BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > E90/E92 M3 Technical Topics > Engine, Transmission, Exhaust, Drivetrain, ECU Software Modifications
 
Evolve Automotive
Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      11-12-2009, 04:03 AM   #67
M3_WC
Colonel
 
Drives: M3
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: CA

Posts: 2,210
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by tightie View Post
I'm curious, why would you would pick ESS? It is because they offer a kit that is 9 grand with no cooling? I don't know about you but theres no way in hell I'm putting boost in my car without a cooling system.
You talking about stage 1 at 4.5 psi? Which was tested in an Arizona summer 100+ heat everyday, zero problems. Yes it is $8,500

Lets not forget about stage 2 and 3, which do have cooling.

Man you are an ESS hater.


I remember back when you thought nothing touched your G-power setup. It was the best in the world. Then poof, if fucked your car up.


ESS has a strong reputation. Hopefully some day Gintani can reach that level of exposure and reputation.
M3_WC is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 04:40 AM   #68
Jonmartin
Banned
 
Jonmartin's Avatar
 
Drives: E90 M3
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Los Angles (818)

Posts: 2,103
iTrader: (1)

Send a message via AIM to Jonmartin
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3_WC View Post
You talking about stage 1 at 4.5 psi? Which was tested in an Arizona summer 100+ heat everyday, zero problems. Yes it is $8,500

Lets not forget about stage 2 and 3, which do have cooling.

Man you are an ESS hater.


I remember back when you thought nothing touched your G-power setup. It was the best in the world. Then poof, if fucked your car up.


ESS has a strong reputation. Hopefully some day Gintani can reach that level of exposure and reputation.
LOL why do I get the idea you work for ESS?? Don't act like ESS has never had problems don't even try to start with that nonsense... I'm sure they've improved from their E46 days but can't go around acting like their shit don't stink imo.

Check this link out I like how ESS addressed the customer LOL talk about great customer service. Meanwhile the poor dude is about 50whp off from their claimed numbers sounds like a blast from the past if you ask me...

http://www.mfestforum.com/forum/showthread.php?p=77383
Jonmartin is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 05:28 AM   #69
///FCB
First Lieutenant
 
///FCB's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 GTR
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: EU

Posts: 329
iTrader: (1)

If you simply want more torque, like some say, bolt ons will give you just enough IMO..however since you miss the zr1's torque I see your point for a bigger tune...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Optherion View Post
I definitely would like more bottom end torque. Neck snap and push you in the seat. Around town I would like to have torque for almost any gear. Sometimes find myself in the wrong gear.

I don't care about loud exhaust, straight race pipes and all that. If I could make it more of a sleeper then Id really like that as well. Most people go bananas and try to catch up the F430 Scuderia all the time. I think it would be funny like a member with the RD stroker said, "its funny to see the looks on the vette drivers faces when they arent catching up to what appears to be a completely stock m3"

I think this statement together with your high concern for warranty is the definite reason you should go for stroker. with a SC you will get the slight whistling sound as it charges and boosts btw, I looked on Dinans website and the kit has 12% discount for some reason, it says $22,999...+ 4 year/50,000 miles warranty. seems like the best package IMO!


about the Evo talk, 100% agree Evo is 0 sophistication in terms of things such as comfort. but to me it still is the mountain/tight corner track king, even 400hp is enough on that thing, if tuned properly, to make many supercar owners wonder what they paid all that money for. In this case its no Evo, but I'd hate to be this LP owner..

I prefer shotgun in a supercar no doubt. Call me nuts(and I do LOVE supercars), but I'd think about it twice when deciding to take a supercar vs a properly tuned Evo for a spin If I was older however, I agree, probably I would go for more sophisticated vehicles

btw: which ever tune you go for with the M in the end, please share your impressions afterwards
///FCB is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 10:43 AM   #70
kevinD
Private
 
Drives: 04 evo 8
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: irving, TX

Posts: 93
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Optherion View Post
You couldn't pay me to drive an evo. Id be the laughing stock of the boardroom meetings. I'm not 20 anymore. Our intern who working in the mail room has one . I went for a ride it to get lunch one day.

Very fast, 0 sophistication.



+1 I did not know that!!!

