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      04-01-2011, 01:48 AM   #45
ltw 11
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Pinholes and other voids are normal FLAWS in various composite manufacturing processes, which I beleive Vortesner's is vartm. Let me restate, pinholes represent certain goodies that coudl not escape quickly enough and are thus weaknesses in the part and dont look nice on a class A surface.

They are "normal' if that is what one typically only EVER sees on parts. From the MFG's perspective, it may be an acceptable flaw but it is stilla flaw and just represents weakness, even if it is weakness between or within a few fibers in a 2 or 3 k strand....but- what if there are more serious voids in between plies...? makes you think what else is going on that the you cant see.

If Vorsteiner spent more time making the part "flawless" then they will be doing about the same techniques only changing a very small amount of what it is they are doing but that change in technique should not result in justifying passing the cost in $$ to the customer when this change should be done on their own nickel. It's part of the MFG process! They know what they're doing btw. they dont have to change either because the parts are passing throught their QC and QA and people still buy their parts.



Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan@candccollision.com View Post
I get you. But in reality what the buyer of one of this kits could really be upset about is that it costs alot of money to install and sure part of it is to clean it up and make it look flawless. Would/could it cost them a little less with their installer if vorsteiner spent alot more time to make the raw product flawless? Sure. But then Vorsteiner would probably sell it for even more because they have even more invested into the production of the kit.

Again this is not a kit that is sold to the retail market. It is only sold and shipped to trusted partners to eliminate the issue you mentioned above(fake/counterfeit) It is then that shops duty to properly prep, paint and install the kit. The liability at that point is on the shop. In my opinion they improperly installed the sidemarker. They leaked photos of raw parts and potentially tarnished the reputation of their partner. In my opinion this thread should be aimed at the install shop for not doing a quality job and for not being responsible to their business partner.
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      04-01-2011, 12:29 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by RaceFab View Post
For 24k you could have a 1 off kit made by MetalCrafters or Aria group...if you dont know who they are, google them...make vorsteiner or these other company and shops look like minor leaguers.
Gaffoglio Family Metalcrafters certainly would not make a custom 11-pc kit for anything close to $24,000, maybe $124,000. same goes for Aria Group, I actually have a call into them to see what they would charge for something like this because i always get requests for one of widebody work. And i have to disagree with their work making vorsteiner and other shops look like minor leaguers. I can think of several project cars out there including the Vorsteiner GTRS3 that would be an asset to either of those companies porfolio
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      04-01-2011, 12:30 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by Eugene-TAIWAN View Post
I'm sorry I don't understand your point?

A) arkym has poor quality

B) Vorsteiner has poor fitment but has is OK because it has never cracked

C) all bodykits should have poor fitment?

I never said Vorsteiner has poor fitment, and I never said that all bodykits should have poor fitment. My point was that Arkym is not the knight in shining armor that you are making them out to be
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      04-01-2011, 12:40 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ltw 11 View Post
Pinholes and other voids are normal FLAWS in various composite manufacturing processes, which I beleive Vortesner's is vartm. Let me restate, pinholes represent certain goodies that coudl not escape quickly enough and are thus weaknesses in the part and dont look nice on a class A surface.

They are "normal' if that is what one typically only EVER sees on parts. From the MFG's perspective, it may be an acceptable flaw but it is stilla flaw and just represents weakness, even if it is weakness between or within a few fibers in a 2 or 3 k strand....but- what if there are more serious voids in between plies...? makes you think what else is going on that the you cant see.

If Vorsteiner spent more time making the part "flawless" then they will be doing about the same techniques only changing a very small amount of what it is they are doing but that change in technique should not result in justifying passing the cost in $$ to the customer when this change should be done on their own nickel. It's part of the MFG process! They know what they're doing btw. they dont have to change either because the parts are passing throught their QC and QA and people still buy their parts.
Keep in mind that the pinholes shown in this thread could very well just be solvent popping within the primer coating having nothing to do with the composites. I know first hand that vorsteiner does a tremendous amount of constant redevelopment to offer the best product at a competitive price. They will take this issue (believe it or not even a small issue that someone discusses directly with them in person or over the phone) and adjust accordingly. Smearing someone on the world wide web typically is not the way you normally accomplish correcting what i consider to be fairly normal, installer correctable flaw.

