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      04-02-2008, 12:51 PM   #23
iku
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Originally Posted by gorun View Post
I am sure its more than software, come on...MB wouldnt let this happen
bmw let it happen :P (on the 335i)
so why can't the mb ?
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      04-02-2008, 12:56 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by hakaida442 View Post
just wait til tuners unleash 50+ hp with a chip for the c63
that will be a miracle for a non turbo car. HIGHLY DOUBT IT
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      04-02-2008, 12:57 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iku View Post
bmw let it happen :P (on the 335i)
so why can't the mb ?
because it is NOT TURBO
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      04-02-2008, 01:43 PM   #26
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MB uses almost an identical engine in a very large number of cars. The only real differences are software/tune, intake and exhaust. You will be able to get the C63 to 500 hp easily with these type of changes. It is already putting out this power in other models. 500 hp from 6.3 liters is only about 80 hp/l.
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      04-02-2008, 07:26 PM   #27
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This is correct, the identical 6.2L (called 6.3 by AMG) engine on the new SL63 and some other AMG cars produces well over 510 bhp SAE. Simple reflash, exhaust/headers plus maybe intake mods will get the C63 to well over 500hp!!!!
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      04-03-2008, 11:40 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by brian@ar View Post
I agree. The C63 is going to be a beast with some tuner help. I am waiting to drive one as soon as my local dealer gets there first one. Ya ya I know, I am prob. going to get shot for saying that on this forum but oh well.
The C63 will be a BEAST with some tuner help. But just a beast. I'm not being a fan-boy. My dad has a C63 on order and I have an M3 on order. Both are white. My dad co-owns a franchise of dealerships throughout the continental US. Most of them are Audi, BMW, Mercedes, VW, and Infiniti. I have had the honor to have already driven the new C63 along with a host of many other awesome cars including Veyron, which by the way was like... I still can't put it into words. It's just... WOW.

But anyway the C63 is already quite the beast, it's one of the most tail-happy cars I have ever driven, with the ESP off, burnouts are so easy it's ridiculous, and it doesn't take much at all to go around a corner sideways. Yes, it is very fast in a straight line, or at least it feels like a bit quicker than the M3 6MT, but I think thats due to the 7-Speed SPEEDSHIFT transmission and the tremendous amount of torque that 6.2l V8 produces. But is it almost as fast as an F430, as C&D says it is? The answer is no.

As it has been stated above, the same engine in the AMG lineup is creating 500+hp, so it would be easy to get it to that point, BUT, I truly believe the gold medal would go to the tuning company who made it handle better, and closer in character to that of the M3 sedan, while adding just a tweak of horsepower. THEN it would be a true beast.

It's all in the eye of the beholder however. I have grown up watching F1, and have been Auto-crossing since I was 15. While my dad grew up in the 40s and 50s, and has the finesse of a drunk golfer. So we generally go for two different machines.

Oh by the way, the Benz is loud. A little bit.

Last edited by M3NTAL; 04-03-2008 at 03:06 PM.
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      04-03-2008, 12:18 PM   #29
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M3NTAL, I agree with most of your points. 63 however is definetly faster than the M3 6MT, left my M3 way behind on several occasions http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=126303. Oh and yes, it is "almost" as fast as the 430 and very, very tail happy. A blast to drive!!!
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      04-03-2008, 02:54 PM   #30
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Well, yeah, I know it is quicker than the M3 6MT, but having said that, I don't think C&D's estimate is correct. I've driven alot of fast cars for being the age I am, and it's not as fast as an F430(MT not the F1 SuperFast II gearbox). Is it close? Yeah. But I think it's more than just .2 sec slower. The C&D figure just seems a little overzealous to me. That's what I meant by "almost". I think the M3 would feel faster (and be faster) if it's mediocre torque figure were increased by 30-75%.

The funny things about the C63 is that nobody really expects the car to number 1, sound the way it does, and number 2 perform the way it does (speed wise). It'll wipe the rice filled grin off of an STi driver's face very quickly.

I have quite a bit of respect for Mercedes, my dad has never had anything but an S-Class as a daily driver, and while some still think there may be "quality issues", since Daimler's split with Chrysler, the build quality and feel has gotten quite a bit better, in every model I've driven.

Like I stated, the only thing the C63 needs to completely knock the M3 off it's peg is better handling, less body roll for one, and a more refined way of putting all that power and torque to the ground.

By the way BMW-M-Mexico, you're M3 looks to be specced the same as the one I have on order! Nice! Do you have all the packages? And exactly like you said in the thread you linked, Benz has come a LONG way in the development of the AMG C-Class.

Last edited by M3NTAL; 04-03-2008 at 03:10 PM.
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      04-03-2008, 03:06 PM   #31
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I'm with you M3NTAL!!!! And yes, my M3 has everything there is to order (we really have no options other than fully loaded hear). It is also Euro spec which makes it nice regarding the seats and front bumper etc… Hope you get your car soon and post some pics!!!!

As for Mercs, I personally love them, have owned and own several models and will continue to do so. So do several of my family members. Though we like Bimmers too clearly!! Hahaha!!
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      04-03-2008, 03:35 PM   #32
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I know the difference in the front bumper, but whats the difference in the seats?

You've tastefully modded your car, and I like it. I'm pretty much going to do the same: different wheels, rear diffuser, spring or COs, exhaust, etc.

I'm thinking of the Kreissieg Valvetronic though. I'm already known for being "heard" haha, might as well keep the tradition going!

Thanks!
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      04-03-2008, 03:48 PM   #33
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The bottom part of the seat in the Euro version is different from that on the 335 and is more supportive and sporty.

Kreissieg Vavletornic is amazing!!!!!!!!!!!! I love it but don't trust the guys that sell it, a Bimmerpost talked lots of dirt about them. I'm waiting for the Remus Race Exhaust (Have the sport now). Also order the Gruppe-M intake.
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      04-03-2008, 07:49 PM   #34
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Yeah thats what I've heard. But I think there seems to be a large enough following to where Kreissieg could ship directly in the U.S.

Crap. How come us fat deer hunting oil baron rednecks never get the good stuff (seats)! Hahaha Oh well. I wonder how much that would be to change...

The GruppeM intake sounds great, In my experienced with my forced induction Cooper S, which will be pretty close to as fast as my M3, intakes help alot, but that was a question I was going to raise as to how much they actually do help with the n/a M3. Chip tuning is also something out there, although it doesn't look like there's a viable/reliable source for a tune yet. You're pretty in the know from what I have read about that. I'm sure within the next year or so the a/m parts offerings will just skyrocket for these cars. It's been 6 years since the new MINI has been released and only just now are there some breakthrough parts for the first new gen body-style (02-06). For one, a rotrex supercharger, which makes my car dyno at 313whp. Nobody expects it either. I can't wait for this car to come so I can start making it mine!

Sorry guys didn't mean to
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      04-07-2008, 06:31 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3NTAL View Post
Like I stated, the only thing the C63 needs to completely knock the M3 off it's peg is better handling, less body roll for one, and a more refined way of putting all that power and torque to the ground.
Plus sort the ride! I drove a C63 today and quite frankly couldn't live with it day to day. It really needs an EDC style adjustable suspension plus getting in and out is plain awkward with those big seats.

Yes, lots of lovely big V8 noise but pretty tiring compared with the M3.
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      04-07-2008, 09:11 AM   #36
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Plus sort the ride! I drove a C63 today and quite frankly couldn't live with it day to day. It really needs an EDC style adjustable suspension plus getting in and out is plain awkward with those big seats.

Yes, lots of lovely big V8 noise but pretty tiring compared with the M3.
Wow!!! This is not my impression at all!!!!

Wow!!! This was not my impression of the 63 at all!! Yes, the ride is a bit stiffer than a stock M3, but by no means did I feel itís a GT3!! As for getting in and out of the car, itís the first I hear that its difficult to get into and out. The seats are one of the best things about this car and are far nicer IMO than those on the M3. Donít think I would trade my M3 for the 63, but its close!!! Power is fun, fun, fun!!!!
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      04-07-2008, 03:17 PM   #37
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Wow!!! This is not my impression at all!!!!

Wow!!! This was not my impression of the 63 at all!! Yes, the ride is a bit stiffer than a stock M3, but by no means did I feel itís a GT3!! As for getting in and out of the car, itís the first I hear that its difficult to get into and out. The seats are one of the best things about this car and are far nicer IMO than those on the M3. Donít think I would trade my M3 for the 63, but its close!!! Power is fun, fun, fun!!!!
It's an interesting comparison. I was really looking forward to trying the Merc and maybe expected too much. My current car is a W203 C200K which I've had for 5 years. The C63 really felt like that car with a stonking great V8 shoved in the front, stiff springs and pretend racing seats. All good on the track but no good for every day.

The M3 by comparison felt like my old Alfa GTV6 (which I loved and did 100,000km plus did some club racing in over several years) but properly sorted and developed 1-2 levels up. A car to enjoy every time you get into it. Easy choice.
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      04-07-2008, 03:55 PM   #38
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It's an interesting comparison. I was really looking forward to trying the Merc and maybe expected too much. My current car is a W203 C200K which I've had for 5 years. The C63 really felt like that car with a stonking great V8 shoved in the front, stiff springs and pretend racing seats. All good on the track but no good for every day.

The M3 by comparison felt like my old Alfa GTV6 (which I loved and did 100,000km plus did some club racing in over several years) but properly sorted and developed 1-2 levels up. A car to enjoy every time you get into it. Easy choice.
Yes I suppose I agree with most of your points, C63 does have a huge 6.2L V8 stuck into its front and is not as well balanced as the M3. Iíve also owned several Mercedes including C Classes (and still own an AMG) and the new C is a bit more oriented toward luxury than sport (albeit an all around improved suspension for both purposes). At the end of the day I chose the M over the C but not by a long shot at all. Since I already own an AMG I thought I might change a bit and am pleased with the M3. Still love the seats on the 63 though!!! Hahahaha!!!!
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      04-10-2008, 07:02 AM   #39
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beastly. those merc's sure do haul some ass and they sound beautiful too.
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