Dinan does not come with exhaust.
i think you misunderstand the people in the boardroom if you think they would laugh at an evo.

in my area, the guys with money (i.e.boardroom guys) and are true car guys, have memberships out at the tracks in the area (MSR, ECR, HHR). they know what evos are capable of, and respect it.

why don't you make a trip out to the track and mingle with your board room guys your trying to impress (theres definately a lot of them out there). i talk to them when i go out there... most of them know what it can do, and if not they love to talk about it. i've never been laughed at (especially when i pass them). usually they let me drool over their exotics, they ask about my car, we do a session, then they return wondering what the hell happened then get a lot more interested.

if the board room guys your trying to impress don't go out to the track, and don't know about cars at all, who cares what they think? get an evo mod the bejesus out of it, and tell them it is a FIA homogulated ralley car thats race prepped, and fast enough to sink your eyeballs into your head. you can even tell them its a super rare version that costs 100,000 dollars, a true car guys collectors car. they wont know the difference...

i'm telling you, for 28k dollars i can build you an evo faster then what your capable of driving. take for example my time attack car. it weighs 2600lbs, has 600whp on a mustang dyno, and even with 275 hoosiers on all 4 corners with AWD, first gear is entirely useless. i've spent less then 20k on it including purchasing the car. it is most definately faster then most supercars around a track. if your looking for something fast, get a fast car. m3 is quick, and an excellent all around daily driver, weekend track car. if you want something with sofistication (and fast), driving a modded m3 with its check engine light on and a very loud exhaust aint going to cut it. if i were to spend 28k on one mod, it would have to be something that makes everyones head turn. 500 CRANK hp doesn't do that these days. you'll get beat by a bone stock C6Z06, and be on par with the c63 AMG which at this point now would have cost 20,000 dollars less yet still has an awsome interior. underground racings twin turbo lambo that makes 1300whp and runs 75,000+ dollars DEFINATELY turns heads. HPFs big stage e46's that make 800whp definately turn heads (and is priced around the same as this stroker kit, yet makes 300whp more). i just don't see the power gain from this mod as being impressive for the giant chunk of change you have to spend on it. a 75shot of nitrous and a tune will yeild the same results for 27,000 dollars less.
__________________
'07 335xi
'10 tundra crewmax tow vehicle
'03 evo 8 unlimited time attack car, 600whp, 2600lbs
'08 evo X parts car (future time attack car)
kevinD is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 10:58 AM   #71
kevinD
Private
 
Drives: 04 evo 8
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: irving, TX

Posts: 93
iTrader: (0)

sorry, missed the sarcasm part (didn't finish reading the rest of the thread).

i guess IMO, if you want to mod the m3 (and i think thats awsome), you going to get a lot further with forced induction. we all know once you start modding, you can't stop. at least with a boosted car you can always do things like run E85 and make a HUGE bump in power. run meth injection, smaller SC pulley, most boost etc etc etc.
__________________
'07 335xi
'10 tundra crewmax tow vehicle
'03 evo 8 unlimited time attack car, 600whp, 2600lbs
'08 evo X parts car (future time attack car)
kevinD is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 11:05 AM   #72
KonigsTiger
Racying Dynamics
 
KonigsTiger's Avatar
 
Drives: E92M3 RS46 Club Sport, others
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Dweller

Posts: 4,398
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonmartin View Post
LOL its really not that serious. I don't really care to be honest I just say what I feel is the truth.
Got it, fair enough! Cheers to you!
__________________
==================================================
KonigsTiger is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 11:10 AM   #73
KonigsTiger
Racying Dynamics
 
KonigsTiger's Avatar
 
Drives: E92M3 RS46 Club Sport, others
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Dweller

Posts: 4,398
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PencilGeek View Post
Here's what I've noticed watching this thread. One group recommends SC and the other group recommends Stroker. The SC group seems to be mostly limited to the guys who own it. Whereas it seems like everybody else wishes they owned the stroker. The latter group seems to be much larger representation in this thread.

There is no doubt the stroker is expensive; and equally no doubt that the SC kit is FAR more bang for the buck. So if you're actually serious that you would consider either, then I would recommend you to drive both and then make a decision. The last guy who did that...chose the stroker and his motor is being built as we speak. He obviously saw something in the stroker that he liked better than the SC kit.

