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      01-08-2009, 07:52 PM   #23
SupremeDTM
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sorry to hear about this jj, it must be a bad week for m3s..... my motor is toast.
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      01-08-2009, 08:45 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SupremeDTM View Post
sorry to hear about this jj, it must be a bad week for m3s..... my motor is toast.
yeah man, are you going to be covered by warrenty? I'm covered by insurance but ouch my insurance will be sky high now.
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      01-08-2009, 09:21 PM   #25
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i think its one of 2 things
either the PS2 suck, which is not the general agreement
or this car is under-tired
i think with this much power it should have wider rear tires
my Audi A5 with 265hp had 255 rears and 255 fronts
this one with 414 only has 265 in the rear
when i replace my tires i will get 285 back and 255 front
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      01-08-2009, 10:04 PM   #26
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Sorry to hear about the car being totaled, but it is more a matter of driving style I think. It is around mid to upper 30s here at night and mid 40s during the day during winter with lots of rain, and I have come nowhere close to the car losing traction with the PS2. But then again I don't mash the throttle at all during these cold times unless it is dry and I am already rolling on the road from second or third gear...
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      01-08-2009, 10:46 PM   #27
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on your window sticker there is a disclaimer that "summer" tires should not be driven below freezing temps.
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      01-08-2009, 11:03 PM   #28
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I lost the back end once with MDM on and temps at about 38 degrees. I left DSC on after that. And recently I got a set of snows (coincidentally I drive almost exclusively in MDM on my snows).
I've been driving them fairly hard at around 35-45-deg. and don't notice any huge issues. Yes, you need to expect to lose some grip. That's the trade-off with a Extreme Performance Summer tire, but, overall, I think they're the best I've ever had. Just don't try to use them in ANY snow or ice.
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      01-08-2009, 11:06 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kmarei View Post
i think its one of 2 things
either the PS2 suck, which is not the general agreement
or this car is under-tired
i think with this much power it should have wider rear tires
my Audi A5 with 265hp had 255 rears and 255 fronts
this one with 414 only has 265 in the rear
when i replace my tires i will get 285 back and 255 front
Sorry, but 8% wider in the rear won't make much difference. You will have the same contact patch area, which is based on weight, and be more susceptible to hydropaning in wet conditions.
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      01-08-2009, 11:27 PM   #30
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Sorry to hear about the car...

but PS2 not no issue in cold or rain...

Hell, I take my car to the office in Diamond Bar @ Pathfinder Road couple times a week and I am running R-Compound. If I can run R-Compound in 40s, than PS2 is definitely has no problem. I seriously doubt that the tire is an issue in an accident. Unless you turn off traction control and can't control the car, that's another story.
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      01-09-2009, 01:51 AM   #31
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I drive my car in the 30s with PS2s no problems just drive normal its not a race track. Do not drive on Snow and Ice with them. DO NOT shut off DSC while street driving!!!!!!!! That is the most common thing why most M drivers get into an Accident!!!!
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      01-09-2009, 04:45 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrHarris View Post
I had DSC off.. never again when it's cold. No I'm not joking about totaling the M.
I've said this before on the forum, everyone always talks about always driving with DSC off, or MDM on at most. DSC off is just not sensible even when it's very wet out if you wanna drive fast.

I've been at a BMW fahrertraining event on Salzburgring last summer, ridiculous rain and the car with DSC on I could enter almost any turn like a retard (both speed and trajectory) and would get out as fast as the ideal line. That showed me that both that DSC is great when you can't trust the grip and the tires were pretty good at dealing with water.

Sorry again about the M...
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      01-09-2009, 07:25 AM   #33
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I've been running my PS2s all winter so far with zero problems. they definitely have less grip when it's cold out. I would like to buy some winter tires and a set of 18" wheels but don't have the extra cash right now. But The PS2's really aren't a problem unless you're driving like an idiot. You have to be so far above any speed posted speed limit to get them to slide. They don't have much traction for hard acceleration off the line, but again unless you're driving like an idiot of public streets that shouldn't cause an issue either.
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      01-09-2009, 07:55 AM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregW / Oregon View Post
Sorry, but 8% wider in the rear won't make much difference. You will have the same contact patch area, which is based on weight, and be more susceptible to hydropaning in wet conditions.
if it makes no difference then why doesn't the car come with 245 in the back?
would make it better in the rain
and why do the M cars come with wider rubber than the lower end models?
that applies to most brands actually, not just BMW

