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      11-02-2009, 02:29 PM   #353
racedoc11
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I'm only interested in the exhaust and the seats
Quote:
Originally Posted by southlight View Post
I talked to a good Italian friend of mine () and we think that it might be the right time to share some information.

All kudos for this information goes to Savage.Ulm1! I added some comments in light blue.

EDIT: Lemans_Blue_M added some more information in dark blue


Name
  • It won't be called M3 CSL.
  • Instead, BMW will either call it "M3 GT4 Street" or "M3 GT".
Engine | Drivetrain
  • Naturally aspirated engine with an increased displacement of 4,400 cc (based on the S65).
  • At least 450 hp, likely more. (445 HP)
  • No information regarding KERS (KERS will likely debut in the F10 M5)
  • 7 speed DCT only, no manual transmission.
  • 'State of the art' exhaust system, but not Akrapovic.- (ARVIN MERITOR /w/200-cell race cats and 2 resonators)
Chassis | Brakes | Aerodynamics:
  • Brembo brakes (6 pistons front - 4 pistons rear) with steel brake discs. (365mm front, 345mm rear SLOTTED DISCS) Ceramic composite brakes optionally available.
  • Weight reduction of 100 kg (220 lbs) compared to E92 M3, maybe even more. (due to the removal of the rear seat and the switch to lighter RECARO front race seats)
  • Available as a 2 seater. However, rear seats are optionally available.
  • Rollbars standard (there's a delete option).
  • Adjustable front splitter. (made of ABS plastic)
  • Adjustable mechanical suspension, no EDC. (SACHS)
  • 25 mm lower compared to E92 M3
  • Same width as the E92 M3.
  • Fantastic new wheels. (BBS lightweight cast flow formed MESH)
  • New 'state of the art' seats. (RECARO)
General information


  • Nuerburgring laptime: 7:40 min
  • Not available through BMW dealer network, but directly from BMW Motorsport.
  • Street legal (of course).
  • Exclusively painted in Inka Orange (a hommage to early BMW race and sports cars). Availability of other colors at a later date.
  • The car was tested secretly in France and on a private race track (likely Miramas).
  • It will compete with the 911 GT3.
  • Limited Production (some report 25 units per year).
  • Price: Unknown, but less than the price for an 911 GT3. ($110,000 EUROS)
Note: There's no information as to its availability in the U.S. yet. (NOT AVAILABLE IN THE U.S.A.)




Best regards,
south
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      11-02-2009, 02:36 PM   #354
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Price really isn't that bad...

Brakes = $5000
Seats = $3000 at least
Wheels = $2500
Engine work = $5000
Suspension = $3000
Bodywork = $1000
Rollbar = $1500

Just to get a package on par with the Gt4 your spending $25,000 on top of the price of a normal M3. Not counting labor and testing costs too.

The tiny production numbers are what bother me, and the fact that once again the US is excluded.
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      11-02-2009, 02:42 PM   #355
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete The Greek View Post
So... how can I get my hands on one of these? Just out of curiousity, can I buy one in Europe through my US address? Or do I have to use my european addy?
You would have to order and have this car delivered to a EUROPEAN address.

And I think I know why you asked this question...

If you're planning to buy one of these cars in Europe, then IMPORT it to the UnitedStates...forget about it.

It's never gonna happen...
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      11-02-2009, 02:53 PM   #356
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I hope we can option the 'regular' m3 with some of these new parts such as the brakes, engine, exhaust, lowered ride height AND be made available in the USA. But this is really unlikely. This M3 version is super niche which is great but there needs to be an 'in between' version aka Comp Edition with some of the upgrades such as brakes, aero bits, etc but no engine upgrade.