PM me if you have any more questions about the stroker, or want to take a test drive.
+1 and would be happy to go into detail about the disadvantages and advantages of both approaches. I own a hugely modified CLK Black that a twin turboed and and pulling over 800bhp and 900lbs of torque and also own an RS46 Club Sport Edition M3 (although I have yet to drive this one, lol, but a number of gentlemen have driven it). I love the both very, very much but clearly there are pluses and minuses to each approach. I would however add that I agree with PGs comments above wholeheartedly.
__________________
==================================================
KonigsTiger is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 11:17 AM   #74
disruptv
Major
 
Drives: 3M
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: ny

Posts: 1,145
iTrader: (10)

Garage List
09 3m  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by tightie View Post
I'm curious, why would you would pick ESS? It is because they offer a kit that is 9 grand with no cooling? I don't know about you but theres no way in hell I'm putting boost in my car without a cooling system.

Custom turbo? Where are you going to fit turbos into this car? There is literally no room unless you want to start cutting the body of the car and I really doubt people will start cutting the body of their brand new 70k car.
The only reason why I stated ESS is b/c of the value....they were offering a stage 1 kit for 9K installed and I agree w/u 100% on the cooling part...if it was my car i would pay extra for the cooling regardless of what stage i got

I was being facetious w/the turbo lol I just keep seeing the hpf kits on the e46 m3s and it makes me envious & sad that we cant do anything like than on the e9X m's yet


When I bought the car, the engine was a big part of that decision so to me at least it would be sacrilegious to change it for a 4.6L but at the same time it would be sacrilegious 2 add FI to it as well b/c the philosophy of M has always been to be NA....like someone said f uc k it & go for broke, do stroker and s/c...


Also to everyone else...I think this is gonna be a constructive thread so lets keep the name-calling OT & not part of this thread...please no e-thuggery
disruptv is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 11:45 AM   #75
///FCB
First Lieutenant
 
///FCB's Avatar
 
Drives: 2012 GTR
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: EU

Posts: 329
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PencilGeek View Post
I was with you all the way until this comment. There's videos of Sticky's lightly modded M3's with DCT easily beating the stock C63. So it makes no sense to think that a stroker M3 wouldn't smoke the stock C63.

We'll find out soon enough anyways. The Forum Wars competition has my stroker up against a modified C63. The competition is this Friday: 2009-11-13, and will be aired on the SPEED channel sometime in 2010. I'm mentioning the air-date because the participants will be bound by NDA not to disclose the results until the show airs.
I agree with you, I think stroked M3 will smoke stock C63 for sure...


btw, please!! put some times or even better, videos
I'm sure many of us would be interested to see how a stroked M3 performs!! good luck too
///FCB is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 11:45 AM   #76
Groundhog
Enlisted Member
 
Drives: R-compounded
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: West Coast

Posts: 47
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PencilGeek View Post
Here's what I've noticed watching this thread. One group recommends SC and the other group recommends Stroker. The SC group seems to be mostly limited to the guys who own it. Whereas it seems like everybody else wishes they owned the stroker. The latter group seems to be much larger representation in this thread.

There is no doubt the stroker is expensive; and equally no doubt that the SC kit is FAR more bang for the buck. So if you're actually serious that you would consider either, then I would recommend you to drive both and then make a decision. The last guy who did that...chose the stroker and his motor is being built as we speak. He obviously saw something in the stroker that he liked better than the SC kit.

PM me if you have any more questions about the stroker, or want to take a test drive.
Stroker has fewer moving parts; less to go wrong (provided the basic build is done right).

Benefits of Stroker:
Stroker won't kick off as much heat under the hood; won't need an intercooler (but bigger oil cooler is always a good idea).

Stroker will have a purer "M3" sound.

The stroker that he drove may have had more low end torque.

ECU re-calibration should be more "set it and forget it" with the stroker.

Stroker is more stealth

Stroker should be more rliable with fewer moving parts.

Benefits of supercharger;

Lower cost

more tuneable - can change boost level/HP depending on need w/ pulleys.

easier to bolt on.
Groundhog is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 11:46 AM   #77
Optherion
Lieutenant
 
Optherion's Avatar
 
Drives: Prancing Horse
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: SoCal & Vegas

Posts: 470
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PencilGeek View Post
Here's what I've noticed watching this thread. One group recommends SC and the other group recommends Stroker. The SC group seems to be mostly limited to the guys who own it. Whereas it seems like everybody else wishes they owned the stroker. The latter group seems to be much larger representation in this thread.

