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      11-13-2009, 07:55 PM   #177
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gooey View Post
Really? So you are basing the E92 M3 on other cars? That makes sense.

Maybe you should speak to people who have FI on the M3 and have tracked the car? PM niterider, ask him about his experiences, and then you will have a base from which to speak from.

The 1/4 mile and highway belong to the SC as you said. The track does as well.
So why does nightrider tune his car down for driving canyon roads etc? Down to nearly the power of a Stroker......

Because there are limits that you can push cars to, the FI puts more power down than required, unless you are driving in a straight line
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      11-13-2009, 07:59 PM   #178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gooey View Post
What is your experience with FI E92 M3's at the track?
Just wondering, what are your experiences with FI E9X M3s? Do you have one? If so, what s/c do you have on it?
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      11-13-2009, 08:06 PM   #179
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3_WC View Post
Yeah but you have to find it funny, jon was a G-power fanboy to the fullest. Nothing was better when he was running the G-power SC. Now he is on the Gintani bandwagon and now talks crap on other SC kits including ESS. Tightie is guilty of the same thing.


What you keep failing to understand, is no one said a stroker gets more power. Nobody said that. If you are 1/4 mile junky then yes SC would be the way to go. But honestly around a track, no question I would prefer to be NA.
I was really a fan boy for sure because I liked my G-power while it worked uh ok. I'm guilty. Has nothing to do with my post and FYI I was always supportive of Gintani way before my G-power came in to the picture it's not all of a sudden so what's your point?

You love ESS good for you and now all of a sudden you rather be N/A hurray for you no one gives a fuck. Stay N/A then but you have no idea what your talking about. Maybe if your running a kit with no cooling you might have problems but if its properly designed and has efficient cooling it won't be a problem. Ask niterider his car runs awesome on the track and he's not one to pussyfoot around the track. In fact look up the GS bildeler ESS race car that will crush any N/A M3 stroker or not on the track. Haven't you seen the vids? I'm sure drifting around the track all day would have caused engine problems by now if it was a real problem and the only problems they ever had is they crashed it while drifting which could have happened to any car. So quit posting dumb stuff newb.
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      11-13-2009, 08:15 PM   #180
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3Kernow View Post
So why does nightrider tune his car down for driving canyon roads etc? Down to nearly the power of a Stroker......

Because there are limits that you can push cars to, the FI puts more power down than required, unless you are driving in a straight line
Dunno of any strokers putting down 480whp on a dyno dynamics at best they'll make 400-415 on their best day with race fuel at least I hope so for their sake. Also when I had my G-power I was making 470whp on the same dyno and I canyon run all the time I never had problems putting the power down. And my car was cool as all the stock M3's. And that because I was running stock sized PS2's on a nice set of R-compounds forget about it. Anyway you slice it FI > NA anyday of the week.
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      11-13-2009, 08:35 PM   #181
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Originally Posted by Jonmartin View Post
Dunno of any strokers putting down 480whp on a dyno dynamics at best they'll make 400-415 on their best day with race fuel at least I hope so for their sake. Also when I had my G-power I was making 470whp on the same dyno and I canyon run all the time I never had problems putting the power down. And my car was cool as all the stock M3's. And that because I was running stock sized PS2's on a nice set of R-compounds forget about it. Anyway you slice it FI > NA anyday of the week.
Ummm you just posted that PencilGeek had 446 to the wheels or was that on a different dyno? ANyway thats only 34 less and you have also claimed that you have smoked cars with a claimed 50 more than you.


I think you guys should write a letter to the M-Division with your arguments for FI on stock internals on these cars and ask why they didn't do it on there GTS model......oh yeah probably not a good idea because they would laugh in your faces because they actually know what they are talking about
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      11-13-2009, 09:02 PM   #182
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3Kernow View Post
So why does nightrider tune his car down for driving canyon roads etc? Down to nearly the power of a Stroker......

Because there are limits that you can push cars to, the FI puts more power down than required, unless you are driving in a straight line
It is not tuned down to the power of a stroker, I believe at the lowest it was 5 psi? That is still 100 wheel more than the stroker. Niterider also is not running R compounds, but street tires, that may be part of the reason.

Canyons are not as much about power, that is the reason and safety is the primary concern. Does not change the fact he is still making and running far more power, with far more torque.
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      11-13-2009, 09:03 PM   #183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DevJ View Post
Just wondering, what are your experiences with FI E9X M3s? Do you have one? If so, what s/c do you have on it?
Plenty, yes, and all will become clear in due time.
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      11-13-2009, 09:04 PM   #184
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Considering how well the E46 and E36 perform with forced induction I'm sure the E9x will also perform great. Using incidents nvolving one kit maker's bad tuning to make assumptions about the motor's overall ability to handle forced induction is silly.

Especially considering the the G-Power kit with the updated tuning made a really impressive amount of power with a perfect A/F curve.
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      11-13-2009, 09:05 PM   #185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3Kernow View Post
Ummm you just posted that PencilGeek had 446 to the wheels or was that on a different dyno? ANyway thats only 34 less and you have also claimed that you have smoked cars with a claimed 50 more than you.


I think you guys should write a letter to the M-Division with your arguments for FI on stock internals on these cars and ask why they didn't do it on there GTS model......oh yeah probably not a good idea because they would laugh in your faces because they actually know what they are talking about
Name a time where BMW has taken an NA M motor and added boost to it? I laugh in your face that you would actually suggest something so ridiculous and ignore M history.

But BMW M is going FI is it not?

Why is the GTS NA? Because it is based on the S65, with an increase in stroke, that they took from the M5 CSL. That is why, where is your common sense and ability to reason?

Please, please, educate yourself on dynos and don't use numbers from one and another as absolutes, there is a large difference depending on which dyno you use under what conditions.
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      11-13-2009, 09:06 PM   #186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FStop7 View Post
Considering how well the E46 and E36 perform with forced induction I'm sure the E9x will also perform great. Using incidents nvolving one kit maker's bad tuning to make assumptions about the motor's overall ability to handle forced induction is silly.

Especially considering the the G-Power kit with the updated tuning made a really impressive amount of power with a perfect A/F curve.
Well, well, well, you are 2 for 2... +1
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      11-13-2009, 09:13 PM   #187
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3Kernow View Post
Ummm you just posted that PencilGeek had 446 to the wheels or was that on a different dyno? ANyway thats only 34 less and you have also claimed that you have smoked cars with a claimed 50 more than you.


I think you guys should write a letter to the M-Division with your arguments for FI on stock internals on these cars and ask why they didn't do it on there GTS model......oh yeah probably not a good idea because they would laugh in your faces because they actually know what they are talking about
Dunno bout PG's car I might be right about his numbers or not we'll see when he post them. I'm pretty sure it was done on a Dynapack because thats his favorite dyno but put Niteriders car on that thing and It will be closer to 570-600whp easy depending on what boost he's running.


Ya I'm sure BMW would really invest that kinda of money to add FI to a super limited production car. You're obviously not the brigthest bulb in the box because you would know that the GT2 Porsches Fastest car currently is also FI and guess what all the New upcoming production M's are also FI so I guess they know what they are doing after all..
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      11-13-2009, 09:17 PM   #188
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FStop7 View Post
Considering how well the E46 and E36 perform with forced induction I'm sure the E9x will also perform great. Using incidents nvolving one kit maker's bad tuning to make assumptions about the motor's overall ability to handle forced induction is silly.

Especially considering the the G-Power kit with the updated tuning made a really impressive amount of power with a perfect A/F curve.
+1 And I have some even funnier info that I choose not to disclose at this time but I can say its uber LOL worthy. Lets just say just because you're N/A doesn't mean you can't get a bad tuning map either.
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      11-13-2009, 09:20 PM   #189
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...I'm 99.9% sure I know the same thing you do about a bad NA tune, and whom's car had it (funny stuff for sure).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonmartin View Post
+1 And I have some even funnier info that I choose not to disclose at this time but I can say its uber LOL worthy. Lets just say just because you're N/A doesn't mean you can't get a bad tuning map either.
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      11-13-2009, 09:30 PM   #190
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LMAO . . . there are some real pieces of work in this thread. I know it's a rather sordid pleasure, but it's really fun to watch people knocking themselves out trying to "win" "un-winnable" arguments.

Everything in the engineering world is an exercise in pros and cons (AKA trade-offs). There is never one "right answer," but some people will never get that concept.

My own bias is shared with that of the late Sir Colin Chapman. Lose a lot of weight first, and then figure out what your power needs are.

By all means, keep going boys--you'll never win the FI vs. NA peeing contest, but it sure is fun to watch.
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      11-13-2009, 09:33 PM   #191
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Originally Posted by foosh View Post
LMAO . . . there are some real pieces of work in this thread. I know it's a rather sordid pleasure, but it's really fun to watch people knocking themselves out trying to "win" "un-winnable" arguments.

Everything in the engineering world is an exercise in pros and cons (AKA trade-offs). There is never one "right answer," but some people will never get that concept.

My own bias is shared with that of the late Sir Colin Chapman. Lose a lot of weight first, and then figure out what your power needs are.

By all means, keep going boys--you'll never win the FI vs. NA peeing contest, but it sure is fun to watch.
Cool the bleachers are that way >
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      11-14-2009, 12:02 AM   #192
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      11-14-2009, 10:31 AM   #193
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foosh View Post
LMAO . . . there are some real pieces of work in this thread. I know it's a rather sordid pleasure, but it's really fun to watch people knocking themselves out trying to "win" "un-winnable" arguments.

Everything in the engineering world is an exercise in pros and cons (AKA trade-offs). There is never one "right answer," but some people will never get that concept.

My own bias is shared with that of the late Sir Colin Chapman. Lose a lot of weight first, and then figure out what your power needs are.

By all means, keep going boys--you'll never win the FI vs. NA peeing contest, but it sure is fun to watch.
I think this is right on!!! But its sure fun to watch when someone is adamant about one or the other. To each his own I say.
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      11-15-2009, 07:48 PM   #194
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Honestly this comes down to what you want to do with your car. Their is several options and if u have money their is basically endless options.

I would def. say go full bolts ons and get rid of any weight u can. For example if u dont use ur rear seats, lose them. Get a lighter battery, maybe some kind of race seats (depending on how serious u r), lighter trunk, wheels etc...All this should make ur car shed at least 150lbs, gain 60-80whp (depends on what products u use) and it will make the car feel a lot better all around. I went this route before my SC and the car felt great at the track. I also gave bolt on e60 M5s a good run. Hope this helped.
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      11-15-2009, 09:34 PM   #195
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hello
everybody
afet hearing all that i m not sure that i m gonna touch my car. i was thinking to put a g power kit. but i saw that they have some trouble to fix on that.
what do u t
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