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      08-11-2009, 07:17 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Hyperspaced View Post
I didn't find the SMG to be rough in S mode, but I agree it isn't as smooth as the DCT. It felt like a very fast person who could blip the engine did the shifting. The DCT feels like a computer is doing it, and you can tell that there are two clutches.

I have driven numerous automatic over the years from all the top brands and none are better than the M-DCT regarding smoothness with you pick S1 or S2. I personally don't like the higher modes that include jerk but again that's just me.

The one thing you can definitely say between SMG and DCT is that when in automatic mode the DCT is light year smoother and better at performing the duties as a proper automatic.
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      08-11-2009, 07:21 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by footie View Post
Maybe you forgot that I have owned a M3 with M-DCT for a year now.
Hmm, yes, I must admit I did.

Originally Posted by footie View Post
I would still pick the M3 saloon with M-DCT and EDC every time over an M5.
I agree. But my feeling is that Hyperspaced was very impressed with the M5's plush and roomy interior, which I can understand.
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      08-30-2009, 03:01 AM   #25
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I'd go with the M3 and wait to see how the new M5 turns out.
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      08-30-2009, 05:06 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Hyperspaced View Post
I would have posted this in the M3 v M5 thread, but I see that is closed and this isn't really and M3 v. M5 question: I love both cars and think each has something better than the other.

As some of you know, I have been deciding between an M3 and an M5 for awhile now. This has dragged on because my dealer still cannot actually order my 2010 M3. If they could have done that, I woul just be waiting impatiently.

Last weekend, I poked around the BMW web page and just ran the lease numbers on the M5, thinking it would be much more expensive. Since I already preferred the M3, that would make it easy to exclude. Nope. Probably because of residuals, the price difference is pretty small, like $60/mo. (I am using 2009 M3 numbers, so I could be wrong in this comparison. When they get the leasing info on the 2010 M3, maybe the residuals have gone back up and the money factor will be like the M5s.)

On Saturday, I went and drove both back to back. DCT beats SMG, at least if there are no real DCT problems. The SMG shift takes long enough that you wonder a little if you could do as well with manual (though the SMG does blip the engine automatically, which I can't do, at least not well). I am sure that SMG is far faster than I am actually, but it is not as fast as the DCT. So if I got an M5, I would consider manual, but I understand the manual just isn't great for the M5.

The M5 does not feel as fast as the M3 because of the wheel base. It is faster going straight. I got both cars up to let's just say X speed without effort, so they are both stupid fast for the street. But the M5 felt a lot less like it was moving. This isn't clearly a good thing, but it is amazing. The M5 clearly has more room and more creature comforts. The trunk actually has enough space that even if I put a spare in there, I can still use it.

Cornering, the M3 is just better. And I think it wins on "fun factor." You feel like you are driving more than with the M5.

I guess it comes down to this: Do I want a sedan that is really a sports car and that I will think of as a sports car (M3) or would I prefer a fairly luxurious and relatively spacey sedan that feels a little like a sedan but is much faster than almost every sedan out there (M5)?

This is actually one of the most difficult decisions I have had to make about something that isn't a real "life decision." I probably can't go too wrong here.

I keep thinking that some of you will say that if it is a hard call for me, then I should just get the M5. That is, if I am actually weighing creature comforts against performance, I should get the comfy car. Every time I think that myself, I hear the M3 calling.

Any advice? Thank you

buy both thats what im thinking i like the white M5 go well with my lemans blue M3 and then i nice red ferrari Italia 458 and then im set for life
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      08-30-2009, 11:01 AM   #27
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The M3 you wanted to order, is it a 2dr or 4dr? If it's latter, do you have a big family? If not, stick to the M3. Another important factor is, do you drive a lot of highways? On highways, the M3 is incredible, the M5/6 is just unbelievable, this is speaking from experience because I have both.
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      09-04-2009, 05:55 PM   #28
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SMG was a deal breaker for me. It felt very unpolished.
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      09-05-2009, 07:28 PM   #29
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i say in this case it comes down to look, pick one that you think looks better.
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      09-05-2009, 08:13 PM   #30
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I would get the E92 M3 just because the new M5 is out in 2 years and it will be old because of the new generation taking over while the M3 has til about 2012-2013 before a complete rehaul.
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      09-05-2009, 09:39 PM   #31
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M5 weighs 7.5% more but has 21% more horsepower (clearly, better power/weight ratio). Neither cars are "nimble" cars - they're both a compromise between convenience of a saloon and sporty qualities of a sports car, so while the M3 may be more nimble, relatively speaking, it is not a nimble car. If you want a nimble car then get a Lotus or a Porsche. The reply is often "... but but wait 'till the twistiesl". Yes, if you're on a track. No, not on real roads in public. The M5 will take you to the same (rather unsafe) limits on the public roads in the twisties. No M3 is going to leave you behind on public roads.

You're buying a family car that is also fast, and by the sound of your family situation you're an adult as well, so again... M5.

Have you sat in both cars with a realistic seat setting and then sat in the back, or then had your kids sit in the back? M5 isn't exactly spacious when I did this, so I'm not sure how the M3 will be any better - again, you're a family man.

M5 is at the end of the production cycle which also means there has been more time for the bugs to be worked out. That's why I bought my M3 at the end, in 2006. Early e46M3's had issues, early e60 M5's had issues, and early e92 M3's have issues. It's just the history of the M cars and they're still great overall, but I'd have fewer headaches worrying about an end of cycle M car than a 2nd year of production M car.

And lastly, as far as straight line goes, they're close only in 1st & 2nd gears. 3rd gear on up the M5 walks away. A lot of cars are neck and neck through 2nd gear, especially if the outcome of the race is really determined by who happened to have gotten the better launch.
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      09-05-2009, 10:42 PM   #32
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When I was M shopping between the 3 and the 5 it basically came down to the horrendous gas guzzling nature of the V10. My wife and I like to take impromptou road trips here and there so the sub 200mile range of the M5 is less than ideal. I've eeked out 320miles (was driving fast) on a tank just last week and I doubt you'd get anywhere near that ont he M5. No, I'm not REALLY caring about MPG but what good is a 4 door sedan when you have to stop for gas so much?
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      09-05-2009, 11:09 PM   #33
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M5 for my mind lacks low RPM torque, you need to get it up higher in the rev range to get it moving (and it really starts moving then). M3 DCT is better than the M5 as a daily driver in terms of on tap performance and responsiveness - unfortunately the M3 MT is a bit tall in its gearing from 3rd gear upwards, which contributes to its reputation for lack of torque.

Next M5 will be released 2011/2012 likely as a twin turbo V8 with at least the same power/torque as the X6 M if not better - but for now I'd go with the M3 DCT sedan. Ask me when the next M5 is released and it would probably be the other way.
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