There is no doubt the stroker is expensive; and equally no doubt that the SC kit is FAR more bang for the buck. So if you're actually serious that you would consider either, then I would recommend you to drive both and then make a decision. The last guy who did that...chose the stroker and his motor is being built as we speak. He obviously saw something in the stroker that he liked better than the SC kit.

PM me if you have any more questions about the stroker, or want to take a test drive.
Ive arranged to drive a F/I e92 m3 already through a shop. I definitely will be taking note. If I am up in your area PencilGeek I will figure a way to meet up with you. Or if anyone else here in LA area has a stroker. This thread also is not about S/C vs Stroker for power, but S/C vs Stroker for reliability and longevity.

Again, for everyone that hasn't read all the posts, this is not about making my car "envious," or "bragging rights in the boardroom" or to get INSANE horsepower. I just want a little bit more. We've all had out quests for HP haha. I would like torque out of my m3 without being a guinea ping. (no m5 swap, no rear turbo etc.)

I will be visiting a few shops down here in my area like Gintani and Autotalent. Theres just something about an N/A motor to me that I love but hopefully the supercharger test drive will change my mind In any case, I will be posting up a sick build I promise.
__________________
Current Stable: Some Audi with a V10, Couple of BMW's, one F Car, and one P car. One lonely GT-R with all the Euros.
Optherion is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 11:47 AM   #78
kevinD
Private
 
Drives: 04 evo 8
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: irving, TX

Posts: 93
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by PencilGeek View Post
I was with you all the way until this comment. There's videos of Sticky's lightly modded M3's with DCT easily beating the stock C63. So it makes no sense to think that a stroker M3 wouldn't smoke the stock C63.

We'll find out soon enough anyways. The Forum Wars competition has my stroker up against a modified C63. The competition is this Friday: 2009-11-13, and will be aired on the SPEED channel sometime in 2010. I'm mentioning the air-date because the participants will be bound by NDA not to disclose the results until the show airs.
i may be wrong with the C63 vs a stroker... but the point was there.. it shouldn't take 28,000 dollars to beat a C63. the cars are in the same class and are direct competitors.

Definately let us all know how the drag thing goes. do you know any trap speeds for your car now? or trying to keep it secret? how about i throw out a number and you give me a winky smiley if i'm close

11.4 @ 130mph? 1.9 60ft spinning? (you wont be hitting 10's without sticky tires, are you running drag radials/slicks?)
__________________
'07 335xi
'10 tundra crewmax tow vehicle
'03 evo 8 unlimited time attack car, 600whp, 2600lbs
'08 evo X parts car (future time attack car)
kevinD is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 11:50 AM   #79
Nawaaz
Brigadier General
 
Drives: .
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: .

Posts: 4,643
iTrader: (0)

^ Hello Kevin!
Nawaaz is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 12:01 PM   #80
FStop7
I like cars
 
FStop7's Avatar
 
Drives: M6
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Newbury Park, CA

Posts: 5,059
iTrader: (3)

A "custom turbo" setup will cost you at least $25k to develop and you better do what HPF did and hire away someone from AEM to develop the engine management software.
__________________
FStop7 is offline   Vatican City State
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 12:03 PM   #81
Optherion
Lieutenant
 
Optherion's Avatar
 
Drives: Prancing Horse
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: SoCal & Vegas

Posts: 470
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinD View Post
i think you misunderstand the people in the boardroom if you think they would laugh at an evo.

in my area, the guys with money (i.e.boardroom guys) and are true car guys, have memberships out at the tracks in the area (MSR, ECR, HHR). they know what evos are capable of, and respect it.
I saw your second post above as well, but so the boardroom talk discussion leaves the thread Ill tell you a story so it ends now. haha. The seniors cars in the boardroom consist of a Bugatti Veyron, a Twin Turbo Merceilago, and a CL63amg. Weve been meaning to get together for a track day.

The guy in the mail room is an intern. He is practically broke but has a 500hp EVO (which he has told me cost him about $20,000 in upgrades once you consider parts, labor, shipping the car, replacement trans, and replacement diff that exploded). We are all car guys. We give him shit because he has a 1 bedroom studio he shares with a guy friend. (Ive been there before so the teasing all is in good nature).