Last edited by nathan@cc; 04-01-2011 at 12:50 PM.
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      04-01-2011, 02:16 PM   #49
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^Nathan, just curious why are you defending Vorsteiner? Do you represent them? Are you a vendor? More than half the people here have agreed that for $24,000 for a body kit that has defects, etc is ridiculous. I'm still surprised that Vorsteiner hasn't contacted the OP or even address this thread.
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      04-01-2011, 02:24 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chungdae View Post
^Nathan, just curious why are you defending Vorsteiner? Do you represent them? Are you a vendor? More than half the people here have agreed that for $24,000 for a body kit that has defects, etc is ridiculous. I'm still surprised that Vorsteiner hasn't contacted the OP or even address this thread.
probably because they are the offical installer of the kit
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      04-01-2011, 02:34 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chungdae View Post
^Nathan, just curious why are you defending Vorsteiner? Do you represent them? Are you a vendor? More than half the people here have agreed that for $24,000 for a body kit that has defects, etc is ridiculous. I'm still surprised that Vorsteiner hasn't contacted the OP or even address this thread.
I explain very clearly in my earlier posts.
"You left out the testimonials from other vorsteiner customers, do they count. And for the record i have no incentive or motive to protect Vorsteiner. I think their products are the best in the market otherwise i wouldnt put my signature on them. You may think that i want to protect a potential revenue stream that i get from vorsteiner installs?? Wrong I probably lose money on every paint/install I do because everyone blows their wad buying these parts and then they are too cheap to pay me whats reasonable. I am a proud business owner and i hate to see another hard working business get smeared by a bunch of bs. I would hope that if anyone ever tried to badmouth my company my customers and other vendors would step up to protect me as well."

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      04-01-2011, 03:05 PM   #52
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LOL im not surprise. i have mentioned several times that VORSTEINER products are the worst company out there....

and they claim that they are using autoclave? BS... so freakin BS...

although if i was given a vors HOOD... ok ill take it... hahahahaha lol the only reason is, is that the that hood is the best looking hood out for our cars... but i would never buy it... maybe for $500... LOL hahahahaha
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      04-01-2011, 03:15 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan@candccollision.com View Post
I explain very clearly in my earlier posts.
"You left out the testimonials from other vorsteiner customers, do they count. And for the record i have no incentive or motive to protect Vorsteiner. I think their products are the best in the market otherwise i wouldnt put my signature on them. You may think that i want to protect a potential revenue stream that i get from vorsteiner installs?? Wrong I probably lose money on every paint/install I do because everyone blows their wad buying these parts and then they are too cheap to pay me whats reasonable. I am a proud business owner and i hate to see another hard working business get smeared by a bunch of bs. I would hope that if anyone ever tried to badmouth my company my customers and other vendors would step up to protect me as well."

I agree with you but for 24k they better make sure that shit fits perfectly like oem... yes we are actually cheap ass when it comes to buying car parts, only because to begin with its a piece of shit.....

but to be honest i dont mind spending as well just make sure i see the quality is made out of...

When i had my S2000 i bought a 2k hood because it was worth it. fitment is OEM... but when you think about it it was made by ASM... TOP NOTCH COMPANY FROM JAPAN yes.... but VORSTEINER NO WHERE CLOSE.

Oh also i had my ASM hood and Mugen wing painted by you guys... Yes it might be a little pricey compare to othes BUT when it comes to paint THERE IS NO OTHERS LIKE YOU GUYS... AND YES I WILL COME BACK TO YOU GUYS IF I WANT SOMETHING TO GET PAINTED.


people bad mouth cause well

1. they do shitty jobs and cost an arm and a leg AND THEY LIE ABOUT BEING CARBON... 100% HAHAHA THATS FUNNY...

