BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > E90/E92 M3 Technical Topics > Coding / ConnectedDrive / Audio-Video / Electronics / Bluetooth / I-Drive & Nav
 
Lux Angel Eyes
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      07-03-2011, 04:17 PM   #1
alpina527
Banned
United Kingdom
15
Rep
638
Posts

 
Drives: 2008 E92 M3 DCT JZB/FR
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: London, England

iTrader: (1)

Anyone got some good EQ settings for an E92 with Premium sounds and SWS-8 subs?

I have a 2008 E92 with premium sounds. I've just replaced the under seat subs with some SWS-8 subs and find them a bit boomy and lacking in mid bass.

These are the 4 ohm versions running through a 200w X 2 JL XD400 amp.

Can anyone out there suggest some good EQ settings.
Appreciate 0
      07-04-2011, 12:14 AM   #2
VP Electricity
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor
VP Electricity's Avatar
United_States
68
Rep
3,181
Posts


 
Drives: E91 XDrive
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: portland oregon

iTrader: (3)

SWS subs ARE boomy and lacking in midbass. We m,ake certain to let everyone know that before purchase. I don't think your amp has enough power to force an SWS woofer to play midbass, honestly. I couldn't get much out of them with 100x2 of Zapco DSP amp (with 10 parametric bands of EQ). I switched my own car to Jehnerts and prefer them, but I don't listen to rap/hip-hop or much techno.

I would try lowering the bass control a bit below center and then boosting 100 in the EQ a couple clicks above center.
__________________
Musicar Northwest - TOP 12 Retailer 2014
OE-Look Enclosures for F30/F80, F32/F82, and more!
Ask about our bolt-in audio upgrades for BMW.
Appreciate 0
      07-04-2011, 09:46 AM   #3
alpina527
Banned
United Kingdom
15
Rep
638
Posts

 
Drives: 2008 E92 M3 DCT JZB/FR
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: London, England

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by VP Electricity View Post
SWS subs ARE boomy and lacking in midbass. We m,ake certain to let everyone know that before purchase. I don't think your amp has enough power to force an SWS woofer to play midbass, honestly. I couldn't get much out of them with 100x2 of Zapco DSP amp (with 10 parametric bands of EQ). I switched my own car to Jehnerts and prefer them, but I don't listen to rap/hip-hop or much techno.

I would try lowering the bass control a bit below center and then boosting 100 in the EQ a couple clicks above center.
Thanks for that, I will try the tweaks.

Failing that, would I be better off re fitting the original premium mids and fitting standalone subs somewhere else?

I am not looking for ultimate deep bass, just a bit better than standard. I know of your 12" box for the rear, but that's not for me. I am looking for something small and compact that isn't too heavy and looks oem or is hidden somewhere.

Having bought the 4 channel amp, I would prefer to buy 2 small subs instead of one which would need a new one channel amp.
Appreciate 0
      07-04-2011, 12:32 PM   #4
jml
Captain
jml's Avatar
17
Rep
986
Posts

 
Drives: E90M3
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Austin, TX

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by alpina527 View Post
I have a 2008 E92 with premium sounds. I've just replaced the under seat subs with some SWS-8 subs and find them a bit boomy and lacking in mid bass.

These are the 4 ohm versions running through a 200w X 2 JL XD400 amp.

Can anyone out there suggest some good EQ settings.
Where are you crossing over the SWS subs? I used a 24dB/octave filter at 110Hz, and then boosted to 200Hz band on the eq to the max. Seems to fill in the hole left by SWS somewhat - not awesome. Female vocals don't really grab you by the balls, but I can live with that.

Name:  New Picture (3).jpg
Views: 865
Size:  312.3 KB

The green trace is the line level output from the sub channel on the EPS system. You can see where it roles out, giving you an idea where the midrange 4" speakers crossover points. The blue is an RTA trace from my system with the SWS subs (500w mono), but without any EQ tuning (except for what I was able to do on the sub channel through the 3Sixty to fill in bass holes).

You can see the mid-range hole from 100-200Hz. Before you get crazy and buy new subs, one thing you might consider is playing with the OEM subs a bit more. It could be that the stock tuning was conservative and that you could achieve more if you had control over relative volume (you own amp) and bass eq under 100Hz.

