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      07-08-2010, 11:19 PM   #1
H Bomb
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Escort Passport Redline A++

not sure if anyone has used one of these yet but man this thing is awesome

i had there old 8500 model which was great but i sold it when i sold my last M but now needed a new one. i thought of getting a V1 but i had great luck with the Passport so looked into getting another but saw they now make 2 new ones the Redline and the 9500 model. i really didn't feel the need for all the camera stuff and GPS and all that as the redline focused more on straight up distance and all that

holy shit can this thing detect far away. in the city or subs forget it the thing is so sensitive you will see the cop a couple minutes later as it is picking up the radar band blocks away or on other side of town. highway this thing has serious mile range. i was doing 90 and it went off ka and i slammed my brakes thinking i would just make it. well 45sec goes by and it is still going off i am like wtf are they all over the place. then he goes by. it does hills very well too and where i think the 8500 from behind lacked a strong signal this thing is very strong picking up a cop coming up from behind as long as you mount it correctly etc

anyone who doesn't need the fancy GPS stuff and just wants a super strong detector the Redline is no joke hands down
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      07-09-2010, 03:47 AM   #2
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Yea I read a review on it the other day. Seems a bit pricy 500 though.
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      07-09-2010, 10:02 AM   #3
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Compared to the Valentine 1 it is more sensitive, especially on certain Ka bands. This is impressive. However, it's ramp-up and slow response ruin it. Escort could potentially solve the ramp-up, probably with a software upgrade you can do yourself. Probably the slow response too. What makes this lack of response time bad is the growing use of quick trigger by LEOs. The V1 beats all with its ramp-up and response. Couple this with the arrows and kick-ass laser detection and IMHO the V1 is still the best.

If they still offered the Bel STi-R this would be one to get. The STi-R plus (add GPS) is still offered in Europe. In fact the Redline is the same platform. However, the STi-R had Ka band segmentation which when combined with the spec mode (that the Redline also has) turns this thing into the fastest responding detector and the best to defeat Q/T tactics. Since the Redline is essentially the same electronics as the STi-R there is really no reason that it too cannot have Ka band segmentation. If they did this, fixed ramp-up and added a remote display capability then this would be the V1 rival. You wouldn't have the V1 arrows, but you would get greater sensitivity and stealth (i.e. undetectable by RDDs). BTW, there is talk of Bel bringing the STi-R plus to the US. (Escort owns Bel now so sometimes you'll here speak of "Belscort".)


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      07-09-2010, 02:29 PM   #4
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sorry i am a newb what do you mean ramp up and slow response?? this redline is really fast picking up the radar and going off to warn you

also it says it has full detection so it is undetectable and it has laser detection also

i looked at all these options before buying it, i had always heard about the V1 but thought that they haven't changed anything on the V1 in years so thought the Redline was the way to go. guess i may have been wrong

thanks for all the info

Quote:
Originally Posted by ersin View Post
Compared to the Valentine 1 it is more sensitive, especially on certain Ka bands. This is impressive. However, it's ramp-up and slow response ruin it. Escort could potentially solve the ramp-up, probably with a software upgrade you can do yourself. Probably the slow response too. What makes this lack of response time bad is the growing use of quick trigger by LEOs. The V1 beats all with its ramp-up and response. Couple this with the arrows and kick-ass laser detection and IMHO the V1 is still the best.

If they still offered the Bel STi-R this would be one to get. The STi-R plus (add GPS) is still offered in Europe. In fact the Redline is the same platform. However, the STi-R had Ka band segmentation which when combined with the spec mode (that the Redline also has) turns this thing into the fastest responding detector and the best to defeat Q/T tactics. Since the Redline is essentially the same electronics as the STi-R there is really no reason that it too cannot have Ka band segmentation. If they did this, fixed ramp-up and added a remote display capability then this would be the V1 rival. You wouldn't have the V1 arrows, but you would get greater sensitivity and stealth (i.e. undetectable by RDDs). BTW, there is talk of Bel bringing the STi-R plus to the US. (Escort owns Bel now so sometimes you'll here speak of "Belscort".)


Cheers.
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      07-09-2010, 07:06 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H Bomb View Post
sorry i am a newb what do you mean ramp up and slow response?? this redline is really fast picking up the radar and going off to warn you

also it says it has full detection so it is undetectable and it has laser detection also

i looked at all these options before buying it, i had always heard about the V1 but thought that they haven't changed anything on the V1 in years so thought the Redline was the way to go. guess i may have been wrong

thanks for all the info
Ok, first ramp up:
--------------------
When you come upon a radar bogey, the further you are the less the signal strength. Detectors measure the signal strength and the urgency of the alert (the number of "bars" shown and the intensity/frequency of warning sound) should ideally be directly related to the distance between you and the source. A number of factors control the signal strength other than distance though so the ideal won't be realized all the time.

The Redline doesn't correlate the strength with it's alert urgency very well. It's closer to on/off than a linear indication of strength. This is why you thought there was an LEO right around the corner for 45 seconds. The V1 "ramps up" the urgency much more linearly and gives you more information about where the bogey might be this way. You still need to correlate for yourself the strength indicators with distance given varying terrain, traffic, and radar band. But it's part of the learning experience.

