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      06-13-2009, 05:15 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by ISFail View Post
Eh, all MB is doing is stuffing the largest motor they can possibly fit in a car and pawning it off to the automarket. No feel or soul. One exception to this rule however..........CLK63 Black Series! Street legal DTM exotic killer
How do you find the IS-F? I was looking at one before I spotted my M3 coupe but they sold it and couldn't find the spec I wanted.

Careful on the insults there. This has turned into a Merc forum don't ya know
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      06-13-2009, 05:37 PM   #90
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I wasn't. I answered the original question about the E55 merc using facts and figures supplied by Merc themselves. It's an M3 forum no Merc so I feel it's okk to give an honest opinion which I did. If I was lurking on a merc forum I might have worded it more softly but I'm not so there ya go.

I didn't insult Merc owners. I stated things and got insulted for my statements by people that seem to think Merc have some conspiracy out to hide the fact that the E55 has more bhp then they claim. I think that's utter drivel and still do so I said it. I only threw insults back. I didn't start them. In fact it all started very light heatedly until the most recent posts where I was being called ignorant and fanboy etc etc.

I stand by what I said though. Buy what you want to buy and enjoy it. Who gives a shit what someone else thinks about your car? You bought it for reasons and that's all that should matter. However, if you give your opinion you should be prepared to take someone elses opinion on board.

Claiming you know the crank bhp of a car by dynoing is still nonsense. You CANNOT measure crank bhp without putting the engine on a table and dynoing it there directly. That's a fact. Saying that Merc claimed the E55 had 469bhp to sell more of another model is, IN MY OPINION, nonsense. They want to sell one car as much as the next. They're not even the in same market sectors. If they say it has 469 then I believe them. Why wouldn't I? I said that and apparently I'm Uninformed, have destroyed my credibility on here and anyone that has claimed to have out dragged an E55 is lying.

It's still an M3 forum. It's just been hijacked by Merc drivers who only want to hear what they want to hear. Even Merc themselves are lying for God's sake.

So as long as this is an M3 forum I will continue to voice my opinions. I suggest that owners of other makes either accept that or head off back to their own forums.

If you want me to start really insulting another car just mention the CTS
I think you have me confused with somebody else.......
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      06-13-2009, 06:25 PM   #91
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I think you have me confused with somebody else.......
Nope. That was a general you. No you personally. As in "Anybody claiming they can tell".

Not you you. The other you. You know who you is now don't you?
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      06-13-2009, 07:55 PM   #92
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How do you find the IS-F? I was looking at one before I spotted my M3 coupe but they sold it and couldn't find the spec I wanted.
You couldn't find an IS-F? You could have bought a used one for nothing. They are not holding their value. Low miles IS-F are going for low $40k.
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      06-13-2009, 08:05 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by SoreHead View Post
Do you honestly believe that mvagusta is lying? Don't you think the start is going to be as important?? If he got a better start there is every chance he would beat the E55. I quoted facts from Car and Driver but obviously it's only the facts that agree with your idea that count. Nothing I can do about that.
I don't think he is lying, I think he is full of sh*t.

E55 murdering a M3
[u2b]<object width="560" height="340"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/NlAwE_dNAeM&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/NlAwE_dNAeM&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="560" height="340"></embed></object>[/u2b]

Just for fun, a XFR crushing a M3.
[u2b]<object width="560" height="340"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/DSSoOhUWzPA&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/DSSoOhUWzPA&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="560" height="340"></embed></object>[/u2b]
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      06-13-2009, 08:11 PM   #94
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.....
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      06-13-2009, 08:16 PM   #95
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Originally Posted by stickypaws View Post
If you honestly believe this last part of your statement, then what's the point of insulting owners of AMGs? It appears to be a disingenuous way to emphasize your own personal preference in automobiles.

Think about it.
+1 Why can't he just accept that the e55 is faster? Its no insult, both cars a crazy fast already. The E55 is an obvious powerhouse.

And for all you BMW fanboys saying stupid stuff like MB put the biggest engine in a car and put it out on the market-I can probably say that BMW put probably the most dullest looking interiors in the world and mated it to one of the most strangest looking exteriors that now has added a under-engineered 35 engine to their lineup which has constant HPFP problems.

