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      02-18-2010, 02:30 PM   #1
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Harness

Any one make a harness for our car yet?
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      02-18-2010, 03:16 PM   #2
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What do you mean "for our car"? Racing harnesses are what they are. They're universal. or are you referring to a harness bar?
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      02-18-2010, 03:37 PM   #3
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I think that you are looking for one of these:
http://www.schrothracing.com/store/T...ick-fit/qf-bmw
or one of these
http://www.schrothracing.com/store/T...it-pro/qfp-bmw

Unfortunately, they do not yet make them for the E90 or E92 M3's. I didn't feel a real need for one of these at The Glen on PS2's, but they would have been appreciated at Summit Point. This year I'll be running a 6pt restraint in my E46 track car. I can't wait
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      02-18-2010, 06:09 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BRDHNTR View Post
I think that you are looking for one of these:
http://www.schrothracing.com/store/T...ick-fit/qf-bmw
or one of these
http://www.schrothracing.com/store/T...it-pro/qfp-bmw

Unfortunately, they do not yet make them for the E90 or E92 M3's. I didn't feel a real need for one of these at The Glen on PS2's, but they would have been appreciated at Summit Point. This year I'll be running a 6pt restraint in my E46 track car. I can't wait
Will they fit? Supposedly schroth has not tested the seats yet, and I dont think they ever will.
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      02-18-2010, 06:35 PM   #5
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Update

Spoke with Schroth, they have tested the seats development for the belts has gone to germany.
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      02-19-2010, 02:18 AM   #6
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finally, I remember we've all been waiting since early 08' and 335 guys even longer
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      02-19-2010, 04:25 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3Captain View Post
Spoke with Schroth, they have tested the seats development for the belts has gone to germany.
So, is it coming out at some point?
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      02-19-2010, 07:16 PM   #8
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When and if someone does develop and release it to the general public, it will be a real help with this car. The sholder/lab belt just does not keep you planted in the seat. My left knee and leg was almost bruised at the end of the day.
vz
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      02-19-2010, 08:03 PM   #9
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They are coming this spring.
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      02-21-2010, 11:49 PM   #10
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The biggest hurdle was getting the technical data during seat testing. We should have some belts real soon.
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      02-27-2010, 02:06 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by von_zoom View Post
When and if someone does develop and release it to the general public, it will be a real help with this car. The sholder/lab belt just does not keep you planted in the seat. My left knee and leg was almost bruised at the end of the day.
vz
I use a CG lock right now, helps keep your bottom planted, but your torso still slides around.
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      02-27-2010, 04:25 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jml View Post
They are coming this spring.
Is this confirmed? That would be great. I had the Schroth Quick Fit harness for my E46 and loved it. Could make it fit the E90 mainly because BMW changed the buckle size.
I also have the CG Lock now. It is better than the stock belt but it is no harness.

Thanks.
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      03-01-2010, 11:14 PM   #13
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Personally, I prefer a real racing harness with an anti-sub belt. The ones linked above don't work all that well as there are too many adjustment points and usualy need to stay installed. But with a racing harness, you can just install the clip-in eye bolts on place of your eisting seat/belt mounts and take the harness in/out as needed. Because of the way the headrests are designed, I recommend a "Y" shoulder belt The only issue I foresee is mounting the sub belt. Might need to cut a slit in the webbing of the pull-out section on the front of the seat
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      03-01-2010, 11:39 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3V8Driver View Post
Personally, I prefer a real racing harness with an anti-sub belt. The ones linked above don't work all that well as there are too many adjustment points and usualy need to stay installed. But with a racing harness, you can just install the clip-in eye bolts on place of your eisting seat/belt mounts and take the harness in/out as needed. Because of the way the headrests are designed, I recommend a "Y" shoulder belt The only issue I foresee is mounting the sub belt. Might need to cut a slit in the webbing of the pull-out section on the front of the seat
No offense, but you don't know what your talking about. Be very careful about "recommending" safety solutions unless you have specific knowledge.
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      03-02-2010, 10:20 PM   #15
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Quote:
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No offense, but you don't know what your talking about. Be very careful about "recommending" safety solutions unless you have specific knowledge.
I know exactly what I'm talking about. I've used and sold harnesses for many years. Both the DOT styles linked above and real racing harnesses have their pros and cons, but the DOT doesn't take into account racing activities when stipulating what is acceptable. I have used all these styles of belts and find that rigging your car to use racing harnesses is the best solution for a weekend track warrior. You can put them in when you arrive at the tack on Saturday morning, and take them out at the end of the day on Sunday, leaving you with the comfort and convenience of the OEM belts to use on a daily basis. The DOT Schroth systems linked above are OK, but lack convenience and ultimately, the safety the Racing harnesses provide. They really are a compromise solution, that is, a cross between using OEM belts and using a racing harnwss.
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Last edited by M3V8Driver; 03-03-2010 at 10:33 AM.
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      03-03-2010, 04:19 PM   #16
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I have used the Schroth snap-in belts in my e39 M5 and e46 M3 and loved them........they were not available yet last year when I started tracking the e92 M3......so I installed the "permanent" harnesses. I pulled them out when I traded the 08 for the 09 model and did 2 days at the track with just the stock belts and came out all bruised...........I hardly ever use the back seat so the harnesses can sit on the floor there when not at the track.......Joe
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      03-03-2010, 05:48 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3V8Driver View Post
I know exactly what I'm talking about. I've used and sold harnesses for many years. Both the DOT styles linked above and real racing harnesses have their pros and cons, but the DOT doesn't take into account racing activities when stipulating what is acceptable. I have used all these styles of belts and find that rigging your car to use racing harnesses is the best solution for a weekend track warrior. You can put them in when you arrive at the tack on Saturday morning, and take them out at the end of the day on Sunday, leaving you with the comfort and convenience of the OEM belts to use on a daily basis. The DOT Schroth systems linked above are OK, but lack convenience and ultimately, the safety the Racing harnesses provide. They really are a compromise solution, that is, a cross between using OEM belts and using a racing harnwss.
A 6 point harness is not made for a hacked install into our folding OEM seat unless it's been designed for it. You used the word "rigged" correctly.

Call Schroth, Willans etc. and tell them you want to install a race harness into one of our pivot back seats with no provisions for belt openings at the seat, bolsters or shoulders, also having to cut the bottom out for a anti-sub and somehow hack a anti-sub bar or drill thru the body and see what they say?

You can't get the required angles, <20 from horizontal, for shoulder straps and running them thru the headrest is a total hack, clearly, you need a harness bar at the very least. Not to mention the risk of a harness holding the driver upright in a roll over onto a crushed roof without a roll bar or cage.

That's why the Schroth quick fit is a real solution, albeit one with compromises but they've engineering a system, not tried to mate two things that are genetically incompatible. I've seen crazy hacked "safety" items in ricer cars, forgive the term, and they're scary. I get the desire to have a harness hold the driver in place, it'll drop your lap times instantly.

Just because you've "sold and installed" stuff doesn't mean it's anything close to correct or safe. I've set up 4 racecars but not an expert.

It's one thing to argue about what color halos are the best, another to throw out things that put people at risk. The OEM safety systems in our cars are amazing, when you jack with it, do it with careful consideration, unless it's just about looking the part of a "racecar", then have at it.

From Schroth's sales info:

Quote:
Like the Standard Quick Fit Harnesses, the Quick Fit Pro clicks into the car’s female seat belt receptacles. This alerts the airbag computer to the fact that someone is in the seat and restrained, as well as takes advantage of the seat belt pre-tensioner. This device ignites a pyrotechnic charge in the event of an accident that will tighten the lap belt. This integration into the factory safety system is a very important part of the Schroth Quick Fit Pro.

These harnesses are designed to be used in stock seats that have passed a seat back strength test.
Quote:
The ultimate harness solution includes fixed-back Kevlar seats, a gazillion point welded roll-cage and a HANS device. None of us are going to (nor do we recommend) do this in our street cars.

What’s the next best thing? The Schroth Quick Fit Harness. It anchors to factory points, which means you don’t have to worry about it ripping out of the sheet metal. The factory points are load tested to withstand a 3,000-pound force for 6 seconds. It has ASM technology that keeps the lap belt low and your rear end firmly planted in the seat. You don’t want the lap belt riding up and squeezing your stomach and intestines. A Schroth belt is designed not to.

The Quick Fit Belts also take advantage of the factory seat belt pre-tensioner, a device that tightens the belt 1-2 inches in the event of an accident. The Airbags will deploy as the engineers of the system intended for someone buckled in. With any other harness, the car wouldn’t detect that someone was buckled in, so the airbags would deploy faster and harder.

Last edited by consolidated; 03-03-2010 at 07:51 PM. Reason: added Schroth info.
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      03-03-2010, 07:49 PM   #18
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Any time saftey is the topic, you can bet there will be a heated discussion. I never suggested doing anything wrecklessly. I said I'v USED all types of harness and restraint systems during my 14-years of racing experience. There's a reason why the Schroth DOT harnesses aren't approved by any sanctioning body for competitive driving. Which brings me to this... the OP never did state why he wants a harness, so we've assumed it is for track days. From some of the posts above, it seems that many use a harness for better support (somebody even mentioned a CG-Lock device, which only works on the lap belt).

If I were to "rig" my E92 for a harness, I would fabricate a harness bar to bolt in where the rear seats are installed, using seat mount and/or seat belt mount locations. The bar would be at the proper 20 degrees or less slant from the shoulders, and yes, a "Y" style racing harness will work fine with our seats, in fact, that part isn't much different than the Schroth DOT versions. The fact that our seats recline is not a factor unless you plan to install racing seats... but then where does it end? Are you going to use a HANS device? Are you going to wear fire-retardant racing gear? Are you going to install a roll bar? How about a full roll cage with door bars and roll bar padding? If so, will you build it to FIA specs? How safe do you want to be?
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Last edited by M3V8Driver; 03-03-2010 at 07:55 PM.
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      03-03-2010, 08:38 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3V8Driver View Post
I know exactly what I'm talking about. The DOT Schroth systems linked above are OK, but lack convenience and ultimately, the safety the Racing harnesses provide.
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3V8Driver View Post
There's a reason why the Schroth DOT harnesses aren't approved by any sanctioning body for competitive driving. Which brings me to this... the OP never did state why he wants a harness, so we've assumed it is for track days.
I think we're all clearly talking about street cars and adding driver stability for DEs, not caged race cars. I can tell you the two largest DE organizers in my state allow 6-pts only with seats designed for them.

My point is, you believe a modified installation of a 6 pt. in an OEM seat is safer than the Quick Fit harness, Schroth disagrees with this, hence the product.

I have two sets of 6 pts unused, but will be buying the Quick Fit Pro when it becomes available. I'll use it with a HANS, and understand that if I flip and pancake the roof I'll likely be dead meat, but I'll take the odds given the risk of a basilar skull fracture from front or lateral impact.

Of course, I recognize that true "safety" doesn't exist when it comes to cars or life.
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      04-15-2010, 01:33 PM   #20
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Just called schroth for an update:

Should be available to the public in several weeks!
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      04-15-2010, 03:34 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3Captain View Post
Just called schroth for an update:

Should be available to the public in several weeks!
Available in several weeks! Great, I'll put a check in the post!

J/k - thanks for the follow up. There are a lot of people tracking this thread, no pun intended, and your updates help
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      04-15-2010, 09:30 PM   #22
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hahaha.. let's hope it really is coming out in a few weeks.. I feel we've been waiting for years...

I'm dying to get one of these to fit through my Recaro Profi SPGs for my next track event
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