based on my experience
wider tires = more grip
and wider tires means i can use a lower psi which means bigger contact patch
so instead of 33/35psi i can maybe use 31/33
also more comfortable
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      01-09-2009, 08:40 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J08M3 View Post
I've been running my PS2s all winter so far with zero problems. they definitely have less grip when it's cold out. I would like to buy some winter tires and a set of 18" wheels but don't have the extra cash right now. But The PS2's really aren't a problem unless you're driving like an idiot. You have to be so far above any speed posted speed limit to get them to slide. They don't have much traction for hard acceleration off the line, but again unless you're driving like an idiot of public streets that shouldn't cause an issue either.
+1. I would like a set of winter tires but it a decent set runs about $1500+, money I would rather not spend these days.
I never take my M out when it's icy or snowy--that's the benefit of being in NYC. If it is dry and cold I still run on PS2 but just taking it easy. I haven't even had the tires slip once. Granted, it just doesn't really get that cold in NYC, typically at around the freezing point.
I had a rental car recently and it had all season low-resistance tires on. They slipped and slid like crazy. I would take my PS2 over these low-resistance tires any day, as long as it's not icy or snowy.
I do cringe when I see BMW's with summer tires running around during a snowstorm I almost walked up to these drivers telling them they are on freaking SUMMER tires. I'm not sure if they even knew.
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      01-09-2009, 09:47 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J08M3 View Post
I've been running my PS2s all winter so far with zero problems. they definitely have less grip when it's cold out. I would like to buy some winter tires and a set of 18" wheels but don't have the extra cash right now. But The PS2's really aren't a problem unless you're driving like an idiot. You have to be so far above any speed posted speed limit to get them to slide. They don't have much traction for hard acceleration off the line, but again unless you're driving like an idiot of public streets that shouldn't cause an issue either.
Dude, read my post in this thread. You are asking for trouble. It's not about slip and driving like a maniac. You can drive 25mph and have the back jump out. Keep at it though since you're convinced it's up to driving skills. Keep rolling the dice...
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      01-09-2009, 10:22 AM   #37
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Quote:
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Dude, read my post in this thread. You are asking for trouble. It's not about slip and driving like a maniac. You can drive 25mph and have the back jump out. Keep at it though since you're convinced it's up to driving skills. Keep rolling the dice...
will do

This car is far from having enough power to just have the back bump out without intentionally pushing it, or taking turns far above posted speed limits.
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      01-09-2009, 10:30 AM   #38
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It does get pretty cold in DB at night. I wake up at 4:00am to go to work and i've seen temps at that time between 37-44 lately.

Where did this happen at?
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      01-09-2009, 11:03 AM   #39
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It is now 53 degree in Diamond Bar at 8AM, it was 45 when I got here around 530s AM. I brought M3 to the office today with NT01 still on it, it was a much better ride than my Grand Cherokee Overland yesterday.

Around 6AM, I went out for a coffee at Starbuck in the SuperH Market on Diamond Bar Blvd. While trying HARD to break the traction with DSC off, it was a manageable drift and not snap oversteer like I expected from these tires.

Maybe the road was really slippy and icy on the road that may have caused PS2 to loose its traction. Either way, good luck with the car and be safe and keep the DSC ON..
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      01-09-2009, 11:08 AM   #40
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Quote:
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It does get pretty cold in DB at night. I wake up at 4:00am to go to work and i've seen temps at that time between 37-44 lately.

Where did this happen at?
Wow that is sooooo cold. Try living in the midwest or east coast...they would be happy this time of year with a HIGH of 37!
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      01-09-2009, 11:15 AM   #41
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I've said this before on the forum, everyone always talks about always driving with DSC off, or MDM on at most. DSC off is just not sensible even when it's very wet out if you wanna drive fast.

I've been at a BMW fahrertraining event on Salzburgring last summer, ridiculous rain and the car with DSC on I could enter almost any turn like a retard (both speed and trajectory) and would get out as fast as the ideal line. That showed me that both that DSC is great when you can't trust the grip and the tires were pretty good at dealing with water.

Sorry again about the M...
A bit off topic, but DSC OFF is the only way to drive at the track if you don't want to kill your brakes. Brakes already take a beating, and DSC ON/MDM will use them even more. Driving with it ON or MDM defeats the whole purpose IMO.
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      01-09-2009, 11:34 AM   #42
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A bit off topic, but DSC OFF is the only way to drive at the track if you don't want to kill your brakes. Brakes already take a beating, and DSC ON/MDM will use them even more. Driving with it ON or MDM defeats the whole purpose IMO.
+1

I have tracked my car in the wet with the Ps2's on and the grip was awesome.To use a M3 on track wet or dry with the MDM on in my opinion is a waste of the cars abilities as it so much slower with the MDM engaged.The M3 is a very forgivving car at the limit IMO.

I drove in cooler weather (-5c) and found that the PS2's were no better or worse than other HP tires for grip.Overall the PS2's are a extremly good street tire.
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      01-09-2009, 07:48 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrHarris View Post
I had DSC off.. never again when it's cold. No I'm not joking about totaling the M.
So we should be questioning the skill of the driver, not the capabilities of the tire in the cold

I have almost 10k on my PS2ís and I have driven them in below 30 degree temperatures with no problems whatsoever

I would suggest a BMW Driving School when one comes to your area
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      01-10-2009, 11:31 AM   #44
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on your window sticker there is a disclaimer that "summer" tires should not be driven below freezing temps.
+1

These are summer tires, you would need good all season tires where you at.
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