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      11-02-2009, 05:53 PM   #375
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You do realize that 110K Euros at current exchange rates is $165K, don't you?
in that case, i would do the v10 swap, lol
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      11-02-2009, 05:54 PM   #376
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      11-02-2009, 06:03 PM   #377
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Why is this thread 18 pages?
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      11-02-2009, 06:07 PM   #378
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in that case, i would do the v10 swap, lol
You cannot do a direct exchange on the Euro to N/A $'s as we pay the lowest prices in the world for BMW's.
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      11-02-2009, 06:15 PM   #379
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Originally Posted by PencilGeek View Post
None of us buy our M3's as resale investments. I already consider my car worthless on the resale market, but I will admit the "factory" car will hold a better value. However, when you go to sell this factory car -- outside of the show-car and concourse circuits, you're going to have a near-impossible time finding a buyer that will pay a 50% + premium for it. Joe Sixpack has no idea why you're asking $100k on the aftermarket for an M3 -- and he won't care. He'll just say no.
Exactly I don't know anyone that buys car for resale value... I'd rather take my already modified M3 and put some Recaro seats and better suspension maybe even buy the one from this GT4 and accomplish the same thing.
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      11-02-2009, 06:19 PM   #380
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I'll believe this when I hear it from BMW.
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      11-02-2009, 06:56 PM   #381
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Here is some additional info and pics

http://www.nextautos.com/spy-shots-b...production-run

http://www.autoblog.com/2009/07/07/b...tlemen-racers/
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      11-02-2009, 07:30 PM   #382
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Originally Posted by JoeyBananaz18 View Post
big let down. GT3 is still king. all i wanted was just a lightened, simpler version of the current M3. give us less and we pay less. disappointed.
As adc already said, you make no sense asking for a stripped car at a lower price point, and then mentioning the GT3 in the same line.

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Originally Posted by Gearhead999s View Post
You cannot do a direct exchange on the Euro to N/A $'s as we pay the lowest prices in the world for BMW's.
In the US, we will need to do a direct exchange rate since we won't be getting the car.


How would this car be different than a "CSL version???"
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Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
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      11-02-2009, 07:40 PM   #383
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gearhead999s View Post
You cannot do a direct exchange on the Euro to N/A $'s as we pay the lowest prices in the world for BMW's.
You can if the car is not for sale in N. America. Oops, Aus just said that.
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      11-02-2009, 07:42 PM   #384
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At this point, I am highly skeptical about the pricing/production strategy provided.

1. At 11k Euros, only those who are quite affluent can afford such a car. But for someone who has the money, why not buy a dedicated track car? BMW Motorsport already offers the non-road legal GT4...

2. And let's say the person wants something to drive directly to/from the track, why not buy a GT3? Which offers better performance and (dare I say it) racing heritage for the same price?

3. Let's assume that the person is image conscious and wants a street-legal racing car, then there is the GT3-RS! or a Scud... or a LP-550...

4. 25 per year?! Yeah right... It will take perhaps 100 years to break even...