Next, response time:
------------------------
LEOs are using a technique that new radar gun technology is giving them. It's called quick trigger, or just QT. The radar operator blips the transmit button for a very short while and the radar sends out EM for a very short period of time, typically on the order of a only a couple or so tenths of a second. That's all the time the gun needs to get a measurement. Most of the time the radar is not transmitting so the radar detector is silent. This is a technique used by LEOs to defeat detectors. This is where response time of the detector comes in.

Most detectors will miss a short, one or two tenth of second burst. The V1 won't because it has the shortest response time. To understand why you need to know that the detector scans the range of frequencies that are used by radar. Scanning faster gives greater ability to pick up these short QTs. But the faster you scan the more sensitivity you lose. You need a good design to start with to be able to pick up QT without losing sensitivity. Quality control in making the detector also comes into play.

There is another way to help response time. The X-band (not used much anymore) and K-band radars use only a very small bandwidth of frequencies. There's no problem scanning them. But the Ka-band that newer radar guns are using is much wider. Thank the FCC. This means more spectrum to scan to be able to pick up every brand and model of radar gun out there. But there are basically a handful of different models of gun out there in the wild. If you happen to know what frequencies to scan then you only need to scan for these specific handful of frequencies in your detector. By doing so you save time in scanning and gain better response time for alerts.

The STi-R (which is the "Remote" version of the STi) has partitioned off the Ka band into several regions. You can turn each of the regions on or off. They call this Ka-band segmentation. By turning off the bands that you don't need the detector can save time in scanning and get better response time. In fact, in measurements, the STi-R has better response than the V1 when this feature is used.

But wait. How do you know what frequencies to tell your detector to monitor? You would need to know which brand and model of radar gun that you will likely encounter and the guns characteristics, i.e. operating frequency. Well, there is another feature of the STi-R (that's also happens to be available on other Belscort detectors but not the V1) called spec mode. This feature displays the frequency of the bogey when your speed is being measured. Note this info as you're driving. After a while you will build up a database of frequencies. Then go into the STi-R setup and selectively turn off those segments that you don't need. Extremely cool if you happen to be a geek. For most of us other cool folks though we wouldn't want to play with it. I guess that's why Beltronics no longer offers the STi-R anymore. That and the fact that professional installation is needed probably pushed sales too low for them.

More info:
-----------
There's more to be said if you've read this far. I won't go into it here, this post is already too long. Look up POP and instant-on (IO). They are related to QT but I feel QT is the greater threat. This forum and this group have some good people and information for you.

The Redline is essentially an STi-R detector head, control unit, display, speaker and controls all packaged into one case. But the Redline doesn't have the band segmentation feature. Too bad.

It gets better. The Escort 9500ci also happens to be the same STi-R platform but with the addition of GPS and a laser jammer. Guess what? No band segmentation .

OTOH, the Redline, 9500ci, STi driver and STi-R are the only undetectable detectors. This is important if you're a commercial driver or drive in Virginia, DC or on military bases.

ALL detectors sold today have "full protection" if you what you mean by that is the ability to just detect the three radar bands (X, K and Ka) and laser. To me "full protection" means having a V1 mounted high on the windshield, an STi-R with the head mounted in the grill, a quad head HP Laser Interceptor jammer (about $2500 for this BTW), a GPS enabled speed and red light camera database with automated real time update from other users (like trapster but done automatically from detector alerts, e.g. this new app works with iPhone and Android) that displays on the iDrive nav screen, a CB with and OEM-like installation, a decent antenna mounted high on the vehicle but that would be invisible, a digital-capable, trunk-tracking police scanner that alerts on vehicle repeater frequencies, a HAM radio, and a passenger with binoculars who is always looking out for the cops. I'll take fries with that, thank you.

The V1 has been updated over the years. At least updated that which counts, which is the internals and software. The case has stayed the same so many people think they haven't kept up with the state of the art. I will say that considering the whole package, the V1 still performs the best. There may be an area or two where one detector or another will beat its performance. But when you add in the V1 arrows and bogey counter then nothing comes close to matching the V1 for radar and laser situational awareness.

Furthermore, software updates and tune-ups are available from Valentine 1. Other high end detectors will do this too. But when the hardware changes you can send your old V1 in and get a new one at a discounted price.

The Redline is very much like the V1 in its philosophy: a no-frills, high-performing radar and laser situational awareness countermeasures device. It's like a bare bones sports car -- requires a learning curve to get all that it has to offer out of it, no fancy frills, a bit high-strung and makes no apologies at being a little hard to live with. Yet when asked to perform it delivers.

All in all, the Redline is an exceptional performer. It has a few advantages over the V1 but in my opinion, considering the whole package, the V1 is still the king. Now if they put a little effort into the Redline it has the potential to be the better detector. Don't lose hope. I'm pretty sure the corrections can be made with software. And even if not, you still have damn good protection with the Redline.


Cheers.
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      07-10-2010, 03:27 AM   #6
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wow thank you for all that info very much appreciated. you know your shit man. damn the "full protection" you talk about i want lol. now that is a set up right there

thanks again. i have been reading more in the manual on the redline and finding more things in there that are new to me etc like the spec mode you spoke of the redline has that, which i didn't know about

thanks again, i am gonna stick with the redline for now but i still have a second vehicle my truck for the races so i may get a V1 as well and then switch off btw the two and see which i like better. when i am late to a race i speed sometimes in the big truck so it will come in handy

H
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      07-11-2010, 01:29 AM   #7
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found a good review on the Redline. got good marks

http://www.radarbusters.com/radar-de...ardetector.cfm
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