The reason we tease each other back and forth is about 2 months ago, this guy, Erick with the EVO is with us at dinner. YES we are such car guys the senior VP and CEO do hang out with the mail room EVO guy. He's cool to be around and knows where his car performs and what the car is not. Hes very humble. We leave dinner, and I'm with my boss in his Veyron, Erick has to follow us with the girls (my wife and her 2 friends) in the EVO lol. We pull up in front of a club together and they let us park the Veyron smack right in front curbside service with the EVO behind. So I think to myself "awesome were going to get right in." Erick hops out of EVO with 3 girls and everyone is thinking "wtf" (hes 6'4" 140 pounds super thin with red hair and a geeky polo) The bouncers let him in. We get out of the Veyron and wait in line for half an hour haha.

The EVO jokes are in sarcasm. Erick jokes with us that he got into the club cause of his "sick evo" haha and everyone knows its because the girls haha. Guess girls sometimes come before 2 dudes in a Veyron.
__________________
Current Stable: Some Audi with a V10, Couple of BMW's, one F Car, and one P car. One lonely GT-R with all the Euros.

Last edited by Optherion; 11-12-2009 at 12:21 PM.
Optherion is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 12:11 PM   #82
FStop7
I like cars
 
FStop7's Avatar
 
Drives: M6
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Newbury Park, CA

Posts: 5,059
iTrader: (3)

I went from an E46 M3 to an Evo IX MR back to an E46 M3.

Pushing 24psi of boost into a tiny engine has a lot of its own drawbacks. The fact that a good clutch for an Evo costs $2000+ is worth mentioning, too. The Evo owners I know with fast and properly built cars (2.3L strokers, 35R or 37R, fuel system upgrades, AEM EMS, clutch, exhaust) have spent well over $20k.

And then there's that the car is just plain embarrassing to drive if you're over the age of 25. Sorry, but it's true. It's a high school car.

Would I own one as a dedicated track car? yeah. Would I ever own one as a street car or daily driver again? Hell no.
__________________
FStop7 is offline   Vatican City State
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 12:15 PM   #83
Optherion
Lieutenant
 
Optherion's Avatar
 
Drives: Prancing Horse
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: SoCal & Vegas

Posts: 470
iTrader: (0)

PencilGeek

Something doesnt sit right with me about the ESS "cheapest solution on the market" Id rather pay a little bit more knowing Im helping keep Gintani or Autotalent stay in business to support my warranty later on down the road .

I'm sorry guys but I find it hard to follow all of these "vs C63 or Z06" talks because I do not keep up on those youtube "race from a roll videos." Those cars just dont interest me and I cant remember a time I ever raced one ever in any of my cars. I go to the track.

Does anyone know the trap speeds or track times of any stroker M3's or F/I M3's to compare over stock?? I would be HIGHLY interested in that! What does 100hp+ truly give you.



Quote:
Originally Posted by FStop7 View Post
Would I own one as a dedicated track car? yeah. Would I ever own one as a street car or daily driver again? Hell no.
My Scuderia did get its ass handed to it by a full race EVO. This evo was in Redline Time attack. But at the end of the day, I drove home, picked up starbucks and KFC for the family while they spent 3 hours doing all the prep work and loading trailers haha. Oh and I got a ride in it on the track. It was retard how you could dip into the throttle mid turn.
__________________
Current Stable: Some Audi with a V10, Couple of BMW's, one F Car, and one P car. One lonely GT-R with all the Euros.
Optherion is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 12:17 PM   #84
frenchM3dreamer
Captain
 
Drives: 08 Mitsu Eclipse Spyder GTP
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Edmonton, AB

Posts: 786
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Optherion View Post
I saw your second post above as well, but so the boardroom talk discussion leaves the thread Ill tell you a story so it ends now. haha. The seniors cars in the boardroom consist of a Bugatti Veyron, a Twin Turbo Merceilago, and a CL63amg. Weve been meaning to get together for a track day.

The guy in the mail room is an intern. He is practically broke but has a 500hp EVO (which he has told me cost him about $20,000 in upgrades once you consider parts, labor, shipping the car, replacement trans, and replacement diff that exploded). We are all car guys. We give him shit because he has a 1 bedroom studio he shares with a guy friend. (Ive been there before so the teasing all is in good nature).

The reason we tease each other back and forth is about 2 months ago, this guy, Erick with the EVO is with us at dinner. YES we are such car guys the senior VP and CEO do hang out with the mail room EVO guy. He's cool to be around and knows where his car performs and what the car is not. Hes very humble. We leave dinner, and I'm with my boss in his Veyron, Erick has to follow us with the girls in the EVO lol. We pull up in front of a club together and they let us park the Veyron smack right in front curbside service with the EVO behind. So I think to myself "awesome were going to get right in." Erick hops out of EVO with 3 girls and everyone is thinking "wtf" (hes 6'4" 140 pounds super thin with red hair and a geeky polo) The bouncers let him in. We get out of the Veyron and wait in line for half an hour haha.