2. customer service sucks (OH DONT GET ME START ON VORSTEINER CUSTOMER SERVICE)
well i guess thats about it.

THIS IS JUST MY EXPERIENCE.... BUT ONE IS GOOD ENOUGH to bad mouth when they are not doing anything to fix the problem... CUSTOMER SERVICE WISE.. THATS ANOTHER STORY... THEY NEED TO GO BACK ON HOW OR WHAT CUSTOMER SERVICE IS...

just because i look like your 18 they will threat you like they know it all and they are the best..
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      04-01-2011, 03:51 PM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean05 View Post
I agree with you but for 24k they better make sure that shit fits perfectly like oem... yes we are actually cheap ass when it comes to buying car parts, only because to begin with its a piece of shit.....

but to be honest i dont mind spending as well just make sure i see the quality is made out of...

When i had my S2000 i bought a 2k hood because it was worth it. fitment is OEM... but when you think about it it was made by ASM... TOP NOTCH COMPANY FROM JAPAN yes.... but VORSTEINER NO WHERE CLOSE.

Oh also i had my ASM hood and Mugen wing painted by you guys... Yes it might be a little pricey compare to othes BUT when it comes to paint THERE IS NO OTHERS LIKE YOU GUYS... AND YES I WILL COME BACK TO YOU GUYS IF I WANT SOMETHING TO GET PAINTED.


people bad mouth cause well

1. they do shitty jobs and cost an arm and a leg AND THEY LIE ABOUT BEING CARBON... 100% HAHAHA THATS FUNNY...

2. customer service sucks (OH DONT GET ME START ON VORSTEINER CUSTOMER SERVICE)
well i guess thats about it.

THIS IS JUST MY EXPERIENCE.... BUT ONE IS GOOD ENOUGH to bad mouth when they are not doing anything to fix the problem... CUSTOMER SERVICE WISE.. THATS ANOTHER STORY... THEY NEED TO GO BACK ON HOW OR WHAT CUSTOMER SERVICE IS...

just because i look like your 18 they will threat you like they know it all and they are the best..
I appreciate your kind words about my quality. I wont touch the rest of your comment about their service because clearly this is your opinion based on your experience and it certainly is not my job to defend their customer service with you or anyone else especially when i was not present during those conversations. Maybe at some point they will post i dont know if they ever do or not?
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      04-01-2011, 04:18 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nathan@candccollision.com View Post
I appreciate your kind words about my quality. I wont touch the rest of your comment about their service because clearly this is your opinion based on your experience and it certainly is not my job to defend their customer service with you or anyone else especially when i was not present during those conversations. Maybe at some point they will post i dont know if they ever do or not?
I respect that

I also hope that they would post and defend their product, apparently NO they leave us hanging, hey i cant blame them... they are claiming something that is not true anyways. 100% CF BS I SAY 10% is cf... LOL
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      04-01-2011, 05:09 PM   #56
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If you're just joining us for today's presentation of "Fishy Drama From Vorsteiner Competitor," We are live with a sketchy competitor who registered an account last week and has 6 posts to his name. Amusingly enough, people are actually buying it!

Also in the studio today, we have a professional installer who has been in business for decades, who states that Vorsteiner's quality is top-notch and the claims in this thread are ridiculous. We also have numerous companies with over 20 years of combined experience, who sell not only vorsteiner but their competitors' products, too, confirming the tip-top quality of Vorsteiner products.

We go now to more people being mislead by false claims, despite thousands of satisfied customers worldwide. Back to you in the studio, Jerry.

