BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92)

BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Go Back   M3Post - BMW M3 Forum > M3 (E90 / E92 / E93) > M3 vs....
 
Evolve Automotive
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      06-04-2009, 08:21 AM   #67
SoreHead
Captain
 
SoreHead's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 M3 coupe - Manual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Ontario

Posts: 866
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 E92  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by rapistwit View Post
Mercedes says the E63 has 507 bhp and 465 lb ft of torque while the E55 is rated at 469bhp with 516 lb ft of torque.

The engine change was really a lateral move for Mercedes. They needed a less torquey motor for their 7 speed tranny.
If you check out the Merc site now they are quoting the 2010 E63 at 518bhp. Must have tweaked something for this year. It's getting like the motorbike world with changes every 6 months.
SoreHead is offline   Canada
0
      06-04-2009, 08:23 AM   #68
SoreHead
Captain
 
SoreHead's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 M3 coupe - Manual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Ontario

Posts: 866
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 E92  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by stickypaws View Post
That's right. (great tranny, btw, for this motor)

Sorehead, the E63 is NA and the E55 has a blower. The E63 will pull from the line but the E55 catches up. E63 is 507 (in the USA)
The us site is now quoting 518bhp. Even more for your money

http://www.mbusa.com/mercedes/#/futu...lsE63AMGclass/
SoreHead is offline   Canada
0
      06-04-2009, 08:33 AM   #69
SoreHead
Captain
 
SoreHead's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 M3 coupe - Manual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Ontario

Posts: 866
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 E92  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kev View Post
So.........? You are still quoting wrong figures....... figures that MBUSA's marketing devised to lead people to think that the S55 has power than the E55..........

Have you actually driven the E55 extensively?
Eh....! No. I'm quoting the figures that Merc obviously quotes and is published by 3 different sources in different parts of the world. All say 469bhp.
In fact one even points out that it is not the same output as the SL55 which you claim it is. But you choose to believe some nonsense about them quoting it lower to pretend another model has more power??? Ah bless! It's sad really.

I was just pointing out that it is you that is extremely uninformed (to use your own words) but now we find out that it's just that you're delusional. You'd think you'd know a bit about the car you owned.

I don't need to drive a car to know that quoted figures are normally accurate (some exceptions like GT-R) but you keep telling yourself it had more power if that makes you feel better. If I want to go fast in a straight line I'll buy an old muscle car. At least they look good.

I actually heard somewhere that the M3 really has 700bhp but BMW thought they would get in trouble with their mom if they quoted it. If you don't know that you're just plain dumb.
SoreHead is offline   Canada
0
      06-04-2009, 11:36 AM   #70
rapistwit
Banned
 
Drives: GT-R, Cayenne GTS, GT3 order
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Fargo, ND

Posts: 73
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoreHead View Post
If you check out the Merc site now they are quoting the 2010 E63 at 518bhp. Must have tweaked something for this year. It's getting like the motorbike world with changes every 6 months.

The 2010 model isn't out yet. It is a major overhaul.
Any E63 on the road now is rated at 507bhp.
The 518bhp on the 2010 model is a light upgrade considering Mercedes has always been about big power and BMW is about to push out 550bhp cars, Audi has a 570bhp RS, and Cadillac is at 550+ BHP now.
rapistwit is offline  
0
      06-04-2009, 09:39 PM   #71
mvagusta
Lieutenant
 
Drives: 2008 m3 coup
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: michigan

Posts: 475
iTrader: (1)

I don't know what the problem is.. I raced a E55 AMG. I beat it twice.. I know a friend from a friend that has a silver e 55 amg 2006 or 07. I'll race him this weekend. I'll take his money too.. He raced the same e 55 with Dr's that i beat by two car lengths and he lost by a car to him. So if you guys want to come to Detrtiot and show me a stock e 55 amg from Cali. Come on by.. I know m3's are underestimated..
mvagusta is offline  
0
      06-10-2009, 12:28 AM   #72
itz16v
Lieutenant
 
itz16v's Avatar
 
Drives: 997 Turbo///E63 AMG
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Socal/Ko'Olina