All these just don't add up. But I shall remain silent until BMW's official release.
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      11-02-2009, 07:45 PM   #385
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foosh View Post
You can if the car is not for sale in N. America. Oops, Aus just said that.
It has happened before where Canada got cars that the US did not,but our standards now mirror the US so who really knows if we get it or not.I will order one if we can get it Canada as a normal road car.Otherwise my long term is still a GT3.
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      11-02-2009, 10:49 PM   #386
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I think is pretty sick news!! BMW trying to put something up to go against the competition! I know I cant afford one but its nice to know BMW M is still determined to be on top. People bought the M3 csl, they didnt just say lets put the HPF turbo in the car since its cheaper or same price... props to Savage and South for this and cant wait to see the car!
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      11-02-2009, 10:58 PM   #387
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So would it be worth it to you guys if it was faster around the ring than a GT3, or maybe a GT3RS?
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Let me get this straight... You are swapping out parts designed by some of the top engineers in the world because some guys sponsored by a company told you it's "better??" But when you ask the same guy about tracking, "oh no, I have a kid now" or "I just detailed my car." or "i just got new tires."
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      11-03-2009, 12:27 AM   #388
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No one is mad at bmw for making it we are mad because they made something we want and aren't allowing us to buy it.
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      11-03-2009, 12:39 AM   #389
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aus View Post
As adc already said, you make no sense asking for a stripped car at a lower price point, and then mentioning the GT3 in the same line.
i honestly didnt see that lol. iv been following this thread with alot of interest to see what would actually come out. the more i read, the more i though about how i'd design a "CSL"- type BMW to be.and i kept thinking of an episode of "Top Gear" wheree they drove a Supperaleggera, GT3RS and an Aston Martin N24. the thing they all said at the end of the episode was that if their cars had less, they should pay less. that was my thinking so saying what i said.
whats even funnier is that before putting up THIS post, i began typing everything id do to an M3 to make it a CSL. at the end i reread my post and said to myself "shit, those brake are gonna cost the consumer a ton. those slicks won't come cheep. alcantara is really expensive." lol.

but there was something that wouldnt cost the consumer a ton. and this i have to say, even though i know what i'm about to start.

it is a great peice of technology, and i know its made to take on cars like the GT3- but if you're gonna build a car like this give it a proper 6-speed lol.
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      11-03-2009, 12:45 AM   #390
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What a letdown.
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      11-03-2009, 03:33 AM   #391
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seriousm3 View Post
Price really isn't that bad...

Brakes = $5000
Seats = $3000 at least
Wheels = $2500
Engine work = $5000
Suspension = $3000
Bodywork = $1000
Rollbar = $1500

Just to get a package on par with the Gt4 your spending $25,000 on top of the price of a normal M3. Not counting labor and testing costs too.

The tiny production numbers are what bother me, and the fact that once again the US is excluded.
This is not an accurate point of view. Those prices are fully burdened retail prices. Even if BMW only bought 25 kits to build 25 cars they would be getting better prices. Also when you add those figures to the cars base price you only get something in the neighborhood of $75k. How does that make a price not that bad?

Quote:
Originally Posted by foosh View Post
You do realize that 110K Euros at current exchange rates is $165K, don't you?
And you must realize that prices in different countries do not scale by exchange rates as was already pointed out. For cars it is not even close to this type of calculation.

So if this car was offered in the US the price would likely be something like 1.2 x 110k or ~ $130k USD. Based on a more realistic price of $75k with aftermarket parts as outlined above that makes even $130k a serious, serious rip off.
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      11-03-2009, 04:52 AM   #392
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I think it is a good thing that BMW still made it, even if I don't like some thing about it. But than many of the reproaches are wrong:
1. No manual gear box: The M3 CSL also didn't have any manual gear box, but a sequential gear box (SMG). The DCT is not that much different if you use it in manual mode (not automatic).
2. The M3 GT is to expensive: I do not remember how much did the M3 E46 cost, but the M3 CSL E46 was more than 80.000 €.
Now the 911 GT3 costs around 116.000 €. The 911 GT3 RS more than 160.000 €, as much as a 911 Turbo. The 911, R8, Gallardo, F430 / 458 Italia, MP4-12C are pure sportcars, but the M3 is just the most sold family car of the world in this class, so nothing special, and BMW M is able to make it keep up with the most high performance cars. Look at BMW N-Ring times:
7:50 for X5 Le Mans
7:50 for M3 CSL
7:50 for M5 CSL
What if BMW made a real sportcar as an M1?
Do you see what I mean? When will an RS5 or a C63 AMG, even Black Series be compared to cars such as 911, Ferrari and so?
Be happy BMW made it at all, they said there won't be any CSL. And they were right not to do any. Those that have money drive such cars as R8 V10 only for show. But they want comfort, navi, radio and so. But I like radical pure sportcars such as 911 GT3 RS (not 911 GT3) 430 Scuderia, but I don't have the money.
The only thing that is not cool is that it won't be sold in America, where I think can be the largest market. Here in France an M3 is such a rear think, at least were I live. I know about 10 of them. France is just the worst country for sportcars.
But well before critisising anything, I would still wait for the official release.

