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      03-25-2011, 08:27 AM   #1
spdu4ea
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Proof of OE/Gintani dyno manipulation

A spin off of this thread: http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=504140


This is a serious accusation and one that I do not make lightly, but there is no doubt in my mind that this is Gintani/OE dyno manipulation and it should be brought to light. Here are some quick mathematical comparisons/analysis with other tuners to illustrate how extremely unlikely a flat percentage increase in power across the board is:

Active Autowerke:



rpm % gain
2500 12.0%
3000 11.1%
3500 6.8%
4000 7.9%
4500 7.1%
5000 4.3%
5500 8.0%
6000 11.1%
6500 12.3%
7000 6.9%
7500 6.6%
8000 9.0%



GIAC (tune+filter):



rpm % gain
2500 8.2%
3000 10.5%
3500 4.0%
4000 3.7%
4500 4.9%
5000 5.9%
5500 5.7%
6000 6.7%
6500 5.8%
7000 6.3%
7500 5.2%
8000 6.0%



Dinan (no graph)

6000 3.3%
8000 1.8%



ESS:



rpm % gain
2500 5.3%
3000 5.5%
3500 4.5%
4000 3.2%
4500 2.5%
5000 3.2%
5500 5.7%
6000 8.8%
6500 5.5%
7000 5.4%
7500 4.9%
8000 5.2%



OE*:



rpm % gain
2500
3000
3500 12.0%
4000 10.2%
4500 10.3%
5000 10.3%
5500 10.3%
6000 10.2%
6500 10.5%
7000 10.6%
7500 10.3%
8000 10.2%






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Last edited by spdu4ea; 03-25-2011 at 11:59 AM. Reason: removed Evolve from comparison per their request
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      03-25-2011, 08:30 AM   #2
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Mike at Powerchip's own analysis:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike@Powerchip View Post
Just analyized the results and according to the data, it seems as if a dyno variable was modified inbetween the two runs which produced an inaccurate gain.

The first two graphs are cars that Jeremy dyno tuned himself from our Texas trip. You can see how the gain on the bottom end of the OP's new dyno is artificial.

Furthermore, the bottom graph shows the deviation. You can see that the third graph has an extremely low deviation and that further supports the presumption that a correction factor was applied, or an input variable was changed - causing the skew of the entire curve upward, instead of reflecting actual power related gains.

You can see the first two graphs have trouble with gain between 4000 and 5500, and then have a sizable gain through the midrange and top end. You can see the large gap inbetween the two curves on the third gap, which is not representative to how an M3 responds to tunes in that area. Also notable is that the largest increase in horsepower is between 4000 and 5500 RPM, which conflicts with the previous two cars that achieve their highest gain at later RPMs, and have the lowest gain at lower RPM's. The only thing that can explain this is an unwarranted correction to the graph to skew the results.


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      03-25-2011, 08:38 AM   #3
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      03-25-2011, 08:40 AM   #4
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I have seen plenty plenty dyno graphs as well as had my own cars dynod. You will never ever get a linear gain like the OE/Gintani one is showing. They fucked with the dyno settings. Plain and simple.

From what i have read about OE/Gintani being involved in lawsuits, Jeremy stealing PC files etc. They dont seem like anyone I would like to do business with. ESS/AA FTMFW

Last edited by M3_FTW; 03-25-2011 at 08:45 AM.
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      03-25-2011, 09:30 AM   #5
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hmmm very intersting indeed, thanks for the information. Is the same Gintani that does the exhausts and forced induction stuff??
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      03-25-2011, 09:37 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e92Mjunky View Post
hmmm very intersting indeed, thanks for the information. Is the same Gintani that does the exhausts and forced induction stuff??
Yes same Gintani. But I feel like their exhausts are solid, and have shown gains on various dynos.
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      03-25-2011, 09:38 AM   #7
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here we go again!
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      03-25-2011, 09:42 AM   #8
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      03-25-2011, 09:44 AM   #9
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Oh, boy here goes my afternoon. Subscribed.
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      03-25-2011, 09:48 AM   #10
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I'm guessing with a paying sponsor and the fanboys it won't take long before this thread get's locked
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      03-25-2011, 09:54 AM   #11
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Here we go again... Jeremy, OE Tuning, Alex, Gintani, Sticky, Powerchip, G-Power, et al... In Before the LOCK..

The West Coast, with all it's sunshine, is just so shady.

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      03-25-2011, 09:56 AM   #12
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If that happens, I will consider this forum "for entertainment purposes only". I know this will hurt independent tuners universally but this is about information and transparency. I hope the truth comes out.
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      03-25-2011, 10:00 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Draff1 View Post
If that happens, I will consider this forum "for entertainment purposes only". I know this will hurt independent tuners universally but this is about information and transparency. I hope the truth comes out.
It'll help those who are really making quality products.
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      03-25-2011, 10:02 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J08M3 View Post


I'm guessing with a paying sponsor and the fanboys it won't take long before this thread get's locked
It's only 7:48 in Cali. The Fanboy Marching Band will be here soon enough.
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      03-25-2011, 10:09 AM   #15
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It's important for the forum for the truth to come out. Either forum users are paying money to a sponsor and getting a great tune, or forum members being cheated out of their money on a bogus scam. I don't know which it is, but for the sake of the bimmerpost community it should be brought to light.
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      03-25-2011, 10:11 AM   #16
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Oh yea..this is gonna be good lol
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      03-25-2011, 10:23 AM   #17
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since everyone else is saying it...
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      03-25-2011, 10:26 AM   #18
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Quote:
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since everyone else is saying it...
Yeah but you have a sweet video to go along with it
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      03-25-2011, 10:48 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyoshi71 View Post
It's only 7:48 in Cali. The Fanboy Marching Band will be here soon enough.
I hear the trumpets and the bass...
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      03-25-2011, 10:57 AM   #20
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For those complaining that the comparison wasn't fair because it wasn't stock vs tune...



RPM Stk OE rpm % gain
2500
3000
3500 165 168 3500 1.8%
4000 194 203 4000 4.6%
4500 217 227 4500 4.6%
5000 240 252 5000 5.0%
5500 262 275 5500 5.0%
6000 286 299 6000 4.5%
6500 305 320 6500 4.9%
7000 332 348 7000 4.8%
7500 338 355 7500 5.0%
8000 352 369 8000 4.8%


Stock vs OE on a dynojet:



speed % gain
55 9.9%
60 9.0%
65 6.4%
70 6.5%
75 8.3%
80 6.1%
85 5.7%
90 5.1%
95 4.9%
100 5.2%
105 4.4%
110 3.4%
115 1.7%

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      03-25-2011, 10:57 AM   #21
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Wrong ..... Just plain wrong .... All the effort that gets put in to deceive people why don't they just steer that effort to actually bringing a product that works .....
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      03-25-2011, 11:00 AM   #22
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