The EVO jokes are in sarcasm. Erick jokes with us that he got into the club cause of his "sick evo" haha and everyone knows its because the girls haha. Guess girls sometimes come before 2 dudes in a Veyron.
OT: you dont have a job for me by any chance? i wouldnt mind going for lunch in a Veyron or taking 3 cute girls out in my Spyder to the club
joke apart, seriously, dont you have a job for me???

Pat
frenchM3dreamer is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 12:19 PM   #85
Nawaaz
Brigadier General
 
Drives: .
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: .

Posts: 4,643
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by FStop7 View Post
I went from an E46 M3 to an Evo IX MR back to an E46 M3.

Pushing 24psi of boost into a tiny engine has a lot of its own drawbacks. The fact that a good clutch for an Evo costs $2000+ is worth mentioning, too. The Evo owners I know with fast and properly built cars (2.3L strokers, 35R or 37R, fuel system upgrades, AEM EMS, clutch, exhaust) have spent well over $20k.

And then there's that the car is just plain embarrassing to drive if you're over the age of 25. Sorry, but it's true. It's a high school car.

Would I own one as a dedicated track car? yeah. Would I ever own one as a street car or daily driver again? Hell no.

Hey, I wouldn't mind going back to my Evo IX MR, and I'm married and have a kid too.

That Evo is simply a RAW, fucking AWESOME driving machine, that is purely addictive.

No doubt.
Nawaaz is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 01:20 PM   #86
Jonmartin
Banned
 
Jonmartin's Avatar
 
Drives: E90 M3
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Los Angles (818)

Posts: 2,103
iTrader: (1)

Send a message via AIM to Jonmartin
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinD View Post
i may be wrong with the C63 vs a stroker... but the point was there.. it shouldn't take 28,000 dollars to beat a C63. the cars are in the same class and are direct competitors.

Definately let us all know how the drag thing goes. do you know any trap speeds for your car now? or trying to keep it secret? how about i throw out a number and you give me a winky smiley if i'm close

11.4 @ 130mph? 1.9 60ft spinning? (you wont be hitting 10's without sticky tires, are you running drag radials/slicks?)
Based on the last 60-130 times posted by PG at best the stroker cars will maybe hit 11.8's @ 120mph... And thats being pretty generous. I think the modified C63 will walk it easily if its anything thing like the Evosport widebody C63 it will get pretty nasty for the M3 in the straights
Jonmartin is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 01:29 PM   #87
M3Kernow
Private
 
Drives: E92 Silverstone M3
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Kernow

Posts: 66
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonmartin View Post
LOL cute so you think because G-power had a problem with their tune that somehow that will be the case with all the other kits? First of all if the kit is tuned properly and running properly and maintened there is no reason an FI M3 shouldn't last an easy 80k Miles on the stock motor and I'm sure it could last much longer in reality. And by that time I dont think alot of people even have their cars.

Also even if half the owners of stroker cars even knew how to drive their cars hard enough to even possibly notice the supposed extra weight on the front of the car they would still get trounced on the track thats guranteed. You're not even dramatically changing the weight bias, that statement is absurd were not talking adding enough weight to front of the car to change the balance to something silly it will maybe be at worst 53/47 (stock is 52.2/48.8 or similiar )and if you were really into having a lightweight cars you probably wouldnt have bought an M3 in the first place so gimme a break.

Bottomline you're not ever going to see a stroker M3 beat the times of a FI M3 on any track cept maybe an Autocross or something where you can't even use the power of the S/C and my opinion that doesn't even count.

Also who cares if you get an exhaust and all that as part of the cost in a FI kit, it would still make more power and destroy the stroker car besides for the money you're saving you can buy all that and still have money left over so how is that more valueable? are you serious lol?

WTF does American muscle have to do with FI are you really being serious?

All I know is the strokers really have good tourqe (for a small rpm range) and thats about the only positive it has over a Full Bolt on M3. And where it makes tourqe isn't nesscessarily better for the track if you're high in the rev range. Anyway to the OP get a FI kit or just go full bolt on if you're gonna have your car for life or over 100k miles and dont want to rebuild then which alot of people would do anyway after having the FI on a stock motor for that long.