Can't wait to see this puppy tho.

edit: forgot to say thanks to savage, lmb, mods for the info!
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      11-02-2009, 02:53 PM   #357
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Originally Posted by PencilGeek View Post
None of us buy our M3's as resale investments. I already consider my car worthless on the resale market, but I will admit the "factory" car will hold a better value. However, when you go to sell this factory car -- outside of the show-car and concourse circuits, you're going to have a near-impossible time finding a buyer that will pay a 50% + premium for it. Joe Sixpack has no idea why you're asking $100k on the aftermarket for an M3 -- and he won't care. He'll just say no.
Normally I would agree here but on something with such limited numbers I would think it's resale will be pretty decent once the market returns. Also this caliber of car will always have a buyer that is looking for something that's rare and exclusive. I think in years to come this will be worth a pretty penny.

Another thing, if you regard your M3 as worthless come resale then you have too much disposable income. I always check out the resale value for an escape plan once I get bored, I may have the similar bank balance as yourself but I always keep the spending in check. As my father always said, "look out for the pennies (cents) and the pounds (dollars) will look after themselves.
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      11-02-2009, 03:03 PM   #358
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Big letdown.

Invest 20k into performance mods on your current M3 and you're getting the same thing (maybe more).
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      11-02-2009, 03:03 PM   #359
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemans_Blue_M View Post
You would have to order and have this car delivered to a EUROPEAN address.

And I think I know why you asked this question...

If you're planning to buy one of these cars in Europe, then IMPORT it to the UnitedStates...forget about it.

It's never gonna happen...
Once out of production, wouldn't this qualify to be imported under the Show and Display rules? Only 2,500 mi/year but hell, if you wanted one that badly...
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      11-02-2009, 03:17 PM   #360
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seriousm3 View Post
Price really isn't that bad...

Brakes = $5000
Seats = $3000 at least
Wheels = $2500
Engine work = $5000
Suspension = $3000
Bodywork = $1000
Rollbar = $1500

Just to get a package on par with the Gt4 your spending $25,000 on top of the price of a normal M3. Not counting labor and testing costs too.

The tiny production numbers are what bother me, and the fact that once again the US is excluded.
You do realize that 110K Euros at current exchange rates is $165K, don't you?
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      11-02-2009, 03:32 PM   #361
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemans_Blue_M View Post
You would have to order and have this car delivered to a EUROPEAN address.

And I think I know why you asked this question...

If you're planning to buy one of these cars in Europe, then IMPORT it to the UnitedStates...forget about it.

It's never gonna happen...
Damn, why not? The more I read about this the more I don't want it, doesn't seem worth the extra $$$, plus I would have to buy in euros, and that exchange rate is killer for us.
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      11-02-2009, 03:47 PM   #362
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foosh View Post
You do realize that 110K Euros at current exchange rates is $165K, don't you?
So what? the normal m3 is ~66,000 euro's... which means it should cost $98,000. The conversion rates don't transfer. Which is why for instance in some asian or south american countries m3's can cost the equivalent of $200,000.

In all likelyhood based on what BMW does with the normal m3 the Gt4 would be between 90-110 grand. Not that far off from taking a normal $70,000 m3 and putting 25-30k of aftermarket parts into it.
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      11-02-2009, 03:54 PM   #363
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The point is moot, since it will not be offered in the US. If you're in the U.S. and you want to buy one, you'll pay $165K at the current rate. Then, you'll have a heck of time getting it into the country.
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      11-02-2009, 04:03 PM   #364
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Well, I'm quite interested by this new. Perhaps I won't be able to afford the car itself (at this price, I'd rather get a ln X6M, but each to his own) but if BMW motorsport are selling road legal cars then this is quite a change. I wonder how this fits in with the M-division in general.

I'm also a bit miffed by the numbers. 25 per year surely won't make this a viable project?? Isn't that fewed than even the LF-S?
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      11-02-2009, 04:11 PM   #365
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Hmm... and I thought it was confusing when the model numbers did not match the engine size. For example 335 had a 3 litre engine and not 3.5, but what the fuck is this shit?

M3 GT = Ultimate driving machine
5 GT = Ultimate fat ass hatchback

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      11-02-2009, 04:22 PM   #366
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This product will never represent true value for money and if you are simply looking for bang per buck then stick with modifing your the stock model. but if you believe that your modified M3 will be as good a product as this will be then dream on.

If these reactions here from our US member are typical of what most US customers feel then it will probably seal this product fate to stay firmly on European market.
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      11-02-2009, 04:30 PM   #367
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Quote:
Originally Posted by footie View Post
This product will never represent true value for money and if you are simply looking for bang per buck then stick with modifing your the stock model. but if you believe that your modified M3 will be as good a product as this will be then dream on.

If these reactions here from our US member are typical of what most US customers feel then it will probably seal this product fate to stay firmly on European market.
it might not be as good as the M3 GT
but is the M3 Gt as good as a Porsche GT3 or even GT3 RS?
and will it retain its value as much?
i don't think so

there is a reason they are only making 25 a year
i don't think they would sell a lot more
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      11-02-2009, 04:30 PM   #368
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Quote:
Originally Posted by footie View Post
This product will never represent true value for money and if you are simply looking for bang per buck then stick with modifing your the stock model. but if you believe that your modified M3 will be as good a product as this will be then dream on.

If these reactions here from our US member are typical of what most US customers feel then it will probably seal this product fate to stay firmly on European market.
We were fortunate enough in Canada in 1994 to get the Euro spec E36 M3 with the full 286 bhp Euro spec motor,where the US got the special US version with only 240 bhp.They built 44 cars for the Canadian market and they were all special ordered and sold before they arrived.I hope this happens once again for the Canadian market as I will be one of the 1st people to step up and order 1 for myself.I am not interested in having a modded car but a factory built car is what I want.
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      11-02-2009, 04:33 PM   #369
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Antinontoxic View Post
Hmm... and I thought it was confusing when the model numbers did not match the engine size. For example 335 had a 3 litre engine and not 3.5, but what the fuck is this shit?

M3 GT = Ultimate driving machine
5 GT = Ultimate fat ass hatchback

You haven't noticed yet? BMW only has like 3 cars that are still honest to its old naming structure. The z4 3.0i, x3 3.0i, and the 760Li... all the rest are wrong.
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      11-02-2009, 04:55 PM   #370
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I think this is great. Cant wait to see the final product without all the speculation.
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      11-02-2009, 05:17 PM   #371
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kmarei View Post
it might not be as good as the M3 GT
but is the M3 Gt as good as a Porsche GT3 or even GT3 RS?
and will it retain its value as much?
i don't think so

there is a reason they are only making 25 a year
i don't think they would sell a lot more
I don't disagree that to many (including me) would chose a GT3 as no.1 choice before this, but in the long run this car will retain more value then a GT3 will and that is solely down to it's limited supply.

It's not going to be for everyone, most will see it as way over priced but for a collector it's a dream car with probably no more than 50 units worldwide being made and probably only a dozen examples not being used for competition.
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      11-02-2009, 05:31 PM   #372
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big let down. GT3 is still king. all i wanted was just a lightened, simpler version of the current M3. give us less and we pay less. disappointed.
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      11-02-2009, 05:40 PM   #373
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Thank you to savage.ulm1 and the other members that have brought this news. It's a cool car, regardless of whether it's coming to the U.S.
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      11-02-2009, 05:51 PM   #374
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Quote:
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big let down. GT3 is still king. all i wanted was just a lightened, simpler version of the current M3. give us less and we pay less. disappointed.
In case you haven't noticed, that's not the case with the GT3 either.


I'm not saying I would be in the market for a car like this, my budget doesn't go that far. But if I were in it for the right reason (say, if I'd be living near the Nurburgring), then I might prefer this to a GT3.

All too many GT3's crash at the Ring and they are much more difficult cars to master, especially given how fast they are. By comparison, the E46 CSL and this "GT" will be pussycats. (Hiperactive mental murderous pussycats perhaps, but still).


Porsches still scare me.
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