Grow up. Shit, thats the whole reason why they make BMW or MB. Some people like to go around corners fast looking ugly, some people like going fast in a straight line while being pampered and looking nice. Who cares? Its what you like right?

Sorehead...First step is admitting denial.

Taste is purely subjective, of course.
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      06-13-2009, 10:54 PM   #96
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I will say it again, you don't stand a chance against an e55. Live with it. If both are stocks the E55 will sweep the highway with you. I have driven all of them. lol

Last edited by bimmerj; 06-13-2009 at 11:40 PM. Reason: edit:LOL
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      06-13-2009, 11:25 PM   #97
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Originally Posted by SoreHead View Post
Nope. That was a general you. No you personally. As in "Anybody claiming they can tell".

Not you you. The other you. You know who you is now don't you?
What I don't get is that the debate here is about whether or not the E55/E63 can trap better times than the M3. I say yes and the record says yes. And so let's go to the strip (none of this street racing crap) all stock but with DRs only (that equals out tire issues) and record some times. Okay?

But then you start babbling about how shitty a car you think it is. That it's an old man's car with an auto box. WTF? What's your point? That's the part I just don't get. Of course it doesn't handle at all like the M3. It's a big old heavy cruising uber car. That's what it's for. Duh.

You'd rather buy an "old American car" to go in a straight line. Be my guest. I'm sure it will be a comfortable and cushy ride. WTF? You want to drag? Sure, then buy a bloody "old American car for pennies." Guess what? The E55/63 aren't straight line drag cars. They are COMFORT sedans for the freeway/autobahn. Have you ever actually had any seat time in one?

And that's why I have the MB, a Porsche, and a Toyota 4x4 pickup. I don't take my E63 up into the canyons, I take my Porsche. And I take the 4x4 on backpacking trips, camping, and surfing. And as my DD and for road trips I take the E63. And I want an autobox!! I'm not particularly enamored with constantly shifting in LA traffic. And I have the P-car for exercising my left foot.

I thought about a M3, but as an addition. I'd much rather take a long trip in total comfort in the MB than in the M3. However, I stuck with P-cars because I know them well (I'm a PCA member, and do PCA DE's, etc..) But the M3 is a fantastic sports sedan/coupe. And I've owned many BMWs in the past.

The E63 is a super fast autobahn comfort car. That is what it's built for and it's great at what it does.

Why say it's a shitbox compared to the M3? THEY ARE DIFFERENT ANIMALS. Go figure(?)

Sorry you only have one car to choose from. But maybe someday you'll learn that no one car is capable of doing everything. And no car is ever going to be perfect. In the meantime get your thinking cap on straight.
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      06-14-2009, 05:12 AM   #98
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You couldn't find an IS-F? You could have bought a used one for nothing. They are not holding their value. Low miles IS-F are going for low $40k.
I wanted to lease so had to be new. It was the spec I couldn't find. I want black interior with dark grey interior and they could only find white seats. It was timing really. I'm sure I could have found one given time but I found myu dark grey on black M3 coupe and the manual tempted me away.
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      06-14-2009, 05:23 AM   #99
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Why say it's a shitbox compared to the M3? THEY ARE DIFFERENT ANIMALS. Go figure(?)

Sorry you only have one car to choose from. But maybe someday you'll learn that no one car is capable of doing everything. And no car is ever going to be perfect. In the meantime get your thinking cap on straight.
I don't recall calling anything other than the CTS a shitbox on here???
The oldman comments came from me getting pissed off being told I was losing cred etc etc because I was quoting manufacturers figures instead of imaginary figures and because I have better things to do than search fan sites to get information that is obviously going to biased and then reading how people were lying about out dragging a car that according to magazine tests is actually slower up to 100mph and fractions faster at the 1/4.

With the differences tested over multiple runs it's obvious to me that a good launch is what's going to decide a drag between the two and I stated that. That's all I stated and got shot down for it by AMG owners. I say again. This is an M3 forum. Ask a question about an AMG and you can expect to get answers that you might not like. People on here bought an M3 when they could have bought an AMG so most probably prefer the M3.
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      06-14-2009, 07:21 AM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoreHead View Post
I don't recall calling anything other than the CTS a shitbox on here???
The oldman comments came from me getting pissed off being told I was losing cred etc etc because I was quoting manufacturers figures instead of imaginary figures and because I have better things to do than search fan sites to get information that is obviously going to biased and then reading how people were lying about out dragging a car that according to magazine tests is actually slower up to 100mph and fractions faster at the 1/4.

