M3 vert · 01-30-2010, 12:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpencerM3

How can they see the increased revs? \I am going to assume that during service the techs don't rev the car up to 8400 RPM

You never know

xxe92xx · 01-30-2010, 12:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PencilGeek

Your ECU logs its MaxRPM. If you ever go over 8400, they will know. The dealers DO have the ability to read out MaxRPM. Yes, this ends up being a dead giveaway that you've tuned your ECU. One guy in the Philipines was denied warranty service because the ECU logged above 8400 RPMs. If I'm not mistaken, he didn't even have a modified ECU.

Moral to the story: go ahead and modify your ECU, but don't change your rev limiter.

is there a way we could see this data?

xxe92xx · 01-30-2010, 01:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PencilGeek

I believe the dealer can read it and show it to you.

im guessing this isnt done through the key reader right? they would only investigate further if they were suspicious.....but i meant if there was a way I could see the data, to verify if I went over the rev limit without the dealer knowing

H Bomb · 01-30-2010, 01:23 AM

i have the dinan one which raises it but i rarely ever go that extra 200rpm so i should be ok. i would recommend there software to anyone, i think it is the safest one out there in my opinion

plus they put it back in for free when the idiot stealer removes it on you when your car is there

buddster · 01-30-2010, 11:13 AM

Thanks PG. It did seem like a rather easy way to get caught and void your warranty. Although wouldn't power pulleys be another mod that's easy to see (this time visually) and kill your power train warranty?

PunjabiM3 · 01-30-2010, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by buddster

Thanks PG. It did seem like a rather easy way to get caught and void your warranty. Although wouldn't power pulleys be another mod that's easy to see (this time visually) and kill your power train warranty?

I have been thinking of getting pulleys for quite some time and I have concluded the only one I would go with is Dinan simply because of the warranty. For things such as exhaust, intake, suspension go with whichever you like.

Ca$hOnly · 01-30-2010, 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PencilGeek

Your ECU logs its MaxRPM. If you ever go over 8400, they will know. The dealers DO have the ability to read out MaxRPM. Yes, this ends up being a dead giveaway that you've tuned your ECU. One guy in the Philipines was denied warranty service because the ECU logged above 8400 RPMs. If I'm not mistaken, he didn't even have a modified ECU.

Moral to the story: go ahead and modify your ECU, but don't change your rev limiter.

He did have a modified ECU. He said it was tuned by a "local" tuner, and he never mentioned the name.

Labrada_Exoticz · 01-30-2010, 08:46 PM

Is there any other way for the dealer to notice the tune?

Lemans_Blue_M · 01-30-2010, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by knext21

Is there any other way for the dealer to notice the tune?

yes...

They routinely scan every BMW message board on the internet!

You will now be getting a phone call on Monday morning.

gemini330zhp · 01-30-2010, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lemans_Blue_M

yes...

They routinely scan every BMW message board on the internet!

You will now be getting a phone call on Monday morning.

flipmeraz · 01-31-2010, 12:38 AM

My friend is a tech at BMW and he said they connect your car to a computer everytime it goes in for service and they check all the data on your car. Max RPM, max speed etc... He also said all that info gets sent to BMW NA.

Bob86GN · 01-31-2010, 07:20 AM

I guess they will like the 130MPH I just put on mine this week

dhoggm3 · 01-31-2010, 08:03 AM

"Rarely ever" exceeding 8400 doesn't matter. Do it once, it's recorded, and big Hans knows.

Lemans_Blue_M · 01-31-2010, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dhoggm3

"Rarely ever" exceeding 8400 doesn't matter. Do it once, it's recorded, and big Hans knows.

Yep, the data logging capabilities of the newest generation of Siemens MS-series ECU's is very impressive.

There are a number of things that you simply cannot 'reset' once they have occurred.

The current Siemens MS S65 engine management computer in the M3, can log a number of key events such as: max rpms, max speed, water over-temp events, oil over-temp events, severe engine knock events, limp mode/reduced power occurrences, VANOS camshaft timing errors, etc.

All of these things can lead to some type of engine damage, so BMW has the ECU record these events within the ECU's memory. (where a hand held code reader can not reset or erase them)

Once your M3 is connected to the BMW OBD-II diagnostic computer...they will be able to see everything you've been doing to the car.

Here's the typical reaction of a BMW technician when that happens...

Fanta · 01-31-2010, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PencilGeek

One guy in the Philipines was denied warranty service because the ECU logged above 8400 RPMs. If I'm not mistaken, he didn't even have a modified ECU.

Downshift!