One issue I have with a second sub system is the weight it will add to the car. If that's not an issue for you, then that may be the best way to go in the long run.
Appreciate 0
      07-04-2011, 05:05 PM   #5
alpina527
Banned
United Kingdom
15
Rep
638
Posts

 
Drives: 2008 E92 M3 DCT JZB/FR
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: London, England

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jml View Post
Where are you crossing over the SWS subs? I used a 24dB/octave filter at 110Hz, and then boosted to 200Hz band on the eq to the max. Seems to fill in the hole left by SWS somewhat - not awesome. Female vocals don't really grab you by the balls, but I can live with that.

Attachment 548363

The green trace is the line level output from the sub channel on the EPS system. You can see where it roles out, giving you an idea where the midrange 4" speakers crossover points. The blue is an RTA trace from my system with the SWS subs (500w mono), but without any EQ tuning (except for what I was able to do on the sub channel through the 3Sixty to fill in bass holes).

You can see the mid-range hole from 100-200Hz. Before you get crazy and buy new subs, one thing you might consider is playing with the OEM subs a bit more. It could be that the stock tuning was conservative and that you could achieve more if you had control over relative volume (you own amp) and bass eq under 100Hz.

One issue I have with a second sub system is the weight it will add to the car. If that's not an issue for you, then that may be the best way to go in the long run.
Sorry, most of that went over my head.

Are you saying it's possible to get a good sound right through the range with my amp and subs?

I have the amp set with no filters. I thought the low pass filter had already worked before the loc?

Surely if I set a low pass filter I will lose the midrange completely.

Could you take a photo of your EQ settings please, or list them for me to try.

I am with you on the sub box etc. I would rather sort the sws subs out to keep things oem and save weight.
Appreciate 0
      07-04-2011, 05:32 PM   #6
VP Electricity
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor
VP Electricity's Avatar
United_States
68
Rep
3,181
Posts


 
Drives: E91 XDrive
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: portland oregon

iTrader: (3)

I too am very confused about why you would lowpass the underseat woofer at 110 @ 24 when you have a 4" midrange highpassed, per your chart, around 250.

alpina527, I agree that I would not use the amp's lowpass filter in your situation.

@ jml - Per your chart the EP lowpass F3 is around 250. I'm not clear if the blue line is acoustic (with a mike) or electric (how you describe the green line). But given how closely the blue and green lines are mapping each other up to 200 Hz, they have to be the same. These measurements do not resemble the measurements I recall in a 2011 M3 w/EP - I will have to see if I saved the screenshots.

Look, we are using somewhat absolute terms for a relative difference. Many people use the SWS and do not find them lacking. One of the contributing factors is what they listen to. Other folks can't stand their sound, and that too is a factor of what they listen to.

alpina527, what are you listening to?
__________________
Musicar Northwest - TOP 12 Retailer 2014
OE-Look Enclosures for F30/F80, F32/F82, and more!
Ask about our bolt-in audio upgrades for BMW.
Appreciate 0
      07-04-2011, 06:10 PM   #7
jml
Captain
jml's Avatar
17
Rep
986
Posts

 
Drives: E90M3
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Austin, TX

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by VP Electricity View Post
I too am very confused about why you would lowpass the underseat woofer at 110 @ 24 when you have a 4" midrange highpassed, per your chart, around 250.

alpina527, I agree that I would not use the amp's lowpass filter in your situation.

@ jml - Per your chart the EP lowpass F3 is around 250. I'm not clear if the blue line is acoustic (with a mike) or electric (how you describe the green line). But given how closely the blue and green lines are mapping each other up to 200 Hz, they have to be the same. These measurements do not resemble the measurements I recall in a 2011 M3 w/EP - I will have to see if I saved the screenshots.

Look, we are using somewhat absolute terms for a relative difference. Many people use the SWS and do not find them lacking. One of the contributing factors is what they listen to. Other folks can't stand their sound, and that too is a factor of what they listen to.

alpina527, what are you listening to?
Blue is via an RTA mic positioned at head height on the drivers side (E90). Green is direct from the LOC (I obviously messed around with the level to get it visible on the same graph).

Running the SWS over 110-120 sounded pretty bad to my ears. It's clearly not designed to maintain accuracy in that region. Lots of harmonic distortion. So I pushed the OEM 4" drivers to try to cover it by boosting 200Hz in the OEM eq. It sounds good enough that I'm not motivated to add more weight to the car.
Appreciate 0
      07-04-2011, 06:13 PM   #8
jml
Captain
jml's Avatar
17
Rep
986
Posts

 
Drives: E90M3
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Austin, TX

iTrader: (2)

Quote:
Originally Posted by alpina527 View Post
Sorry, most of that went over my head.

