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      05-05-2009, 08:18 PM   #1
CRS_M3
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Camber Settings for Track

I just purchased a new set of Pilot Sport Cup+ for the stock 19 Inch wheels. I intend to track the car and not too sure if I need to set some negative camber in the car for these tires. After adjusting Camber, will it affect Toe? Do I need to do a wheel alignment?

Can I just set negative camber on the car without camber plates? Can this be done easily (DIY) or mechanic? If I need camber plates for front and rear, any recommendations?

Thanx for the help!
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      05-21-2009, 11:45 AM   #2
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there is not much room on the stock setup and to get the PCUPS to work properly you will need to run negative camber.
I think if you're staying with the stock suspension you can use the Dinan top perches to max it out a little bit more. I think you need negative 2-2.2 for those tires
The rear I'm not sure anything is available yet but companies are going to being producing some camber arms You will need to align everything
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      05-21-2009, 05:02 PM   #3
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You can get ~-1.4 out of the stock fronts with the pins pulled.
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      06-03-2009, 12:59 AM   #4
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The dealer said they have to remove my front bumper to line up the lasers for an alignment on my lowered M3. If I take it to another shop is there specs somewhere I can have them set the camber to?
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      06-03-2009, 01:11 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucid View Post
You can get ~-1.4 out of the stock fronts with the pins pulled.
Are you running on the track and on the street with you pins pulled? Does pulling the pins require and alignment?
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      06-04-2009, 10:22 AM   #6
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I could get -1.2 on the front both side without the pins removed. My BMW service refused to remove the pins since " it is not recommended by BMW". I feel some change, mainly because i was running neutral and positive on one side!! as a factory setup. Would like to find an independent shop to pull the pins out and max - camber.
I am not convinced by the Dinan camber plates. An extra -0.5 degree for $500??!!!
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      06-04-2009, 11:53 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by attila View Post
I could get -1.2 on the front both side without the pins removed. My BMW service refused to remove the pins since " it is not recommended by BMW". I feel some change, mainly because i was running neutral and positive on one side!! as a factory setup. Would like to find an independent shop to pull the pins out and max - camber.
I am not convinced by the Dinan camber plates. An extra -0.5 degree for $500??!!!
Removing the pins is fairly simple. You just need to remove the plastic covers that hold the micro filter and then remove the strut braces. I did it a few weeks ago.

Regarding the Dinan camber plates they are only $250, not $500 (unless that was with labor), and they add -0.7 degrees. They are not adjustable (and will slightly raise the cars front ride height, but are a fairly common way to cheaply add negative camber.
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      06-05-2009, 03:18 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swamp2 View Post
Are you running on the track and on the street with you pins pulled? Does pulling the pins require and alignment?
My understanding is that pulling the pins simply provides more "potential" movement. In order to realize that potential, you need to unbolt and slide the mounts, so alignment seems necessary after that is done as that is not exactly a precise operation, but someone should confirm this.
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      06-05-2009, 08:23 AM   #9
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My mistake, I thought Dinan is selling not a pair but a single plate for $250!

I would not pull the pins and adjust the camber without realignment.
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      06-05-2009, 12:27 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucid View Post
My understanding is that pulling the pins simply provides more "potential" movement. In order to realize that potential, you need to unbolt and slide the mounts, so alignment seems necessary after that is done as that is not exactly a precise operation, but someone should confirm this.
I am planning to have my favorite shop tweak my car alignment by maximizing the camber I can get from the stock setup and going zero toe in the front.

The alignment pin in the shock tower support plate needs to be removed to get maximum camber. Just to be clear, this should be doable from within the engine bay by loosening the 3 suspension bolts on each side and pulling the pin out. No need to pull the suspension assembly out. Is this correct?

On a seperate note, I am also planning to have the shop fit my Schroth 4-point harness in the M3. I have the E46 quick fit kit (from my old E46) but Schroth does not make a E90 quick fit kit yet. The plan is to use the E46 kit and use one of the front seats attachment bolts. Hope it works!
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      06-05-2009, 01:55 PM   #11
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The alignment pin in the shock tower support plate needs to be removed to get maximum camber. Just to be clear, this should be doable from within the engine bay by loosening the 3 suspension bolts on each side and pulling the pin out. No need to pull the suspension assembly out. Is this correct?

Yes, that's correct!!
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      06-05-2009, 04:05 PM   #12
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Yes, you should not have to pull the suspension out. You should be able to make the adjustment after loosening the 3 bolts.
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      06-05-2009, 04:54 PM   #13
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Thanks guys!
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      06-05-2009, 06:33 PM   #14
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It's not turning out to be as big of a problem as I thought. If you run higher pressures (40psi back in the paddock), rotate, and flip once, you get reasonable life out of a set of NT01s (4 DE days). The camber curve is much improved on the E90 over the E46. Rear can easily do -2 degrees, which also seems to be fine.
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      06-06-2009, 04:03 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jml View Post
Rear can easily do -2 degrees, which also seems to be fine.
I have -1.75 in the rear, and that proved to be too negative. Both rear tires were hotter on the insides than the rest of the tire (outside and mid sections were even). That's with about 41-42 psi hot on BFGs. I will have that dialed back. I have -1.95 up front with the camber plates, and that worked well with even temps across both front tires.
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      06-06-2009, 09:48 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucid View Post
I have -1.75 in the rear, and that proved to be too negative. Both rear tires were hotter on the insides than the rest of the tire (outside and mid sections were even). That's with about 41-42 psi hot on BFGs. I will have that dialed back. I have -1.95 up front with the camber plates, and that worked well with even temps across both front tires.
Cool. I'm just happy the front does not need -3.5 like the E46. I could probably back off the rear a little, but it seems to be wearing fine. The rear does get a little squirrelly putting power down mid exit to exit...
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      06-20-2009, 07:40 AM   #17
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I just had springs installed and when they set the camber settings during allignment I ended up with -1.2 in front and, if I recall correctly, -1.7 in the rear.
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      06-20-2009, 09:13 AM   #18
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You should bring you car to Redmond Town Center this morning ;-)

http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=274045

Looking forward to checking out your car.
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      06-20-2009, 09:28 AM   #19
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Lucid, are you running this on the street? If I recall correctly, you are not running a square set up on the track. By not being square, does this have any effect?

Quote:
I have -1.75 in the rear, .... I will have that dialed back. I have -1.95 up front with the camber plates, and that worked well with even temps across both front tires.
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      06-20-2009, 09:48 AM   #20
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I asked it in a different thread but more of topic here:

Does anyone running Dinan camber plates with the stock springs?? Is that lift up the front?
Is it worth getting the Dinan springs?? I mean, for the track.
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      06-22-2009, 11:13 AM   #21
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Quote:
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Lucid, are you running this on the street? If I recall correctly, you are not running a square set up on the track. By not being square, does this have any effect?
Yes, this is my DD. And, yes, I have a 265/295 setup. -1.9 camber up front reduced understeer nicely, and the car does rotate more easily. I'm pretty happy with it.

-1.75 rear was too much. I was heating up the inside edges of both tires, and lost some grip, but that might have been a pressure issue. I had that dialed back to -1.4.
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      06-22-2009, 11:14 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lucid View Post
Yes, this is my DD. And, yes, I have a 265/295 setup. -1.9 camber up front reduced understeer nicely, and the car does rotate more easily. I'm pretty happy with it.

-1.75 rear was too much. I was heating up the inside edges of both tires, and lost some grip, but that might have been a pressure issue. I had that dialed back to -1.4.
How bad is the wear on your street tires?
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