Posts: 479
iTrader: (1)

Send a message via Yahoo to itz16v
Quote:
Originally Posted by mvagusta View Post
I don't know what the problem is.. I raced a E55 AMG. I beat it twice.. I know a friend from a friend that has a silver e 55 amg 2006 or 07. I'll race him this weekend. I'll take his money too.. He raced the same e 55 with Dr's that i beat by two car lengths and he lost by a car to him. So if you guys want to come to Detrtiot and show me a stock e 55 amg from Cali. Come on by.. I know m3's are underestimated..
You have a strong M3. Is your M3 stock or supercharged, a stock e92 m3 vs stock W211 E55 will beat the M3.
itz16v is offline   United_States
0
      06-10-2009, 01:40 AM   #73
Kev
Resident Anesthesiologist
 
Kev's Avatar
 
Drives: VW bug with a misplaced engine
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Seattle, WA

Posts: 8,815
iTrader: (24)

Garage List
Quote:
Originally Posted by SoreHead View Post
Eh....! No. I'm quoting the figures that Merc obviously quotes and is published by 3 different sources in different parts of the world. All say 469bhp.
In fact one even points out that it is not the same output as the SL55 which you claim it is. But you choose to believe some nonsense about them quoting it lower to pretend another model has more power??? Ah bless! It's sad really.

I was just pointing out that it is you that is extremely uninformed (to use your own words) but now we find out that it's just that you're delusional. You'd think you'd know a bit about the car you owned.

I don't need to drive a car to know that quoted figures are normally accurate (some exceptions like GT-R) but you keep telling yourself it had more power if that makes you feel better. If I want to go fast in a straight line I'll buy an old muscle car. At least they look good.

I actually heard somewhere that the M3 really has 700bhp but BMW thought they would get in trouble with their mom if they quoted it. If you don't know that you're just plain dumb.
Explain why my car and other cars have dyno'ed around 500 crank hp then......? I don't think it's luck that we all got a strong E55.......

I'm gonna peace out because ignorance is bliss for you, my friend.
__________________
kev { divinum est sedate dolorem }
Kev is offline   Hong Kong
0
      06-10-2009, 02:38 AM   #74
stickypaws
Dictator
 
stickypaws's Avatar
 
Drives: people crazy
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: where you want to be

Posts: 1,817
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mvagusta View Post
I don't know what the problem is.. I raced a E55 AMG. I beat it twice.. I know a friend from a friend that has a silver e 55 amg 2006 or 07. I'll race him this weekend. I'll take his money too.. He raced the same e 55 with Dr's that i beat by two car lengths and he lost by a car to him. So if you guys want to come to Detrtiot and show me a stock e 55 amg from Cali. Come on by.. I know m3's are underestimated..
Huh? What are you babbling about?
Don't type with your mouth full, it makes it hard to understand you.
stickypaws is offline  
0
      06-10-2009, 12:37 PM   #75
MikeG_C63_AMG
First Lieutenant
 
MikeG_C63_AMG's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 Eurocharged C63 AMG
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Hoboken,NJ

Posts: 378
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mvagusta View Post
I don't know what the problem is.. I raced a E55 AMG. I beat it twice.. I know a friend from a friend that has a silver e 55 amg 2006 or 07. I'll race him this weekend. I'll take his money too.. He raced the same e 55 with Dr's that i beat by two car lengths and he lost by a car to him. So if you guys want to come to Detrtiot and show me a stock e 55 amg from Cali. Come on by.. I know m3's are underestimated..
The only way this story is true is if your run took place on another planet, or in your dreams when you were sleeping. In reality on this planet Earth your scenario only exists if the E55...

1) Has bald tires and spinned all of 1st and 2nd gear.
2) Has mechanical failure example IC Pump Fail.
3) Driver was drastically in the wrong gear from the start of the run.