Labrada_Exoticz · 01-31-2010, 11:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lemans_Blue_M

yes...

They routinely scan every BMW message board on the internet!

You will now be getting a phone call on Monday morning.

bher · 01-31-2010, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fanta

Downshift!

In a few seconds, the computer tells the 10 max rpm, Engine temp, mileage and speed at that moments.
I assume many more data are available but these are already giving a lot of info how the car has been driven.

xxe92xx · 01-31-2010, 04:21 PM

so in other words im fucked

there must be a way to get it "read" by somoene other than the dealer to see where your at

tom @ eas · 01-31-2010, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flipmeraz

My friend is a tech at BMW and he said they connect your car to a computer everytime it goes in for service and they check all the data on your car. Max RPM, max speed etc... He also said all that info gets sent to BMW NA.

That's not true, we have seen a number of DMEs sent in for bench/OBD2 flashing that have old software still on them, even with regular maintenance intervals.

BMW techs have a 1 hour cap on programming/CIP for reimbursement. Any longer, and the dealership loses money.

xxe92xx · 01-31-2010, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tom @ eas

That's not true, we have seen a number of DMEs sent in for bench/OBD2 flashing that have old software still on them, even with regular maintenance intervals.

BMW techs have a 1 hour cap on programming/CIP for reimbursement. Any longer, and the dealership loses money.

so im not fucked?

01-29-2010, 11:49 PM	#1
buddster Second Lieutenant 64 Rep 269 Posts Drives: 2022 M8 Gran Coupe Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Austin, TX iTrader: (0)	Increased Rev Limiter: Dead Giveaway to BMW? Most of the ECU tuners say the tune can't be detected by BMW because they don't have the equipment. Fair enough. If you get a tune and raise the rev limiter can they see the increased revs and therefore serve as a dead giveaway that the car has been tuned / modified?
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01-30-2010, 01:23 AM	#6
H Bomb Lieutenant Colonel 65 Rep 1,676 Posts Drives: 08 M3 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: FL to NY iTrader: (4)	i have the dinan one which raises it but i rarely ever go that extra 200rpm so i should be ok. i would recommend there software to anyone, i think it is the safest one out there in my opinion plus they put it back in for free when the idiot stealer removes it on you when your car is there __________________ Street- 08 E92 M3- Sparkling Graphite/ Fox Red/6sp Track- 10 CRF 250-PR2 Race Motor/Ohlins TTX Susp Hauler- 06 Ford Skyjacker F250 4WD
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01-30-2010, 11:13 AM	#7
buddster Second Lieutenant 64 Rep 269 Posts Drives: 2022 M8 Gran Coupe Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Austin, TX iTrader: (0)	Thanks PG. It did seem like a rather easy way to get caught and void your warranty. Although wouldn't power pulleys be another mod that's easy to see (this time visually) and kill your power train warranty?
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01-30-2010, 08:46 PM	#10
Labrada_Exoticz Subscribed 124 Rep 1,179 Posts Drives: F80 M3 Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Miami iTrader: (4)	Is there any other way for the dealer to notice the tune?
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01-31-2010, 12:38 AM	#13
flipmeraz Lieutenant 209 Rep 535 Posts Drives: 10 e92 m3 Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Central Coast Cali iTrader: (4)	My friend is a tech at BMW and he said they connect your car to a computer everytime it goes in for service and they check all the data on your car. Max RPM, max speed etc... He also said all that info gets sent to BMW NA.
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01-31-2010, 07:20 AM	#14
Bob86GN Private First Class 7 Rep 147 Posts Drives: 2022 F93 M8 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Worcester, PA iTrader: (0)	I guess they will like the 130MPH I just put on mine this week __________________ 2022 F93 M8 - Barcelona Blue 2019 991.2 TTS - Night Blue 2011 F-150 SuperCrew (Winter Transportation) 1986 Buick Grand National (10.8 @ 122mph) 1987 Buick Grand National (stockish)
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01-31-2010, 08:03 AM	#15
dhoggm3 Major 269 Rep 1,282 Posts Drives: 850i C, Gated R8 5.2, E63 Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Central PA iTrader: (1)	"Rarely ever" exceeding 8400 doesn't matter. Do it once, it's recorded, and big Hans knows. __________________ M850i Vert with RaceChip E46 M3, Euro Headers, Rasp Pipe, Kassel Tune Alpina B8, zero performance mods
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01-31-2010, 04:21 PM	#20
xxe92xx Banned 37 Rep 780 Posts Drives: 08 M3 Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Milwaukee, WI iTrader: (2)	so in other words im fucked there must be a way to get it "read" by somoene other than the dealer to see where your at
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