Again thank you Savage for this thread and the teasing, it was really very exiting to wait for this news. If you again get to know something, even without having the right to say it, still say you know something more that we don't, maybe: "I have a BIG NEWS. BMW is going to make the Legend revive". Hint: ///M1
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      11-03-2009, 05:02 AM   #393
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Of pure lap times I think the RS5 will get closer to the 997C2S Mk2 then many here think, but it will not approach the levels of grip that this GT4 will get, or it's lap times. It is after all a product designed to compete with the stock M3 and not a limited run special.

You will see a 'lightweight' S5/RS5 coming soon that will be more on this level but again it will be a limited run special with a price to match.

Performance like this doesn't come cheap.
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      11-03-2009, 05:34 AM   #394
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Note: There's no information as to its availability in the U.S. yet. (NOT AVAILABLE IN THE U.S.A.)
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      11-03-2009, 06:27 AM   #395
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You guys are funny, you whined when BMW anounced that there won't be a CSL, you were saying that ///M lost it's value, bla bla bla, but now when BMW finally went out of their way to offer such vehicle you whine again. If it's too expensive to you then don't buy it, there will always be people who will buy it, look at the E46 M3 CSL... And stop comparing aftermarket parts and production vehicles, apples to oranges in my opinion. Even if you spend that aditional 25k or so on Chinese aftermarket parts, it will still be a run of the mill M3. Just be glad that BMW offers such car. And it's not only about the money for BMW, it's a huge advertising for BMW. Just imagine how much talk there will be when Top Gear and others will test it and give it good reviews and the headlines will be like "BMW is back at their game, the competition has nothing to offer", you know, just like in the good old days

For those that maybe somehow missed the E46 M3 CSL review, here it is:
Hello to all you guys....I am still here sorry
I agree with you Stankia. And I would also say what happened when BMW told that they would have produced the X5M and X6M? do you remember the reactions? at least for me it was a sad day...Lost the true M spirit??:-((
Now BMW should confirm (we are all waiting including me) this new project...So from my point of view it was a Great New. In other words BMW changed his mind or simply didn't forget the nature of the M letter. And this is the real big new from my point of view. More than the car itself.

I want also to thank South for the great support he gave me . Tks Sir

Now why I came back? I don't want some readers would think I am a coward and simply I decided to disappear. I am checking like you the net looking for some official news. But let me add some details.
The car in my opinion will not be sold in only 25 pcs for year. I don't perceived this during my discussion. The car should have other news that were not told to me. They simply told me : big surprice.
And the car should be shown worldwide during next last MotoGp Race by a very famous Bike driver...Can you imagine the name? next Sunday.
The car should have not less than 460 hp. Why to increase by 400 cc the engine for a so poor increase ?(only 30 hp?) Non a big sense to me.Considering also that there will be a special exhaust system.
The weight could be even better than 100 kg less. And don't forget that there should be a DGK (with special programs ). This weighs about if I am not wrong 25 kg right? so the weight loss should be a real -125 kg (then add the 25 and you get the minus 100kg). So not too bad and not possible with some minor works on the seatings and body.

Now: if all will be confirmed I can tell other two news. And probably if all will be confirmed this week we should beleive also to these two new ones. There will be in two years a new Baby Emme. Based on the series 1. Four cylinders turbo. There will be also a new sportcar like many are waiting.
We will see what happens this week.

Thanks to all the people that understood the sense of my Thread also if I made some mistakes .
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      11-03-2009, 07:08 AM   #396
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Thanks Savage. I respect that you know your stuff. From my perspective... I prefer to be told the news... rather than be given news that news will come... :P
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