FAIL
MikeG_C63_AMG is offline  
0
      06-10-2009, 12:39 PM   #76
MikeG_C63_AMG
First Lieutenant
 
MikeG_C63_AMG's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 Eurocharged C63 AMG
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Hoboken,NJ

Posts: 378
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoreHead View Post
Eh....! No. I'm quoting the figures that Merc obviously quotes and is published by 3 different sources in different parts of the world. All say 469bhp.
In fact one even points out that it is not the same output as the SL55 which you claim it is. But you choose to believe some nonsense about them quoting it lower to pretend another model has more power??? Ah bless! It's sad really.

I was just pointing out that it is you that is extremely uninformed (to use your own words) but now we find out that it's just that you're delusional. You'd think you'd know a bit about the car you owned.

I don't need to drive a car to know that quoted figures are normally accurate (some exceptions like GT-R) but you keep telling yourself it had more power if that makes you feel better. If I want to go fast in a straight line I'll buy an old muscle car. At least they look good.

I actually heard somewhere that the M3 really has 700bhp but BMW thought they would get in trouble with their mom if they quoted it. If you don't know that you're just plain dumb.

REALITY CHECK


http://www.mbworld.org/forums/w211-a...ore-after.html

If you care to still accept the truth, I suggest you do a search on that forum on the subject.
MikeG_C63_AMG is offline  
0
      06-10-2009, 05:02 PM   #77
cj350
Second Lieutenant
 
Drives: bmw m3 2009
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Atlanta GA

Posts: 261
iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by itz16v View Post
You have a strong M3. Is your M3 stock or supercharged, a stock e92 m3 vs stock W211 E55 will beat the M3.
+ 1 e 55 will own an m3 any day stock for stock. Lets not even talk about the e63...... Thats a diffrent animal
__________________
2009 COUPE M3 JET BLACK.....MASERATI GRANTURISMO 2009.... 2008 S600 V12.... INFINITI FX35 2009...........
cj350 is offline  
0
      06-10-2009, 05:18 PM   #78
artur777!
Enlisted Member
 
Drives: M3 e92
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Europe

Posts: 37
iTrader: (0)

guys, its simple as our world

m3 dct will be faster from 0 to 200 km/h, after 200 km/h e55 amg will be faster.
in both cars are good drivers. we have made a lot of tests on the track.

m3 dct is faster up to 200 because of gearing, better torque distribution
e55 amg is faster after 200 because of huge torque and gearing that helps in higer speeds (5 vs 7)

DONE.
artur777! is offline  
0
      06-13-2009, 08:39 AM   #79
SoreHead
Captain
 
SoreHead's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 M3 coupe - Manual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Ontario

Posts: 866
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 E92  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kev View Post
Explain why my car and other cars have dyno'ed around 500 crank hp then......? I don't think it's luck that we all got a strong E55.......

I'm gonna peace out because ignorance is bliss for you, my friend.
Explain how you got your car dyno'ed at the crank? And you say I'm ignorant

I think you'll find they can only measure at the wheels. The rest is guesswork. So by all means you tell yourself you had 500 at the crank and enjoy your ignorance.
SoreHead is offline   Canada
0
      06-13-2009, 08:41 AM   #80
SoreHead
Captain
 
SoreHead's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 M3 coupe - Manual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Ontario

Posts: 866
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 E92  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeG_C63_AMG View Post

REALITY CHECK


http://www.mbworld.org/forums/w211-a...ore-after.html

If you care to still accept the truth, I suggest you do a search on that forum on the subject.
Search the completely impartial Merc site? Yeh. Right.
SoreHead is offline   Canada
0
      06-13-2009, 08:43 AM   #81
SoreHead
Captain
 
SoreHead's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 M3 coupe - Manual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Ontario

Posts: 866
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 E92  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeG_C63_AMG View Post
The only way this story is true is if your run took place on another planet, or in your dreams when you were sleeping. In reality on this planet Earth your scenario only exists if the E55...

1) Has bald tires and spinned all of 1st and 2nd gear.
2) Has mechanical failure example IC Pump Fail.
3) Driver was drastically in the wrong gear from the start of the run.

FAIL
Well there's a surprise. You don't believe him? We didn't expect you to. You don't even believe Merc themselves when they say a car has a certain amount of bhp

How could he possibly be telling the truth.
SoreHead is offline   Canada
0
      06-13-2009, 08:45 AM   #82
SoreHead
Captain
 
SoreHead's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 M3 coupe - Manual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Ontario

Posts: 866
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 E92  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by artur777! View Post
guys, its simple as our world

m3 dct will be faster from 0 to 200 km/h, after 200 km/h e55 amg will be faster.
in both cars are good drivers. we have made a lot of tests on the track.

m3 dct is faster up to 200 because of gearing, better torque distribution
e55 amg is faster after 200 because of huge torque and gearing that helps in higer speeds (5 vs 7)

DONE.
Not really. In a drag race the torque is not the relevant figure. It's the bhp, weight and aerodynamics.
Power to weight and slippy will win with equal drivers.
SoreHead is offline   Canada
0
      06-13-2009, 09:46 AM   #83
MikeG_C63_AMG
First Lieutenant
 
MikeG_C63_AMG's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 Eurocharged C63 AMG
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Hoboken,NJ

Posts: 378
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoreHead View Post
Search the completely impartial Merc site? Yeh. Right.
I'm sorry I have to do this.

Impartial? So I take it there is a VAST conspiracy going on at the W211 AMG forums that it runs so deep that people have decided falsify dyno graphs. Congratulations on destroying your own credibility on this forum.
MikeG_C63_AMG is offline  
0
      06-13-2009, 09:53 AM   #84
MikeG_C63_AMG
First Lieutenant
 
MikeG_C63_AMG's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 Eurocharged C63 AMG
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Hoboken,NJ

Posts: 378
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoreHead View Post
Well there's a surprise. You don't believe him? We didn't expect you to. You don't even believe Merc themselves when they say a car has a certain amount of bhp

How could he possibly be telling the truth.
AGAIN you are uninformed on the W211 AMG. Your knowledge on the car is evident of someone who did a few skims of articles on Car And Driver / Motortrend. Have you even driven a W211 E55 AMG? I have. Have you ever thoroughly searched and read multiple threads from actual enthusiast who own the car and report there feedback on performance/problems/modifications. I have. With that being said, the reasons I gave for the E55 allegedly losing are all valid and consistent.
MikeG_C63_AMG is offline  
0
      06-13-2009, 10:59 AM   #85
bimmerj
Lieutenant
 
bimmerj's Avatar
 
Drives: cars
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Canada

Posts: 434
iTrader: (0)

If the E55 was the one with the Kompressor, the only place you will win against it is in your dream.
bimmerj is offline   Canada
0
      06-13-2009, 01:14 PM   #86
SoreHead
Captain
 
SoreHead's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 M3 coupe - Manual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Ontario

Posts: 866
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 E92  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeG_C63_AMG View Post
AGAIN you are uninformed on the W211 AMG. Your knowledge on the car is evident of someone who did a few skims of articles on Car And Driver / Motortrend. Have you even driven a W211 E55 AMG? I have. Have you ever thoroughly searched and read multiple threads from actual enthusiast who own the car and report there feedback on performance/problems/modifications. I have. With that being said, the reasons I gave for the E55 allegedly losing are all valid and consistent.
Actually I didn't do any more than do a quick search and quote bhp figures as quoted by different sources from different countries to demonstrate that the actual bhp figure as quoted by Merc themselves is the same in different areas. Dyno runs DO NOT SHOW CRANK BHP. They can't. That's a fact so quoting crank bhp from dyno runs is nonsense plain and simple. I merely quoted bhp figures from the manufacturer of the car.

My credibility on here should only be affected if I sell my car and not by me quoting facts and figures from another manufacturer. Course I could also go the route of claiming that BMW have a big conspiracy going and the car actually has 900bhp but they don't want to say that because it would steal sales from the M5/M6.

I have no more interest than that to do any research and have no desire to drive an dull looking, old mans car with a big engine and an auto box. If I wanted to go fast in a straight line I'd pay pennies for an old american car and do it. I wouldn't spend merc money. However, I like to go round corners too. If I wanted to drive an auto I'd buy an IS-F which at least looks interesting. There are many cheaper, better looking ways of going fast in a straight line then buying an AMG. Whatever floats your boat though. Buy whatever turns you on and enjoy it as I keep saying. I'll still reserve the right to have my own taste and speak my mind in a discussion. I don't care who likes my choices in cars. I like them and that's what matters. Not like a lot of people on here. Again, it is an M3 site. You will get bias towards M3's. If you wanted to find people that like mercs I would suggest a merc site.

Do you honestly believe that mvagusta is lying? Don't you think the start is going to be as important?? If he got a better start there is every chance he would beat the E55. I quoted facts from Car and Driver but obviously it's only the facts that agree with your idea that count. Nothing I can do about that.

I believe that in most cases the C63 will definitely out drag an M3 but the E55 is too close to say the same thing. I think it's going to be down to driver and launch.

We will just have to agree to disagree and then we'll all be happier

Peace?
SoreHead is offline   Canada
0
      06-13-2009, 04:26 PM   #87
stickypaws
Dictator
 
stickypaws's Avatar
 
Drives: people crazy
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: where you want to be

Posts: 1,817
iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoreHead View Post
I have no more interest than that to do any research and have no desire to drive an dull looking, old mans car with a big engine and an auto box. If I wanted to go fast in a straight line I'd pay pennies for an old american car and do it. I wouldn't spend merc money. However, I like to go round corners too. If I wanted to drive an auto I'd buy an IS-F which at least looks interesting. There are many cheaper, better looking ways of going fast in a straight line then buying an AMG. Whatever floats your boat though. Buy whatever turns you on and enjoy it as I keep saying. I'll still reserve the right to have my own taste and speak my mind in a discussion. I don't care who likes my choices in cars. I like them and that's what matters.
If you honestly believe this last part of your statement, then what's the point of insulting owners of AMGs? It appears to be a disingenuous way to emphasize your own personal preference in automobiles.

Think about it.
stickypaws is offline  
0
      06-13-2009, 05:09 PM   #88
SoreHead
Captain
 
SoreHead's Avatar
 
Drives: 2009 M3 coupe - Manual
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Ontario

Posts: 866
iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2009 E92  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by stickypaws View Post
If you honestly believe this last part of your statement, then what's the point of insulting owners of AMGs? It appears to be a disingenuous way to emphasize your own personal preference in automobiles.

Think about it.
I wasn't. I answered the original question about the E55 merc using facts and figures supplied by Merc themselves. It's an M3 forum no Merc so I feel it's okk to give an honest opinion which I did. If I was lurking on a merc forum I might have worded it more softly but I'm not so there ya go.

I didn't insult Merc owners. I stated things and got insulted for my statements by people that seem to think Merc have some conspiracy out to hide the fact that the E55 has more bhp then they claim. I think that's utter drivel and still do so I said it. I only threw insults back. I didn't start them. In fact it all started very light heatedly until the most recent posts where I was being called ignorant and fanboy etc etc.

I stand by what I said though. Buy what you want to buy and enjoy it. Who gives a shit what someone else thinks about your car? You bought it for reasons and that's all that should matter. However, if you give your opinion you should be prepared to take someone elses opinion on board.

Claiming you know the crank bhp of a car by dynoing is still nonsense. You CANNOT measure crank bhp without putting the engine on a table and dynoing it there directly. That's a fact. Saying that Merc claimed the E55 had 469bhp to sell more of another model is, IN MY OPINION, nonsense. They want to sell one car as much as the next. They're not even the in same market sectors. If they say it has 469 then I believe them. Why wouldn't I? I said that and apparently I'm Uninformed, have destroyed my credibility on here and anyone that has claimed to have out dragged an E55 is lying.

It's still an M3 forum. It's just been hijacked by Merc drivers who only want to hear what they want to hear. Even Merc themselves are lying for God's sake.

So as long as this is an M3 forum I will continue to voice my opinions. I suggest that owners of other makes either accept that or head off back to their own forums.

If you want me to start really insulting another car just mention the CTS
SoreHead is offline   Canada
0
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:04 PM.




m3post
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST