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      09-03-2008, 08:07 PM   #1
96OCTNE
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Octane Booster?

Has anyone used STP or any brand Octane Booster on their E9X M3? What were the positives/negatives? For only 5 bucks a bottle I'm thinking why not.
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      09-03-2008, 08:27 PM   #2
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Figure out exactly what it is before testing it out.
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      09-03-2008, 09:02 PM   #3
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2011.75 E90 M3  [3.83]
yea, I never bothered messing around with the fuel like that on such an expensive car
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      09-03-2008, 11:01 PM   #4
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It's "Made with Jet Fuel" need I say more? I know about the claims to restore power, hp increase, fuel efficiency, etc. I just wanna know if anyone has tried it. If not, I'll be more than happy to slap some in mine.
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      09-04-2008, 12:38 AM   #5
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If you want a better fuel then go to a local airport and pick up 100 Octane from teh fuel supplier. Its not for regular use unless you have appropriate maps for it.
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      09-04-2008, 09:50 AM   #6
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96OCTNE, please tell us if there are any improvements if you decide to give it a go.


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      09-08-2008, 09:34 AM   #7
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i added a can of Torco Octane booster to half a tank of gas to boost my octane to about 101. I felt a minor improvement of low to mid range torque, thas all. for $25 a bottle, I wouldnt suggest it often.
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      09-09-2008, 02:55 PM   #8
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I'm willing to bet you will find no improvement.
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      09-09-2008, 09:58 PM   #9
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Octane boosters do work, namely the nos octane booster and 104+. However, they may gunk up the plugs if used frequently. It is best to simply fill up with higher octane fuel.
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      09-10-2008, 11:19 AM   #10
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Octane boosters do work, namely the nos octane booster and 104+. However, they may gunk up the plugs if used frequently. It is best to simply fill up with higher octane fuel.
The octane rating of gasoline tells you how much the fuel can be compressed before it spontaneously ignites. When gas ignites by compression rather than because of the spark from the spark plug, it causes knocking in the engine. Knocking can damage an engine, so it is not something you want to have happening. Lower-octane gas (like "regular" 87-octane gasoline) can handle the least amount of compression before igniting.

The compression ratio of your engine determines the octane rating of the gas you must use in the car. One way to increase the horsepower of an engine of a given displacement is to increase its compression ratio. So a "high-performance engine" has a higher compression ratio and requires higher-octane fuel. The advantage of a high compression ratio is that it gives your engine a higher horsepower rating for a given engine weight -- that is what makes the engine "high performance." The disadvantage is that the gasoline for your engine costs more.

The use of a higher octane fuel than required, is a twofold mistake. You are wasting money and can possibly do damage to the engine. Using a higher than require octane rated fuel will not increase performance, clean the engine, or offer any benefits whatsoever. If your engine was designed for 87 octane, then use only 87 octane. If it requires 91 octane, then by all means use 91 octane. The engineers who designed the engine know full well what octane fuel it needs. The octane rating of gasoline determines how much the fuel can be compressed before it spontaneously ignites. That is all it does! (Look in your vehicle's owner's manual for information about the octane requirements of your vehicle).


Now, some people believe that using higher octane fuel will clean out your engine. However, higher-octane fuel contains no more detergent than low-octane fuel. If you feel you need some extra cleaning, there are additives that you can get at the local auto shop, but do not use them too much or it will damage your fuel injectors.
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      09-10-2008, 01:30 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMW-M-Mexico View Post
The octane rating of gasoline tells you how much the fuel can be compressed before it spontaneously ignites. When gas ignites by compression rather than because of the spark from the spark plug, it causes knocking in the engine. Knocking can damage an engine, so it is not something you want to have happening. Lower-octane gas (like "regular" 87-octane gasoline) can handle the least amount of compression before igniting.

The compression ratio of your engine determines the octane rating of the gas you must use in the car. One way to increase the horsepower of an engine of a given displacement is to increase its compression ratio. So a "high-performance engine" has a higher compression ratio and requires higher-octane fuel. The advantage of a high compression ratio is that it gives your engine a higher horsepower rating for a given engine weight -- that is what makes the engine "high performance." The disadvantage is that the gasoline for your engine costs more.

The use of a higher octane fuel than required, is a twofold mistake. You are wasting money and can possibly do damage to the engine. Using a higher than require octane rated fuel will not increase performance, clean the engine, or offer any benefits whatsoever. If your engine was designed for 87 octane, then use only 87 octane. If it requires 91 octane, then by all means use 91 octane. The engineers who designed the engine know full well what octane fuel it needs. The octane rating of gasoline determines how much the fuel can be compressed before it spontaneously ignites. That is all it does! (Look in your vehicle's owner's manual for information about the octane requirements of your vehicle).


Now, some people believe that using higher octane fuel will clean out your engine. However, higher-octane fuel contains no more detergent than low-octane fuel. If you feel you need some extra cleaning, there are additives that you can get at the local auto shop, but do not use them too much or it will damage your fuel injectors.
The motor is 12:1 compression, considering I have piss poor 91 octane available when I filled up with 100 I noticed quite a difference. With higher octane, the engine does not need to retard as much timing. There is a dyno posted with higher octane fuel, our motors like it.
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      09-10-2008, 03:56 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sticky View Post
The motor is 12:1 compression, considering I have piss poor 91 octane available when I filled up with 100 I noticed quite a difference. With higher octane, the engine does not need to retard as much timing. There is a dyno posted with higher octane fuel, our motors like it.
Hmmm! Funny. Where is that dyno? Somehow I doubt that is true. What may happen however is the anti-knock sensor "senses" knock and reduces timing etc... automatically (We now the M3 engine has this sensor). And, for instance, when using lower octane fuel than 93 (that is where the engine is tuned stock), the hp produced will be somewhat less than 414bhp DIN. When the proper fuel is again administered, the engine will not sense knock and will, in time (by no means in a few minutes), return to its regular tune. This may explain why you feel a power increase with improved gas (because somehow shitty gas ended up you your engine) but when using say 104 octane, there is no way the engine can "retune" itself to produce more power than where it is optimized from stock which is 93 octane.
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      09-10-2008, 04:12 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BMW-M-Mexico View Post
Hmmm! Funny. Where is that dyno? Somehow I doubt that is true. What may happen however is the anti-knock sensor "senses" knock and reduces timing etc... automatically (We now the M3 engine has this sensor). And, for instance, when using lower octane fuel than 93 (that is where the engine is tuned stock), the hp produced will be somewhat less than 414bhp DIN. When the proper fuel is again administered, the engine will not sense knock and will, in time (by no means in a few minutes), return to its regular tune. This may explain why you feel a power increase with improved gas (because somehow shitty gas ended up you your engine) but when using say 104 octane, there is no way the engine can "retune" itself to produce more power than where it is optimized from stock which is 93 octane.
Check out PencilGeeks dyno results with 100 octane and 91 octane. He got a decent increase in power.


I don't totally agree with the last part of your post about the car being tuned for 93 and not producing more power after that. Fact is, the jury is still out on that. PencilGeek proved that octane ABOVE 91 is beneficial. The question is how much above 91....Even though he used 100 octane, it is possible that you would realize no gain in hp above 93....but it is impossible to tell at this point as we only have data for 91 and 100. You may be right in that the car is capable of advancing the timing up to what would be required for 93 octane. But without data for octane in incriments of "1" or so, we cannot be quite sure. Personally, I doubt anything much higher than 93 would be of benefit (actually, the higher the octane, the LOWER the specific energy). So anything much higher than the car can accomodate (timing) could actually result in less power than the theoretical max (93 or whatever it may be).

Anybody want to mix some fuel and toluene (accurately) to achieve octane incriments of "1", drain their tank each time, and dyno test each batch to see what's the best octane level to use? lol

93 may be the max.....but we cannot claim that it is at this point in time, unless there is data to support it. Is there data to support it that I did not see?

edit: Side point....even though we may get a 10hp increase, I doubt you are going to feel it.
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      09-10-2008, 04:19 PM   #14
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Quote:
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Check out PencilGeeks dyno results with 100 octane and 91 octane. He got a decent increase in power.

I don't totally agree with the last part of your post about the car being tuned for 93 and not producing more power after that. Fact is, the jury is still out on that. PencilGeek proved that octane ABOVE 91 is beneficial. The question is how much above 91....Even though he used 100 octane, it is possible that you would realize no gain in hp above 93....but it is impossible to tell at this point as we only have data for 91 and 100. You may be right in that the car is capable of advancing the timing up to what would be required for 93 octane. But without data for octane in incriments of "1" or so, we cannot be quite sure. Personally, I doubt anything much higher than 93 would be of benefit (actually, the higher the octane, the LOWER the specific energy). So anything much higher than the car can accomodate (timing) could actually result in less power than the theoretical max (93 or whatever it may be).

Anybody want to mix some fuel and toluene (accurately) to achieve octane incriments of "1", drain their tank each time, and dyno test each batch to see what's the best octane level to use? lol

93 may be the max.....but we cannot claim that it is at this point in time, unless there is data to support it. Is there data to support it that I did not see?
Yep, agreed 100%, some say its 95 octane where it is tuned other tuners that I have spoken to say its 93 but none of these were BMW tuners (they were MB tuners lol ), surely it can't be 100 IMO. But again, agree we don't yet know these things for a fact.
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      09-10-2008, 04:21 PM   #15
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Yeah, realistically, it prolly won't be much higher than 93...agreed.
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      09-10-2008, 04:31 PM   #16
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Quote:
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Yeah, realistically, it prolly won't be much higher than 93...agreed.
Right with you, and +1 on the "feel it". Iīve done 10 even 20 hp mods that I canīt feel a thing. Maybe its just me. Of course, there is a difference when you time it or when you race a car you couldnīt beat before. Wheen you feel a difference, its pretty major in my book.
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      09-10-2008, 04:38 PM   #17
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Stop speculating and fill up with 100
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      09-10-2008, 04:40 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by BMW-M-Mexico View Post
Hmmm! Funny. Where is that dyno? Somehow I doubt that is true. What may happen however is the anti-knock sensor "senses" knock and reduces timing etc... automatically (We now the M3 engine has this sensor). And, for instance, when using lower octane fuel than 93 (that is where the engine is tuned stock), the hp produced will be somewhat less than 414bhp DIN. When the proper fuel is again administered, the engine will not sense knock and will, in time (by no means in a few minutes), return to its regular tune. This may explain why you feel a power increase with improved gas (because somehow shitty gas ended up you your engine) but when using say 104 octane, there is no way the engine can "retune" itself to produce more power than where it is optimized from stock which is 93 octane.
Not sure what there is to doubt, how do you argue with the dyno numbers? I decided to try it myself, made a difference. You got it right and said what I did, the motor does not have to retard timing with higher octane. These ecu's are highly sensitive and adaptable.
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      09-10-2008, 04:53 PM   #19
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Quote:
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Stop speculating and fill up with 100
Haha!! OK will do as soon as I go to the track.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sticky View Post
Not sure what there is to doubt, how do you argue with the dyno numbers? I decided to try it myself, made a difference. You got it right and said what I did, the motor does not have to retard timing with higher octane. These ecu's are highly sensitive and adaptable.
Ok, Ok, sorry my bad!
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      10-10-2008, 03:10 PM   #20
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Question to all who have used octane boosters. I notice that when I use octane booster the "twichyness" of the engine on first use of the day disappears. Has anyone else experienced this?
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      10-10-2008, 03:41 PM   #21
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Guys, we discussed this multiple times. Although the compression ratio is obviously mechanically fixed (there are experimental engines that have variable compression ratio btw), there some kind of margin for adjusting the timing, and if you put in higher octane fuel, to a certain extent, you get some benefit. After a certain point, increasing the octane does not make a difference. We have seen data on the E46 CSL that suggests this.

I also remember seeing one of the British TV programs testing a bunch of off the shelf "octane booster" in a proper engine lab. If I can remember correctly, none of them increased output, and some actually decreased output. I don't remember which products they tested exactly though or what the test engine was.
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      10-10-2008, 03:42 PM   #22
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Quote:
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The use of a higher octane fuel than required, is a twofold mistake. You are wasting money and can possibly do damage to the engine. Using a higher than require octane rated fuel will not increase performance,
As far as I know this is false info. Higher octane will not cause any damage to your engine. It will only cause damage to your wallet. It does have the possibility to improve performance since higher octane fuel burns slower. The slower burn of the fuel is good because it will continue to burn for a longer period during the power stroke of the engine. This is a benefit because power will continue being created during the expansion of the burning gasses for a longer period of time instead of a quick explosion then nothing more for the rest of the power stroke. For best performance you the most complete and slowest burn of the fuel.
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