Are you saying it's possible to get a good sound right through the range with my amp and subs?

I have the amp set with no filters. I thought the low pass filter had already worked before the loc?

Surely if I set a low pass filter I will lose the midrange completely.

Could you take a photo of your EQ settings please, or list them for me to try.

I am with you on the sub box etc. I would rather sort the sws subs out to keep things oem and save weight.
If I were you I'd run a a low pass filter and see if the sound quality improves. The SWS is pretty terrible above 120, you will hear it. Try adding the low pass at 200 and gradually decrease to 100 and see if it improves things. Once you find something you like better, then add 200Hz back gradually with the OEM eq until you like it.
Appreciate 0
      07-31-2011, 05:07 PM   #9
alpina527
Banned
United Kingdom
15
Rep
638
Posts

 
Drives: 2008 E92 M3 DCT JZB/FR
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: London, England

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by jml View Post
If I were you I'd run a a low pass filter and see if the sound quality improves. The SWS is pretty terrible above 120, you will hear it. Try adding the low pass at 200 and gradually decrease to 100 and see if it improves things. Once you find something you like better, then add 200Hz back gradually with the OEM eq until you like it.
I'm still struggling to get it right. Could you post up a photo or rundown on your eq settings on your premium sounds with SWS-8s please
Appreciate 0
      08-01-2011, 08:54 PM   #10
808MGuy
Colonel
808MGuy's Avatar
49
Rep
2,287
Posts

 
Drives: 2009 E90 M3
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Oahu, Hawaii

iTrader: (3)

IMO, the SWS can be run as high as 140 with some creative EQing. That may not be available with the equipment the OP has. Also, it is true that the SWS lacks midbass and tends to be really boomy hence the need for some serious EQ adjustments. It serves its purpose if the boom is what you're looking for but if you're looking for clean midbass and a seamless transition from the mids to the midbass, you won't get it out of the SWS. There is a compromise here that needs to be made if you're unwilling to install a sub in the trunk. You're either going to get decent low end with little midbass and a slight gap in the frequency response (SWS) or you can get smooth response with a little less boom and not as much low frequency extension (there are a few choices that fit the description here but one of them is offered by VP which are the Jehnerts)
__________________
09 E90 M3 - Interlagos Blue / Black Novillo / Sycamore Anthracite / Eibach / HRE

Appreciate 0
      08-02-2011, 08:59 PM   #11
kmarei
Major General
kmarei's Avatar
Egypt
130
Rep
6,481
Posts

 
Drives: 1988 E30 M3 Evo II
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Reston, VA

iTrader: (33)

Garage List
Try running the low pass filter in the sws-8 between 80-100
That fixed the boominess on mine
But then you'll lose some of the mid bass
It's a tradeoff
__________________
This user has been banned from the 4 series forum because he doesn't sing its merits like the admins want us all to

Appreciate 0
      12-23-2012, 05:03 PM   #12
joelc73
Private First Class
1
Rep
109
Posts

 
Drives: 2010 E90
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: NY

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by 808MGuy View Post
IMO, the SWS can be run as high as 140 with some creative EQing. That may not be available with the equipment the OP has. Also, it is true that the SWS lacks midbass and tends to be really boomy hence the need for some serious EQ adjustments. It serves its purpose if the boom is what you're looking for but if you're looking for clean midbass and a seamless transition from the mids to the midbass, you won't get it out of the SWS. There is a compromise here that needs to be made if you're unwilling to install a sub in the trunk. You're either going to get decent low end with little midbass and a slight gap in the frequency response (SWS) or you can get smooth response with a little less boom and not as much low frequency extension (there are a few choices that fit the description here but one of them is offered by VP which are the Jehnerts)
What is the best way to creatively EQ SWS's? I recently replaced my Rainbow SLC's in the doors with Profi's and had my Zapco DC360.4 repaired and updated with new firmware. So I'm sort of starting from scratch with the tuning of the car.

I spent some time yesterday working on getting the EQ right but I'm struggling. The only way I can get the SWS to sound decent is to drop the x'overs to 80 hz. I have the doors set at 100 though... so that leaves a big hole.

I'm curious how others are EQ's w/ SWS's.

Thanks!
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:06 AM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST