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      02-11-2010, 12:43 PM   #1
Finnegan
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Porsche 911 GT3 R Hybrid

http://www.insideline.com/porsche/91...auto-show.html

In terms of function, it seems they're using kind of like a nitrous shot....

Interesting stuff, whether you approve or lament the development.
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      02-11-2010, 01:05 PM   #2
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That's pretty impressive. I see some relation to the technology of BMW's Vision Efficient Dynamics. Major difference is the use of a flywheel as power source.

I'm convinced that we'll see something similar in future BMW models...


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      02-11-2010, 01:34 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by southlight View Post
That's pretty impressive. I see some relation to the technology of BMW's Vision Efficient Dynamics. Major difference is the use of a flywheel as power source.

I'm convinced that we'll see something similar in future BMW models...


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south
Thanks for moving this...yeah, it belongs here.

RE: something similar in BMW, I think Footie may have alluded to that at some point along the way as well. I hate to say it (I'm kind of a purist), but I expect you're both right.

If this were done correctly (e.g. hybrid boost for city driving, or for overtaking with end-user control) I could see it not being too intrusive in performance oriented driving. How you'd not mess around with braking feel is the trick though...one would think that when the flywheel spins up you'd "feel" it. Maybe not. (Braking in a hybrid really stinks for performance oriented driving at present.) If the flywheel gets around this, then again, maybe performance driving dynamics wouldn't suffer too much.

It seems this is one way car makers can keep higher power vehicles on the road while meeting CO2 and fuel economy restrictions.
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      02-11-2010, 01:52 PM   #4
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The flywheel system is great for short boosts but I see the potential to be greater than something this limited. The advantage of electric motors running the first axle is the not only can it benefit everything you said but can also give instant power in the correct amount to correct excessive oversteer, pulling the nose straight and reduce the effects of lag in FI application to the point where the problem has been removed completely.

That was why I have hinted for some time the possibility that BMW might follow Audi's lead into providing their future hi-performance cars with awd, admittedly being done as a direct reaction to emissions regulations.
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      02-11-2010, 02:57 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finnegan View Post
Thanks for moving this...yeah, it belongs here.
I have to admit that this wasn't me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Finnegan View Post
RE: something similar in BMW, I think Footie may have alluded to that at some point along the way as well. I hate to say it (I'm kind of a purist), but I expect you're both right.

If this were done correctly (e.g. hybrid boost for city driving, or for overtaking with end-user control) I could see it not being too intrusive in performance oriented driving. How you'd not mess around with braking feel is the trick though...one would think that when the flywheel spins up you'd "feel" it. Maybe not. (Braking in a hybrid really stinks for performance oriented driving at present.) If the flywheel gets around this, then again, maybe performance driving dynamics wouldn't suffer too much.

It seems this is one way car makers can keep higher power vehicles on the road while meeting CO2 and fuel economy restrictions.
BMW prefers the way of using batteries/caps to the flywheel system. I'm not that sure about pros and cons of each technology. The flywheels probably weigh less than respective battery packs.

Adding to Footie's post, I see one disadvantage of e-motors powering the front wheels, and that's weight balance. The 911 GT3 R hybrid has a rear engine layout, the VED was a mid engine setup. In these cases it makes perfect sense to have the hybrid system up front avoiding to bring any more weight to the rear. Considering that all BMWs are front-engine layouts, adding the hybrid system to the front might not be that good of an idea, though. In these cases it would make more sense to have the e-motors and the batteries near the rear axle. Anyways, I'm just thinking out loud and might miss something here.


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      02-11-2010, 03:12 PM   #6
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You are right there will be a slightly weight issue but then this can be countered with the placement of the batteries if used. The other that needs to be remembered is that the electric motors would allow for a small engine in the first place.

So I am basically saying that at the design stage the possible weight problem will never really materialise.
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      02-11-2010, 03:17 PM   #7
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Holy, I love the look. The wheels look amazing.
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      02-11-2010, 04:02 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by footie View Post
You are right there will be a slightly weight issue but then this can be countered with the placement of the batteries if used. The other that needs to be remembered is that the electric motors would allow for a small engine in the first place.

So I am basically saying that at the design stage the possible weight problem will never really materialise.
I figured I had missed something.


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      02-12-2010, 11:06 AM   #9
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I think they are using the hybrid system developed by Williams F1.
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      02-12-2010, 12:09 PM   #10
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Quote:
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I think they are using the hybrid system developed by Williams F1.
Yeah, co-developed with Torotrak, their flywheel system is the least problematic of all Kers systems.
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      02-14-2010, 06:13 PM   #11
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Here's the pics. Yes it is very cool
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      02-18-2010, 07:09 PM   #12
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      02-18-2010, 07:31 PM   #13
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Very cool wide body... they should all be like that.
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      02-22-2010, 01:27 AM   #14
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Hybrid GT3= Oxymoron

I'll just take the 4.0L, 480HP N/A Flat 6, thanks.

Seriously, I want that engine!
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