I personally think If I'm dropping over 25K+ on a motor it better be able to do 10's And that will never happen with a stroker alone.
Ok, well some people wouldn't be happy to reduce their Motors life expectancy down from around the 180k mark (previous M models are still driving around with this high mileage) down to around the 80k. Even if your not going to own the car for that long, if you own it for 4 years and most of us use these cars as daily drivers your going to put around 40k on the car, thats half of the engines life under FI. I couldn't sell a car to someone without telling them the real deal, which i know would effect the value of my car.

FI on M Cars isn't anything new, and as there is hardly any feedback on the Supercharger Kits available currently, i'm not saying all kits will have problems, i'm just going off the history of previous vehicles. I've always own M's and so have my friends, my E46 was kept NA (I didn't have a stroker) but a couple of my mates had 2 different types of FI packages, both were constantly having issues with there cars always overheating and always running shitty.

I haven't driven a SC E9* model but, i've always thought that on the E46 the car feels heavier in the front end with the FI installed and always preferred the way my NA car felt in comparison, not only in handling but also day to day driving, after a while I feel driving aftermarket FI is a chore and is not fun easy going driving. I bought an M to have an M

The M Philosophy to date is to keep a naturally aspirated motor, yes they are going to forced induction soon but that is only to keep up in the market and put down bigger numbers to keep the people that like to claim numbers happy. The M division are also going to do the FI properly and drop the motor down from the V8 to the Inline 6 in order to keep the balance of the car. Otherwise why has the M.Division not just upgraded the AWARD WINNING S65 Engine with FI? Same with the GTS they didn't just slap a Supercharger on it they bumped up the displacement

Here is a link to some videos, I can't remember which section its in but Steve Dinan claims to have raced a FI against their stroker and beat or was the same as it, i cant remember exactly off the top of my head and the guy is so boring I can't be bothered to listen to the whole thing again. No one else has done this test so unless he's talking shit I don't know what to think? Someone over in the States should call them and ask them who's kit they raced against?

http://www.mfestforum.com/forum/show...ght=dinan+tour

Niterider who has a FI M3 said this in another post:

My car @ 8lbs of boost which will be what the kit will be sold with, made 517whp. Thats a little more then 200 gained whp, and I have had no problems (knock on wood). Ive also ran my car with 9.5 lbs of boost for a few weeks, with no problems. The car makes 530-540whp at this boost. The only reason I stopped running this boost was because the car had no traction 1st-3rd gear, which made me get sideways any time I gave it full WOT. The car still doesnt hook very well with 8lbs of boost but its more manageable.

I recently dropped the boost to 6.5 lbs which is my current dyno of 480whp, but this was just a personal choice. I run a lot of canyons and track as much as I can afford so I really dont need that much power. This allows me to still control the car better in turns and also do some damage on the straights. I get your point about the more power the more problems, but that is not the case with the Gintani SC kit.


Basically because you have 600 odd horses doesn't mean you can use it on the track or backroads effectively, there is only so much power you can use hence Nightrider dropping his boost.

I don't mean any offense at all by mentioning American Muscle but commonly superchargers are slap on cars to get good 1/4 mile times, and your talking about wanting a car to run 10's if you drop $25k. Driving straight in a fast line is not why i bought any of the M's I have ever owned.

Two people on this forum have had one manufacturers FI kit. One of the guys is selling it and you are still yet to reinstall it after it blew your first motor. Let us know when you get the kit reinstalled cause it sounds like Pencil Geek is down for some SAFE and ORGANISED battling.

At the end it comes down to different STROKES for different folks
M3Kernow is offline  
0
Reply With Quote
      11-12-2009, 01:45 PM   #88
Jonmartin
Banned
 
Jonmartin's Avatar
 
Drives: E90 M3
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Los Angles (818)

Posts: 2,103
iTrader: (1)

Send a message via AIM to Jonmartin
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3Kernow View Post
Ok, well some people wouldn't be happy to reduce their Motors life expectancy down from around the 180k mark (previous M models are still driving around with this high mileage) down to around the 80k. Even if your not going to own the car for that long, if you own it for 4 years and most of us use these cars as daily drivers your going to put around 40k on the car, thats half of the engines life under FI. I couldn't sell a car to someone without telling them the real deal, which i know would effect the value of my car.