Last edited by SV Concepts; 04-01-2011 at 05:36 PM.
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      04-01-2011, 05:12 PM   #57
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$24,000 includes:
-Hood
-Trunk
-Front Bumper
-Rear Bumper
-All 4 Fenders
-Side Skirts
-3pc wheels, 20x12" Rear Wheels
-Highly expensive tires to fit the wheels above

....The body kit alone is nowhere near $24K.

Do not believe the misinformation being presented to you here. I challenge any of you to come to our shop and look at the Vorsteiner products on display - feel them with your own 2 hands


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      04-01-2011, 05:31 PM   #58
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It gets better! I just realized. In the picture where the "side grills do not fit" (because they aren't even pushed in), you can see the car is painted - and - what? The finish is perfect.

Even in his own photos he reveals that the 'pin holes' and 'bad texture' are non-issues. The kit looks flawless once installed.
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      04-02-2011, 08:43 AM   #59
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Originally Posted by Jlevi SW View Post
It gets better! I just realized. In the picture where the "side grills do not fit" (because they aren't even pushed in), you can see the car is painted - and - what? The finish is perfect.

Even in his own photos he reveals that the 'pin holes' and 'bad texture' are non-issues. The kit looks flawless once installed.
Pictures of the finished car?
Interested to see.
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      04-02-2011, 09:47 AM   #60
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Originally Posted by inandout View Post
Pictures of the finished car?
Interested to see.
look on the web they are out there. Its the only gloss alpine white vorsteiner widebody out there. I think there are pictures of it at the Shanghai auto show or something
Here are a few



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      04-02-2011, 10:09 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by Jlevi SW View Post
5 posts, a car Vorsteiner doesn't know about (must be an international customer), broken english, and no record of correspondence to Vorsteiner (wouldn't you contact them first to ask for help installing?).... I smell something fishy. Perhaps someone out there saw the factory tour post, saw a decline in sales, and set out to get retribution.

JL





Don't believe the lies.
For some reason I feel it so be offensive that you think the OP is full of shit just because of the number of posts he has. I bet you wouldnt care how many posts he had if he wanted to buy something from you.

..."Now hear this....JLEVI SW will only conduct business with forum members that have over 3000+ posts."
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      04-02-2011, 11:24 AM   #62
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wow, lots of drama. I would not accept that workmanship after dishing out 24 large, thats for sure
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      04-02-2011, 01:30 PM   #63
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Threads gone on long enough. Doesn't anyone think it's odd that the person that bought the kit's not even the one complaining or even once chimed in. Instead it's a so called "friend" with no other intest but to bash a manufacturer? Who would put down that kind of cash via mail order? Wouldn't you want to see what your buying up front? Seriously ....

Kits are made to be finished, which includes filling, priming, sanding several times to perfection & painting. You don't just slap them on the car. I've seen new fenders right from the manufacture that need putty. It's a kit -

I'm guessing the person that bought the kit knows this -

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      04-02-2011, 02:30 PM   #64
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Lol this thread has gone on long enough. I second that.

I will also offer the same as Jlevi:

"Do not believe the misinformation being presented to you here. I challenge any of you to come to our shop and look at the Vorsteiner products on display - feel them with your own 2 hands"

We are in So Cal and would be happy to let you guys check out the Vorsteiner products we have in stock. There is no defective product anywhere.

I guess this is the internet....u get the good info, you get the bad info and you get the useless info
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      04-02-2011, 02:45 PM   #65
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Since many of you are not close to stop by the Supreme Power showroom/installation facility here are some pics for you guys showing the products and quality.

Enjoy



















[IMG]http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj283/supremepowerparts
/IMG_211911111_.jpg[/IMG]





































































































































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      04-02-2011, 07:47 PM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyoshi71 View Post
For some reason I feel it so be offensive that you think the OP is full of shit just because of the number of posts he has. I bet you wouldnt care how many posts he had if he wanted to buy something from you.

..."Now hear this....JLEVI SW will only conduct business with forum members that have over 3000+ posts."
hahahah good one....
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