With the differences tested over multiple runs it's obvious to me that a good launch is what's going to decide a drag between the two and I stated that. That's all I stated and got shot down for it by AMG owners. I say again. This is an M3 forum. Ask a question about an AMG and you can expect to get answers that you might not like. People on here bought an M3 when they could have bought an AMG so most probably prefer the M3.
You keep going off topic man. I've read a couple of your posts and you always reflect off the questions to try to answer in a such a general way.

People on here bought an M3 but its not nearly the same price range as a new e55/e63 (that's what this topic is about, right?).

Honestly, What are you trying to prove/disprove? Why can't you figure that the imaginary numbers everyone is talking about can be feasible? I mean, these forum members are talking upon experience. I'm more than certain the threadstarter could have gone through the website within 5 minutes to find quarter mile times and 60 times for both cars. So it is obvious that he's asking people on here what their own personal experiences are..

Jesus, this is such a elementary post. Do you even know what threads are for? This could have been such a short thread maybe a page or two but people like you(since i reply, and now me) prolong these threads with shit that is so damn irrelevant and useless to the topic. So much gunk here.

On topic.. So far.. Bottom line, YES the e55 is faster than the M3.
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      06-14-2009, 10:29 AM   #101
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+1 Why can't he just accept that the e55 is faster? Its no insult, both cars a crazy fast already. The E55 is an obvious powerhouse.

And for all you BMW fanboys saying stupid stuff like MB put the biggest engine in a car and put it out on the market-I can probably say that BMW put probably the most dullest looking interiors in the world and mated it to one of the most strangest looking exteriors that now has added a under-engineered 35 engine to their lineup which has constant HPFP problems.

Grow up. Shit, thats the whole reason why they make BMW or MB. Some people like to go around corners fast looking ugly, some people like going fast in a straight line while being pampered and looking nice. Who cares? Its what you like right?

Sorehead...First step is admitting denial.

Taste is purely subjective, of course.
I can't accept that the E55 is faster because the figures I've found on your american magazines suggest that it's only fractionally faster at 1/4 mile and the M3 is faster to 100mph. With that fact the better launch is going to win.

I also stated the factual manufacturers quoted bhp and was shot down by people who apparently have magic dynos that can measure crank bhp and quote some Merc conspiracy to sell more SL's by pretending the E55 has less bhp while one of the reviews actually states it's a different state of tune.

As for insults. My so called insults are the same as yours about the M3. Difference is we're on an M3 forum. As for exteriors?? Are you insane?? You're suggesting that the M3 is ugly but the E55 isn't a dull 4 door, chrysler clone looking car with one of the most plastic interiors of any lux model? At least my M3 has a strip of real Aluminum in instead of the shiny silver plastic you get. Until recently Merc were coming bottom of the JD Power surveys and are only now dragging themselves out.

As for fanboy. Once again I say I came to Canada with the intention of buying a Z06 then and IS-F and have been a long time hater of BMW in Ireland. Overpriced (M3 is 115k euro Evo X is 60k), under equipped etc. The worst fanboyism (you watch. that'll be in the dictionary by next year ) I've seen on here is people believing a conspiracy to under rate the E55 by Merc and magazines. Anyhoo. I'm off from this thread now. I've said my piece and the thread has been hi-jacked by unbiased AMG drivers so what's the point.

Outta here.

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      06-14-2009, 11:46 AM   #102
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Sorehead (name is perfect, btw): here's an open invite to take a nice vacation in Southern California. You're welcome to come on down here. Drive (or ship) your M3. I'll put you up and you can frolic on the beach. I'll pay for your food and your lodging will be free.

We'll take your M3 to the track and put it up against my E63. I'll arrange to have as many E55s available, too. All stock. I will pay for it. And we can have fun in the sun and trap some times.

What about it? It will settle your doubts once and for all. In addition you'll have a nice vacation.

The OP started this thread. His name is brupaul22. He's from New York. His question was:
Quote:
Anybody driven the older model E class AMG? The E55 not the E63. Just curious as to which one is faster in the quarter mile and off the line
And that is the only question here. The question had nothing to do with "an old man's car" or an "autobox" or a "Chrysler clone." Do you really want an answer to this question? You don't want to accept the facts that already exist, so let's do our own empirical research. It's an open invite.
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      06-14-2009, 03:05 PM   #103
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Originally Posted by SoreHead View Post
I've said my piece and the thread has been hi-jacked by unbiased AMG drivers so what's the point.

Outta here.

p.s., you said it absolutely correctly: "unbiased AMG drivers." There has been no 'jacked thread' here but simply some honest responses to the original question. By people with experience. And, as I have clearly pointed out, yes, I am unbiased when it comes to cars because I know each car has good points and bad points.

No one car is perfect, trust me.

btw, the E63 is $25,000+ over the M3. Most people aren't cross shopping.

Once more: the MB is a fast, large, and comfortable cruising car with a suspension built to cosset your butt. The M3 is a sports sedan built with a much stiffer suspension meant to be tossed into the twisties or spending a day at the track. And both are faster than necessary in real life.

Again, come on down, we'll take my P-car and your M3 for some fun canyon runs and later in the day you can go surfing. I live right near the beach.
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      06-14-2009, 11:16 PM   #104
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E55 should win, assuming all things equal. I'd love to see E55 vs CTS-V. Now THAT would be too close to call ...
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      06-15-2009, 12:08 AM   #105
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I wasn't. I answered the original question about the E55 merc using facts and figures supplied by Merc themselves. It's an M3 forum no Merc so I feel it's okk to give an honest opinion which I did. If I was lurking on a merc forum I might have worded it more softly but I'm not so there ya go.

I didn't insult Merc owners. I stated things and got insulted for my statements by people that seem to think Merc have some conspiracy out to hide the fact that the E55 has more bhp then they claim. I think that's utter drivel and still do so I said it. I only threw insults back. I didn't start them. In fact it all started very light heatedly until the most recent posts where I was being called ignorant and fanboy etc etc.

I stand by what I said though. Buy what you want to buy and enjoy it. Who gives a shit what someone else thinks about your car? You bought it for reasons and that's all that should matter. However, if you give your opinion you should be prepared to take someone elses opinion on board.

Claiming you know the crank bhp of a car by dynoing is still nonsense. You CANNOT measure crank bhp without putting the engine on a table and dynoing it there directly. That's a fact. Saying that Merc claimed the E55 had 469bhp to sell more of another model is, IN MY OPINION, nonsense. They want to sell one car as much as the next. They're not even the in same market sectors. If they say it has 469 then I believe them. Why wouldn't I? I said that and apparently I'm Uninformed, have destroyed my credibility on here and anyone that has claimed to have out dragged an E55 is lying.

It's still an M3 forum. It's just been hijacked by Merc drivers who only want to hear what they want to hear. Even Merc themselves are lying for God's sake.

So as long as this is an M3 forum I will continue to voice my opinions. I suggest that owners of other makes either accept that or head off back to their own forums.

If you want me to start really insulting another car just mention the CTS



How is this forum being hijacked by Merc owners? I have yet to see an "M3 versus Mercedes" started by a Mercedes owner. Or an "M3 versus GTR" started by a GTR owner. I chime in on these threads because I think my personal experience is relevant. If I just wanted to preach to the choir I'd be at a Mercedes forum. I prefer honest debate.
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      06-15-2009, 05:49 AM   #106
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How is this forum being hijacked by Merc owners? I have yet to see an "M3 versus Mercedes" started by a Mercedes owner. Or an "M3 versus GTR" started by a GTR owner. I chime in on these threads because I think my personal experience is relevant. If I just wanted to preach to the choir I'd be at a Mercedes forum. I prefer honest debate.
Here's a question for ya.
How do you find the GTR as a fast (very fast) street car? I'm still considering one and have no interest in track days in my own car anyway. Are there any non-track related issues showing up? Is it only on tracks that the gearbox problems arise?
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      06-15-2009, 10:42 AM   #107
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Sorehead, have you packed your bags yet? Come on down, the weather is great.

You seem so very interested in M3s vs "fill in the blank" and which car is quicker.

Instead of reading magazines and making posts on an internet forum and looking at Youtube all day, why not get out in the real world and see for yourself? I'm such there are facilities in Ontario.

You can see it all in real life instead of sitting in a chair.

p.s., if you have no interest in the track, then why such interest in track times? Is it simply psychological for you? Do you feel better if the car you own is faster even though it's completely meaningless in the real world?
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      06-15-2009, 11:17 AM   #108
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Here's a question for ya.
How do you find the GTR as a fast (very fast) street car? I'm still considering one and have no interest in track days in my own car anyway. Are there any non-track related issues showing up? Is it only on tracks that the gearbox problems arise?
Its a fine street car, not up to German fit and finish standards though.
My friend and I were racing my CLK and my GTR on some car-lessopen country roads.The GTR destroyed the Merc but at high speed (170+) the thing felt like a space capusule re-entrying earths atmosphere. I felt like sheet metal would start peeling away at any moment. While the Merc felt rock solid as it just screamed down the road.
As DD the Nissan is pretty nice. Its all wheel drive is critical for me in snow country. And its cheaper than the CLK (or a 997 Turbo) so im not as concerned about dinging it up in the less than perfect weather in Fargo.
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      06-15-2009, 11:26 AM   #109
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Sorehead, have you packed your bags yet? Come on down, the weather is great.

You seem so very interested in M3s vs "fill in the blank" and which car is quicker.

Instead of reading magazines and making posts on an internet forum and looking at Youtube all day, why not get out in the real world and see for yourself? I'm such there are facilities in Ontario.

You can see it all in real life instead of sitting in a chair.

p.s., if you have no interest in the track, then why such interest in track times? Is it simply psychological for you? Do you feel better if the car you own is faster even though it's completely meaningless in the real world?
My bags are unpacked again. I'm home in Ireland for a bit of a holiday. I needed a break from the bad weather in Canada. 10 Years of lies from my wife about how the weather in Canada was better...... Should be grounds for divorce.

I have no interest in my car being faster than anyone elses. If I did I would have held out for a GTR.

Apparently you AMG drivers are very concerned though. Enough to make up sad stories about merc under quoting the bhp.

My point is that with cars that are so closely matched (IS-F & RS4 included) the chances are that the person to get the best launch is as likely as anyone else to get the better 1/4. I started out just stating what I'd found out about the cars but that didn't sit with the AMG heads on here. So by all means believe your conspiracy stories and you can discuss them while you're out UFO spotting The fact that I keep saying the person who gets the best launch seems clear to me at least that I don't think any one of them is any great amount faster then the others. Lets be honest. In 12 months time all of them will be 100bhp less than the normal cars of the day then. Long live the bhp race.

As for the other VS. The only one I've actually even mentioned the M3 begin quicker was to ISFail about the IS and I was more interested in seeing a review that had found the IS to be quicker as it was my first choice of car over here. That was just interest in seeing an actual article as the IS is in the "whoever gets the best launch" category for me. I didn't buy the M3 because I read it was faster than the IS. I bought it because they had sold the IS I was buying and couldn't match the spec for me in time then while buying an 328xi wagon for my wife I spotted my dark grey coupe and fell in love with it before I drove it.

If I was interested in real world performance then I would have chosen the M3 first as, in the real world, there are corners and no one can deny which of the competitors does that best.
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      06-15-2009, 11:31 AM   #110
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Originally Posted by rapistwit View Post
Its a fine street car, not up to German fit and finish standards though.
My friend and I were racing my CLK and my GTR on some car-lessopen country roads.The GTR destroyed the Merc but at high speed (170+) the thing felt like a space capusule re-entrying earths atmosphere. I felt like sheet metal would start peeling away at any moment. While the Merc felt rock solid as it just screamed down the road.
As DD the Nissan is pretty nice. Its all wheel drive is critical for me in snow country. And its cheaper than the CLK (or a 997 Turbo) so im not as concerned about dinging it up in the less than perfect weather in Fargo.
Hmm. Interesting. Hopefully when my lease is up on the M3 Nissan dealers in Canada will have gotten their heads out of their asses and stopped adding 40k to the list of the thing.

I'll give GM credit there where it's due. When I was looking at both the Z06 and ZR1 I was getting quoted list and was even getting my father in laws GM discount. I was stunned. Nissan as a company need to slap their dealers.
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