FI on M Cars isn't anything new, and as there is hardly any feedback on the Supercharger Kits available currently, i'm not saying all kits will have problems, i'm just going off the history of previous vehicles. I've always own M's and so have my friends, my E46 was kept NA (I didn't have a stroker) but a couple of my mates had 2 different types of FI packages, both were constantly having issues with there cars always overheating and always running shitty.

I haven't driven a SC E9* model but, i've always thought that on the E46 the car feels heavier in the front end with the FI installed and always preferred the way my NA car felt in comparison, not only in handling but also day to day driving, after a while I feel driving aftermarket FI is a chore and is not fun easy going driving. I bought an M to have an M

The M Philosophy to date is to keep a naturally aspirated motor, yes they are going to forced induction soon but that is only to keep up in the market and put down bigger numbers to keep the people that like to claim numbers happy. The M division are also going to do the FI properly and drop the motor down from the V8 to the Inline 6 in order to keep the balance of the car. Otherwise why has the M.Division not just upgraded the AWARD WINNING S65 Engine with FI? Same with the GTS they didn't just slap a Supercharger on it they bumped up the displacement

Here is a link to some videos, I can't remember which section its in but Steve Dinan claims to have raced a FI against their stroker and beat or was the same as it, i cant remember exactly off the top of my head and the guy is so boring I can't be bothered to listen to the whole thing again. No one else has done this test so unless he's talking shit I don't know what to think? Someone over in the States should call them and ask them who's kit they raced against?

http://www.mfestforum.com/forum/show...ght=dinan+tour

Niterider who has a FI M3 said this in another post:

My car @ 8lbs of boost which will be what the kit will be sold with, made 517whp. Thats a little more then 200 gained whp, and I have had no problems (knock on wood). Ive also ran my car with 9.5 lbs of boost for a few weeks, with no problems. The car makes 530-540whp at this boost. The only reason I stopped running this boost was because the car had no traction 1st-3rd gear, which made me get sideways any time I gave it full WOT. The car still doesnt hook very well with 8lbs of boost but its more manageable.

I recently dropped the boost to 6.5 lbs which is my current dyno of 480whp, but this was just a personal choice. I run a lot of canyons and track as much as I can afford so I really dont need that much power. This allows me to still control the car better in turns and also do some damage on the straights. I get your point about the more power the more problems, but that is not the case with the Gintani SC kit.


Basically because you have 600 odd horses doesn't mean you can use it on the track or backroads effectively, there is only so much power you can use hence Nightrider dropping his boost.

I don't mean any offense at all by mentioning American Muscle but commonly superchargers are slap on cars to get good 1/4 mile times, and your talking about wanting a car to run 10's if you drop $25k. Driving straight in a fast line is not why i bought any of the M's I have ever owned.

Two people on this forum have had one manufacturers FI kit. One of the guys is selling it and you are still yet to reinstall it after it blew your first motor. Let us know when you get the kit reinstalled cause it sounds like Pencil Geek is down for some SAFE and ORGANISED battling.

At the end it comes down to different STROKES for different folks
If any stroker wants to run they should run Niterider or Sammyrusso's car I gurantee Steve Dinan would shit bricks if he ran those cares. Either way he can say whatever he wants he has 0 data to back it up and people have no clue what that stroker can produce there are no dynos no 1/4 mile data no nothing of value so it amazes me to think people are willing to drop that kinda of cash on pure hearsay.

And I guess the same thing could be said to a degree on the S/C cars but I know that will change at the upcoming Famoso event. But for now the Power graphs alone tells you the S/C cars are much much faster. I dunno what Steve Dinan ran but I'm sure it wasn't anything running properly LOL. Gintani's kit is good for over 500whp on a dyno dynamics what do the strokers make on the same dyno? maybe 400-410whp at best thats only about 10-20hp more then a Bolt on car like mine. Sorry but It wouldnt even be a competiton.

Thats why I sorta think it would have been better to run Stickys car for the Forum wars because now everyone is going to talk a whole heap of crap about the M3 claiming it had $30k dropped in it and gets smoked by a modded C63 at least if it was Sticky's car it wouldn't have been as big of a deal because it has much less money in to it. And he would have been just as fast. I guess we'll see what happens tommorrow.
Jonmartin is offline   United_States
0
Reply With Quote
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
dinan, dyno, gpower, rdsport, supercharge

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:08 PM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST